Oil or Gas Additives

[Grouseman]

What additives do you use on your Cruiser? I used Marvel Mystery Oil recently in the gas, and saw a drop in my rpms at a certain speed. Used it in my 4-Runner. At 70 mph my rpms were 3100, then put in the additive and the rpms dropped at the same speed to 2900 rpms. It seems that there is less friction in the motor with the additive. Any thoughts?

Steve

 

[Riley]

saw a drop in my rpms at a certain speed. Used it in my 4-Runner. At 70 mph my rpms were 3100, then put in the additive and the rpms dropped at the same speed to 2900 rpms

Your joking right?

 

[Darwood]

So an additive in the gas affected the torque converter? I like that.

 

[Scamper]

So...you've been drinking it?

Seriously, there is nothing that can add to your gas or oil to lower your RPM and give you the same speed--just ain't going to happen. Physics dictates this.

 

[MoJ]

Uphill & downhill?

 

[Grouseman]

Oil Additive

Hey I tried it and got those results. Is it not possible with additives to reduce friction, therefore you need less rpms to push the truck?

SS

 

[Pskhaat]

This could be partially true but only for rare cases and only during acceleration, atop that, only if you were reducing friction AFTER the torque converter, not on the driving end of it, and only so infintesibly small you may not note it.

There are fluid coupled trannies where this (again) would be very unnoticable but possible, but your 4Skinner has a geared tranny. The torque converter behaves differently at varying temperatures under load, could this be the cause?

 

[Scamper]

Hey I tried it and got those results. Is it not possible with additives to reduce friction, therefore you need less rpms to push the truck?

SS

Additives can indeed reduce friction and make the engine run better and slightly more efficient. But your initial post said you saw an RPM drop at 70MPH. Well, at 70, your tranny is locked up in overdrive (i.e., there's no slippage), so the rate at which your wheels spin is directly related to the rate your engine is turning; if your engine is turning slower, then you're going slower.

Even if you were not in OD, then you'd have to explain to me how adding something to the gas is going to affect the way your torque converter works. Not to mention that at 70 mph without having OD engaged, your engine would be screaming down the road.

 

[Grouseman]

Scamper,

Sorry I wasn't clear. When driving at 70 m.p.h. on level roads the tach is at 3100 rpm. Then after putting an additive in, driving at 70 m.p.h. on level roads the tach is at 2900 rpm. From what you and others have said this is not possible. Maybe I am dreaming. I will do some more tests. I will need to run this tank of gas out first. Will report back.

SS

 

[e9999]

hmmm....
a couple of points:
First: putting an additive in the gas wouldn't do anything as far as "friction" in the engine. (An oil additive on the other hand could.)
Second: in principle, looking at things from a black box thermodynamics point of view, changing the gas could in principle result in more power generated so that could in principle lead to a reduction of needed engine rpm for a given power output. The problem that folks are referring to, is of course, that there is an issue of mechanical linkage involved and that engine rpm is related to truck speed so there is another constraint there.
n principle with a hydraulic coupling such as in the case normally in a torque converter, it is in possible that there would slippage and some variation would be possible. Very unlikely though.

Overall I guess it is much more likely that what you observed -if the rpms etc are correct- is some sort of effect due to the converter locking up or not, which could easily account for 200 rpm.

 

[Grouseman]

Snake Oil?

I Wish this article would post up here. Good Read.


http://davesgoldwing.com/MMO_The_Real_Story.htm

SS

 

[Scamper]

Pretty nice that he's getting a 10% improvement in milage. That doesn't cause me any headache though. MMO has a lot of solvent in it, so it's quite likely that it just cleaned out his fuel system, and maybe even removed some varnish from other areas (rings, valves, etc).

When I was much younger, we used to use MMO in the oil. We'd drop about a pint in a little while before changing out the oil, the idea being that it would loosen up all the crud that was stuck in the engine. Oil did alaways come out looking like crap the first several times you did this. So...I think MMO does something, but I'm not real sure just what. I don't think it hurts anyway.

 

[Gauge]

I thought the Cruisers had a lock up torque converter. If so, the engine RPM would always be the same at a given speed regardless of the fuel or oil you used.

 

[Grouseman]

Scamper,

I think the MMO just cleans very well, which in turns makes everything work more efficiently. I think we can both agree on that. Cleaning and better lubrication are its claim to fame.

SS

 

[concretejungle]

I was told by an "old timer" that MMO was first developed to be run through the alaskan pipline to help keep the pipline from freezing. Is this true?

 

[NMuzj100]

IMHO Cleaning and Lubricating are two different and opposite functions. If the MMO is capable of breaking down the crud it is probably breaking down the lubricating oil also. As a crank case cleaner (engine flush) on a neglected engine or one with known deposit problems (Toyota V6s) I could see some value but I would prefer to to use a product designed specifically for that use. All the engine flushes recommend adding flush, running engine at idle (no driving), draining and then relubing with new oil. They make those recommendations because the engine flush destroys the oil's lubricating ability.

MMO is mostly kerosene (If I remember correctly.). Modern gas (In the US) is almost always clean and has plenty of additives for cleaning and lubrication. I don't think additives are likely to be worth the money. And if I were inclined to add something to the gas and something to the oil it sure wouldn't be the same product.

 

[Scamper]

I was told by an "old timer" that MMO was first developed to be run through the alaskan pipline to help keep the pipline from freezing. Is this true?

That would be a real trick if true. MMO existed long before the pipleline was built. But it's a good gory nonetheless

I agree in general with NmusJ100 that MMO is mostly solvent and my actualy do more harm than good, but who the heck knows for sure....It can definitesly clean out the 'ol crankcaes.

 

[Grouseman]

Scamp,

Is that a 13' or 16' Scamp? Man those and the Castias are really nice. As soon as I pick up my first Cruiser, then I will find a Scamp or Casita and will be set.

SS

 

[Scamper]

I have a 16; I think the avitar is a 16 too, but it's not a picture of my Scamp---just one I ripped off of their site. But it is the spitting image of mine.