Pancake Rock/Carveacre Trail CLOSED (1 Viewer)

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

Mac33

Mac33

Joined
May 8, 2014
Threads
15
Messages
114
Location
San Diego CA
Just wanted to give a heads up that Pancake Rock is closed,

Not sure why but went up there last weekend and the gate was locked
 
Last edited:
It's been closed for quite a while, but you can see where some really capable vehicles may be going around the gate...
 
When did it close? Why?
 
Has anyone been up this way lately to see if the gate is still locked or know if it's a permanent thing?
 
Is this permanent?

As of 5/21/16

IMAG0666.jpg


IMAG0667.jpg
 
Well, it looks like they addressed the issue of people going up the slope instead of through the gate. I'll confess I was one of those people :D:D
That rail up the side of the slope must be pretty darn new, I was up there a few months ago and it wasn't there. I can try to find out why it's closed and whether it's permanent. Does anybody know who's in charge of that area? Is that BLM land?
 
Well, then it's likely Forest Service land. I'll start poking around and post up what I find out (if I can find out anything :meh:)
 
Ok, so here's the story:
I spoke with a gal at the Forest Service Descanso district, and the short version is that it's closed, it's gonna stay that way permanently, and that's the bottom line, 'cause Stone Cold said so.

Long version:
There's more than one entrance with gates, at least three. One is on private land, and the owner can do whatever they feel like doing. The second is on Japatul Rd, and the third is on Lyons Valley Rd. she was pretty sure that the one on Japatul Valley Rd is the one that's theirs, and that's saying closed because of "sensitive species", blah, blah, etc. The other one (on Lyons Valley Rd) is the one shown in the pictures above. She feels that this is the one that isn't theirs (although I suspect that she has it backwards). She wasn't sure whether it belongs to the county or somebody else, but she asserted that it's staying closed as well (and I have no reason to doubt her).

So... Pancake Rock wheelin' has officially gone the way of the dinosaur :zilla:.

.....Unless, that is, somebody works out a deal with the private landowner (whoever that is). Perhaps this is whence the rumor came about it being open to a local 4x4 club? Maybe they worked out a deal with the private landowner?

Mac33- where did you hear that?
 
4runnerd thanks for putting in the time to make the call

I went to Corral Canyon with a friend two weekends ago and he saying that a san diego club had a trip going there that same day. they had apparently posted it on their website, i'll see if I can track it down

If you google earth the trail you can see all three entrances the one on the NW looks like it's on private property I'll grab a screen shot in a minute
 
That gate/entrance is on the east side of the mountain, road is labeled Japatul Lyons Valley Rd. The road from there up to the top and a ways past is Forest Service land and designated as a county unmaintained road. From the peak there are two branches that both end on private property. The one going North exits on Japutal Valley Rd and the one going West exits on Skyline Truck Trail.

I remember there was an issue with the property owner at the North entrance/exit getting upset with vehicles access his property and soon after a gate was installed.

Still, the entrance on Japatul Lyons Valley Road, up to the peak and a ways after is on Forest Service land and should REMAIN OPEN. Sensitive species BS. We should fight this closure. Has anyone contacted any of the local 4WD clubs?
 
I had heard some time ago it was owned by the City of San Diego Public Works Department and was closed because of abuse (graffiti, trash, new trail cuts, videos of people on line abusing the trail etc. that set them off for liability reasons) Some have attempted official channels through Council members to no avail from rumors. The idiots abusing trails and posting stupid things on line are what get attention that agencies don't want.
 
Yea, it's always the idiots who ruin everything for the rest of us. From the way that the gal at the Forest Service sounded, it seemed like she had fielded a call or two about it before; I got the sense that some of the previous callers hadn't been as courteous as I was.

That "sensitive species" stuff is a bunch of poo; a catch-all for land management folks when they want to do something they might not be able to do otherwise.

The thing is that I can sympathize with the Forest Aervice
 
...and the private landowner as well. You get a bunch of drunk idiots out there and see what happens: they destroy the terrain and roads, smash bottles everywhere and leave garbage, and spray graffiti? And then there's the potential for somebody to accidentally start a fire (not that difficult out there) or to bring a gun to go "plinking" and accidentally hurt someone (and don't get me wrong- I like guns. In responsible hands, that is). Huge liability for the government. And the private landowner...? Hell, I'd have put up a gate against that douchebaggery if I were them.

Can't say I blame them, really. And remember, I admit to being one of the ones who went over the embankment (although many people had clearly done it before I did). In my defense, I did nothing more than bypass what I consider to be an illegal closure of public lands:flipoff2:, but I'm sure that they don't see it that way. And the bypass of the gate had the exact result that I expected the moment that I saw it: an extended barrier (a very extended one, at that).

A true legal challenge would penetrate the "sensitive species" stuff, but it would take a lot of time, effort, and money. Based on my experience (which is admittedly not encyclopedic), the executive branch of the government doesn't tend to back down when confronted I such a manner; they dig in. Since the government has more resources, they have the advantage in these situations. Thus, the way to handle the legal challenge would be to make it a class-action type of case, bringing in multiple plaintiffs in similar circumstances, affected by the same defendant (i.e. The Forest Service, BLM, SD County, etc.), and illustrate the unconstitutionality of their ongoing actions. A big, big fight that would likely lead to appeals, potentially reaching the Supreme Court. Don't laugh- it happens. That's the way that many of our most contentious laws get created and changed.

By the time it got through litigation, I'd probably be more concerned with not breaking a hip going down on the stairs. I just want to get outside with the kids and enjoy it. The most likelyway of accomplishing that with respect to Pancake Rock would be to (quietly) speak to people in the various clubs and find out what they know. The great thing about the area being "closed to vehicular traffic" because of "sensitive species" is that a registered club could (again, quietly) apply for a special-use permit, taking the liability off of the government and providing the assurance of responsible use.

Any thoughts, suggestions?
 
I've enjoyed that trail since the early 2000s... It bums me out that it's closed. Luckily though, you're still able to hike & bike it! It can still be enjoyed.

To be honest, the last few times I was out there, it was pretty busy. In about 10 years of going there, I maybe encountered 5 trucks per year tops. The last couple times I went, there were giant Jeep and/or Toyota runs. It just seems like the place was getting overrun and to me, a little dangerous with that many people on a narrow 2-way trail along a steep dropoff.

Not gonna lie either... I feel a lot of it comes down to internet and forums that blow these spots up. Sometimes you gotta question yourself about posting pics and directions to some places that are special to you.
 
The trail is one of the planned decommissioning trails on the US Forestry list. Several Off-road coalitions have been speaking with the USFS and to engage a possible alternative for limited off road access. page 76 on this PDF lists the feedback from avid off roaders on the value of the trail.
I am currently digging for more info and if there are any forward positive movement on this trail.https://www.fs.usda.gov/nfs/11558/www/nepa/98171_FSPLT3_3081962.pdf
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)

Share this page

Back
Top Bottom