Oil Question 5W-30?

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ERG80

ERG80

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The FSM recommends 5W-30 oil and that is what NAPA recommended using in my Cruiser. Is it too thin for a 1fzfe with 122,000 miles? Seems like the FAQ is leaning toward a thicker oil like 0W-40. Is that simply because of the miles?
Thanks


Engine oil
Dry fill 8.0 liters (8.5 US qts, 7.0 Imp. qts)
Drain and refill w/ Oil filter change 7.4 liters (7.8 US qts, 6.5 Imp. qts)
w/o Oil filter change 6.9 liters (7.3 US qts, 6.1 Imp qts)
API grade SH, Energy-Conserving II multigrade
engine oil or ILSAC multigrade engine oil and
recommended viscosity oil, with SAE 5W-30 being
preferred engine oil
 
It is because the factory recommended weight appears to be driven by fleet fuel economy standards rather than wear. What happens is the EPA requires that manufactures recommend/spec the same oil in the manual as they test with for fuel economy. Overseas the recommendations are for heavier oils.

From the used oil analysis that have been run, this engine seems to perform best with a light to mid 40 weight oil. Note however that this engine is very easy on oil and 30 weights work fine, just not as optimally as a good 40 weight (we are splitting hairs here).

As you surmised, it is also not a bad idea to use a slightly heavier oil as engines wear to maintain oil pressure and minimize engine wear.
 
Thats what i was looking for. Thank you.

And nice sig line. :)

cary said:
It is because the factory recommended weight appears to be driven by fleet fuel economy standards rather than wear. What happens is the EPA requires that manufactures recommend/spec the same oil in the manual as they test with for fuel economy. Overseas the recommendations are for heavier oils.

From the used oil analysis that have been run, this engine seems to perform best with a light to mid 40 weight oil. Note however that this engine is very easy on oil and 30 weights work fine, just not as optimally as a good 40 weight (we are splitting hairs here).

As you surmised, it is also not a bad idea to use a slightly heavier oil as engines wear to maintain oil pressure and minimize engine wear.
Click to expand...
 
cary said:
light to mid 40 weight oil. Note however that this engine is very easy on oil and 30 weights work fine, just not as optimally as a good 40 weight
Click to expand...

Does light to mid 40 weight mean 0w40 to 5w40? (I don't know diddly about oil). Does this statement hold true for colder climates?
Thanks
 
ERG - Toyota recommends 5w-30 oil on their newer models but only 5 years ago and prior, it was a 10w30. We carry bulk 5w30 but I buy 10W-30 for my 1zfe. I believe it was the recommended oil in 96 and I feel better about it. I feel 5w -30 is too thin for the older models esp w/ mileage on them. Made fo the closer tolerances of very recent engines and to increase fuel economy (as mentioned) and reduce sludge buildup...mt .02 cents worth...

:bounce:
 
murf said:
ERG - Toyota recommends 5w-30 oil on their newer models but only 5 years ago and prior, it was a 10w30.
Click to expand...

I have a user manual for a 1996 landcruiser and it recommends 5-30. That was eleven years ago...

I just bought a 205k mile 1994 wagon a few weeks ago. I changed the oil to walmart super tech 5-30 non-synthetic and it seems to have good oil pressure and run fine. I'll wait for a couple of changes and send some oil into blackstone for analysis. I'll bet it is just fine especially for 3k mile change intervals.
 
What makes you prefer non-synthetic?

kwikrnu said:
I have a user manual for a 1996 landcruiser and it recommends 5-30. That was eleven years ago...

I just bought a 205k mile 1994 wagon a few weeks ago. I changed the oil to walmart super tech 5-30 non-synthetic and it seems to have good oil pressure and run fine. I'll wait for a couple of changes and send some oil into blackstone for analysis. I'll bet it is just fine especially for 3k mile change intervals.
Click to expand...
 
Oil Grade Comparison

I am still learning about Land Cruisers, so I am lurking and learning before I replace my '95 Range Rover. I know more about oil(s). Mobil1 0w-40 and 5w-30 are very similar when you look at them on Mobil's website. Better pour point is on obviously on 0 weight, but as temp rises the 40 is obviously thicker. I run each of these grades, one in my wifes car and the other in mine. The -65 F pour point on the 0 weight is impressive.
 
The “for everybody else but USA” Toyota recommended oil chart;

AU viscosity chart
1fzfe motor
20w50 oil- -7 deg to 38 plus ; 19 f to 100 f
15w40 oil -10 deg to 38 plus; 14 f to 100 f
10w30 oil -18 to +38 deg; 0 f;to;100 f
5w30 -30 to 8 deg celcius ; -22 f to 46 f
 
Tools R Us said:
The “for everybody else but USA” Toyota recommended oil chart;

AU viscosity chart
1fzfe motor
20w50 oil- -7 deg to 38 plus ; 19 f to 100 f
15w40 oil -10 deg to 38 plus; 14 f to 100 f
10w30 oil -18 to +38 deg; 0 f;to;100 f
5w30 -30 to 8 deg celcius ; -22 f to 46 f
Click to expand...

I have over a 110 degree variance in min and max annual temps where I live - I'm running 5W-40 Rotella T Syn with no consumption. My 1ZFE was eating Mobile 1.
 
10w-30 does it's job for me. The guy at the auto parts store recommended 20w-50 cause I've almost got 200k miles but I asked Mr. Mudrak and he said to use 10w-30.


And it does it's job perfect.
 
96r50 said:
Does light to mid 40 weight mean 0w40 to 5w40? (I don't know diddly about oil). Does this statement hold true for colder climates?
Thanks
Click to expand...

murf said:
ERG - Toyota recommends 5w-30 oil on their newer models but only 5 years ago and prior, it was a 10w30. We carry bulk 5w30 but I buy 10W-30 for my 1zfe. I believe it was the recommended oil in 96 and I feel better about it. I feel 5w -30 is too thin for the older models esp w/ mileage on them. Made fo the closer tolerances of very recent engines and to increase fuel economy (as mentioned) and reduce sludge buildup...mt .02 cents worth...

:bounce:
Click to expand...

Argh!!!! We go through this about every 2 weeks.

The first number in an oil weight refers to the cold temperature pumping test the oil has passed. The lower the first number the lower temp pumping test that has passed.

The second number refers to the thickness of the oil at 100c. 30 weight oils are about 9.5-12.5cst @100c, 40 weight 12.6 to 17.5, and 50 weight 17.5 to 22 or so.

There is no relationship between the two numbers.

When we refer to a "light" 40 weight oil, we mean an oil like Mobil 1 0w-40 that is about 14cst @ 100c. The sweet spot for most cars on oil appears to be the heavy 30 weight oils/light 40 weight oils that meet ACEA A3. These oils minimize wear while maintaining reasonable pumping losses.
 
Forgive me, if this question has been answered before, but I too seem to burn through a lot of Mobil 1 10w-30 and I only have about 90K miles. In other posts, this seems to be common with this brand and this weight with the 1FZ. But the same engine will not consume as much, if any, on a different brand or weight.

Can anyone explain why? I did a search, but there's just SO MANY oil threads, it's hard to wade through it all. I'm assuming the problem with the Mobil 1 in any 30 weight is Mobil apparently uses a lighter 30 than others? I got that from one of Cary's posts.
 
Last edited:
cary said:
Argh!!!! We go through this about every 2 weeks.

The first number in an oil weight refers to the cold temperature pumping test the oil has passed. The lower the first number the lower temp pumping test that has passed.

The second number refers to the thickness of the oil at 100c. 30 weight oils are about 9.5-12.5cst @100c, 40 weight 12.6 to 17.5, and 50 weight 17.5 to 22 or so.

There is no relationship between the two numbers.

When we refer to a "light" 40 weight oil, we mean an oil like Mobil 1 0w-40 that is about 14cst @ 100c. The sweet spot for most cars on oil appears to be the heavy 30 weight oils/light 40 weight oils that meet ACEA A3. These oils minimize wear while maintaining reasonable pumping losses.
Click to expand...


...If we didn't regularly revisit this topic, how would spread your wisdom, Cary?
:beer:

Speaking to the multi-vis stuff, if the cold and hot numbers are totally unrelated, wouldn't we want to use the oil with the widest viscosity range--limited by the optimal high-temp viscosity?

In other words, if 5w-30 and 10w-30 perform identically at 100C, wouldn't the 5w-30--or even 0w-30 (if such an oil exists)--be the way to go, simply because of better performance at lower temperatures?

What is lost in a wider viscosity range oil vs. a narrower range?


Hayes
 
Nay said:
I'm running 5W-40 Rotella T Syn with no consumption. My 1ZFE was eating Mobile 1.
Click to expand...

Same here. I epoxied my floor because all my vehicles dripped Mobil 1. The Rotella doesn't seem to drip or burn as much. Except my daughter's cursed A4, makes the Exxon Valdez look like a minor spill.
 
Brian894X4 said:
Forgive me, if this question has been answered before, but I too seem to burn through a lot of Mobil 1 10w-30 and I only have about 90K miles. In other posts, this seems to be common with this brand and this weight with the 1FZ. But the same engine will not consume as much, if any, on a different brand or weight.

Can anyone explain why? I did a search, but there's just SO MANY oil threads, it's hard to wade through it all. I'm assuming the problem with the Mobil 1 in any 30 weight is Mobil apparently uses a lighter 30 than others? I got that from one of Cary's posts.
Click to expand...

I have never been able to find a good explanation of why this occurs. There are arguments about volatility, evaporation, etc, but no actual hard data.

What we do know is that for vehicles that burn oil under loads, the Rotella 5w-40 and Mobil 1 5w-40 seem to stop it.
 
That is a great question! The answer is that "technology" allows for creation of wider temperature range oils. So a few years ago 0W30 didn't exist. Now it exists in ONLY synthetics. There is nothing wrong in using a wide temp oil all the time...just that it MIGHT BE more expensive because they are newer and require more technology to design and make.

Hayes said:
...If we didn't regularly revisit this topic, how would spread your wisdom, Cary?
:beer:

Speaking to the multi-vis stuff, if the cold and hot numbers are totally unrelated, wouldn't we want to use the oil with the widest viscosity range--limited by the optimal high-temp viscosity?

In other words, if 5w-30 and 10w-30 perform identically at 100C, wouldn't the 5w-30--or even 0w-30 (if such an oil exists)--be the way to go, simply because of better performance at lower temperatures?

What is lost in a wider viscosity range oil vs. a narrower range?


Hayes
Click to expand...
 
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