Mark's Adapter Experience

[spngie1]

I purchased a used but uninstalled marks adapter to mate up a 1990 tbi and the stock 4 speed in my 1984 fj60. I am still gathering a few parts, but will try to get the major bits in place later this week.

I am not sure if the kit I received is complete. I know that it is missing the pilot bearing. What I don't know is if it is unique to the kit or if I can toss in a bronze GM pilot. From the schematic, it looks like it may install on a different surface than a stock bushing in order to limit the play of the input shaft extension. Does anyone have any info on this to help me clear things up?

I already sent an inquiry to Advanced Adapters, but I would like to find some pictures to use as a reference rather than the schematic.

Also, the throw out bearing extension tube seems to bind a bit in the adapter housing and I am curious if this is typical. The adapter was sitting in an open box for a while and gathered some dust and surface grit. I'd like to remove this tube to clean it and relube, but I don't see how this can be done.

Any v8 hybrids out there using this adapter? I would appreciate some feedback -especially photos, so that I may identify any more missing parts.

-caleb

 

[Elbert]

here is a picture of the assembled unit. I only have experience setting up one of this (one time) and my friend helped quit a bit. Can't you download the data sheet from the advance adapters web site or the marks web site? This will have the pictures and instructions. As I recall it has a unique throwout bearing?

My observations....the instructions were/are lacking.

Not sure I would use the mark's adapter again....but you have to run some type of adapter depending on the engine / transmission / transfer case combination.

If I go at this again or modfy my truck, I'm going to move the engine back toward the firewall more to gain some clearance at the radiator.

I looked through my old pics, I don't have any pics showing the various parts, you might surf through some of the engine swap threads to see what's out there.

 

[rover67]

this is kind of putting my brain in way back mode, but here goes....

The throw out bearing extension tube in mine slid back and forth smoothly. I also had to buy a pilot bearing. I used a pilot bearing for a late model Gm truck with the 5.3 Vortec and a Manual. My motor is a 5.3 Vortec.

I also remember the instructions were lacking, and in particular I had a few questions about how to set up the throw out bearing sleeve. in the end I think I adjusted it so at rest it was "square"

Also, I remember there were these little block looking parts and weird half moon shaped clips that held either the throw out bearing or throw out fork in place. I think they were for the fork. I lost one of those clips and it was hard to find... took a few calls from advance adapters to get it. I seem to remember that those were the only small parts.

hope this helps some.

 

[lehiguy]

Early versions of the Mark's used a longer spud shaft and the original pilot bushing/bearing location. The unit's shortcoming was the forward thrust of the spud shaft. It would devour pilot bushings and even crankshafts as the spud shaft moved back and forth on the tranny input shaft. Later versions employed a different pilot bearing, larger, and with an adapter ring to mate it to the larger pilot area of the crank behind the original pilot location. The ball-bearing pilot did a far better job of controling the thrust of the spud shaft. On the older version, after replacing my crankshaft (!!!) I welded a large washer to the spud shaft to stop it from moving inboard past the clutch disk and chewing up a new crank. That worked ok, but pilot bushings were still a bit short lived. The updated stuff is better, going to an NV4500 without the goofy adapter is, in my opinion, the best approach. Yes, I have been there, and I have done that.

 

[spngie1]

Thanks everyone for the reply's. That makes a lot of sense about the early to late adapter styles. It makes me think I have the late model, but no pilot/bushing combo.

I may not be going with the marks adapter now. I am really unhappy with how it arrived with loose parts in a damaged box. Parts may have just fallen out of the box. Seller threw some bubble wrap in the box, but didn't wrap anything so things just banged around- instructions ripped up, etc. I am looking to return this and try something else.

Also got trans dapt instead of AA motor mounts. I am not big on the AA mounts anyway, but the trans dapt ones are an even cheaper rip off version.

appreciate the info, caleb

 

[lehiguy]

Motor mounts are so easy to make if you have a chop saw and a welder.

 

[spngie1]

I agree on fabbing my own mounts. I was trying to put together a quick "bolt on" kit since I am still in class, don't have a garage, and we are already past due for snow.

Not sure what I am going to do now. But with a longer time line I will probably make my own.

-Caleb

 

[rover67]

I agree that if you had a choice, a better one would be to run a regular bellhousing and skip the marks.

 

[OyajiJon]

I'm running the Mark's adapter behind my 5.7 Vortec, and I thought it was pretty hokie coming out of the box. It works (I've only got 3k miles on mine), but if I were to do it again, I'd probably purchase the Ranger unit from AA. It is virtually the same thickness, so you get the engine positioning advantage of not needing driveline modification PLUS overdrive at the same price. I'm kicking myself for doing what I did.

760024M-27 | Engine & Transmission Conversion Adapters - Advance Adapters

 

[spngie1]

I absolutely would have prefered the ranger unit. It is sold out for another month at least. It does not look like I will be able to return the adapter anyway with the 20% restocking fee on $1000+. Time and money budgets are too tight.

I will have to live with this setup until I can find a fair priced nv4500 or alternative later on.

It looks like it is a special pilot bearing, AA has it.

 

[Elbert]

If I change my setup it will be to go with a NV4500, and then adapt to the FJ60 transfer case.

I felt like that such an important part would have more detailed instructions...we had some bolts, and some other misc parts that we never could figure out what they were for. Between my friend Les and I we jsut installed it the best we could and went from there. I assume that some of the parts may apply to different year model engine setups..once again...do not depend on the instructions to be clear, which I thnk you can download...maybe 3 pages or less. If I find mine I'll scan them and can email to you if needed.

What I really don't like is the short throw of the clutch pedal. I have a 1999 GM 5.7 Vortec. My main driver at the time to use the mark's kit was that I wanted a bolt on solution. I wsa new to LC and the mark's kit seemed to fit my desire to get the thing finsihed and up and running.

Since I'm not a welder or fabrictor I would have to get a shop or someone to help me fab/weld up new crossmember if I go down that road sometime.

 

[OyajiJon]

Well, the good news is that you'll like the power of the V8 regardless of how you get it in there. Just be prepared for it to cost more than you plan to spend and understand that gas mileage still sucks after the swap. At least for me, it does...

What I really don't like is the short throw of the clutch pedal. I have a 1999 GM 5.7 Vortec. My main driver at the time to use the mark's kit was that I wanted a bolt on solution. I wsa new to LC and the mark's kit seemed to fit my desire to get the thing finsihed and up and running.

Since I'm not a welder or fabrictor I would have to get a shop or someone to help me fab/weld up new crossmember if I go down that road sometime.

Ditto, on all counts, for me.

 

[Kief]

NV4500 involves an adapter or the chevy bellhousing which may create more problems if equipped with the internal clutch release afaik...

 

[lehiguy]

NV4500 involves an adapter or the chevy bellhousing which may create more problems if equipped with the internal clutch release afaik...

All sources say not to use that internal release mechanism. AA sells a complete bellhousing for the NV4500, both for Chevy and Dodge versions of the box, but they are mighty proud of them. I used a '95 Chevy bellhousing and modified the poo out of it, welding closed the original release arm port and cutting a new one on the driver's side. I had to fab a ball stud and mounting plate too, but I got to retain the Toyota slave and the old school, bomb-proof Chevy release arm and other hardware. It works perfectly and it's on the outside where it belongs.

 

[Elbert]

what's the reason you can't run the "GM" OEM NV4500 bellhousing with interal slave setup? Is it something to do with the lack of GM clutch master cylinder setup at the firewall?

 

[lehiguy]

what's the reason you can't run the "GM" OEM NV4500 bellhousing with interal slave setup? Is it something to do with the lack of GM clutch master cylinder setup at the firewall?

I don't know if they just wanted to scare me, but the people at AA swore that it never works in anything other than the original application. I talked to other people who were equally skeptical. Surely there is somebody out there who has tried it and can chime in with actuall, first-hand experience. I didn't want to try it, have it fail and have to yank out the drivetrain again and start over so I didn't do it.

 

[Elbert]

yea..that bothers me to hear one specific vendor say that but the details are lacking. I'll ask my buddies at the local GM shop if they know of any issues with facotry setup. Even if you had to transplant the GM slave master setup...seems like that would be reasonable.

I have a friend who has a 1ton CM truck with flat bed and tommy lift. 5.7 with 5speed...something like 170K miles, I think its a 94 or 95 year model. Anyway I don't think the truck has ever had anything done to it and it shifts ok. I've borrowed it a few times to move some heavy stuff (tommy lifts are great).

 

[BELMONT148]

Word of caution, make sure you install and properly shim the starter before bolting the marks adapter on. If you look, the starter nose is completely sealed and you can't check the clearance of the armature shaft to the flywheel/flex plate. Going threw this now, as I can't get my starter shimmed properly because I can't see what is going on on the flywheel.

Jeremy

 

[lehiguy]

what's the reason you can't run the "GM" OEM NV4500 bellhousing with interal slave setup? Is it something to do with the lack of GM clutch master cylinder setup at the firewall?

When I got my hands on the 1995 hardware that I used, I was appaled at what complete garbage the stock slave cylinder, release arm and pivot were. I used the older stuff, its far better, worthy of the Land Cruiser's charachter, not disposable trash.

 

[rover67]

Early versions of the Mark's used a longer spud shaft and the original pilot bushing/bearing location. The unit's shortcoming was the forward thrust of the spud shaft. It would devour pilot bushings and even crankshafts as the spud shaft moved back and forth on the tranny input shaft. Later versions employed a different pilot bearing, larger, and with an adapter ring to mate it to the larger pilot area of the crank behind the original pilot location. The ball-bearing pilot did a far better job of controling the thrust of the spud shaft. On the older version, after replacing my crankshaft (!!!) I welded a large washer to the spud shaft to stop it from moving inboard past the clutch disk and chewing up a new crank. That worked ok, but pilot bushings were still a bit short lived. The updated stuff is better, going to an NV4500 without the goofy adapter is, in my opinion, the best approach. Yes, I have been there, and I have done that.

lehiguy,

I used a big bearing that fit without the adapter ring they provided... I got it at NAPA a long time ago. PN is 6302-VSP43 and it says 6320DU on the plastic. it's an NSK bearing. 43.3mm OD, 15mm ID and 13mm wide.

Anyways, why do you think that the marks kit uses a smaller bearing with an adapter ring? Why didn't they just use the bigger bearing? I am trying to put my rig together right since I had a vibration i could never track down. I think the clutch/pilot had something to do with it. I took it all apart a few days ago to try and figure it out.
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