HJ47: buying my first cruiser: 300 000+ km 2h diesel motors and reconditioning costs?

[Igottagettacruiser]

Hello,

Me and My girlfriend are getting hyped about getting a hj45 or hj47 ute here in Australia.

We live in the Grampians nat'l park, and are trading in our trusty self-camperised japanese van for our first 4wd, to do some non-flogging offroading, commuting, and outback tracks.

We work as forest firefighters, so we get to 4WD drive the new hiluxes and landcruiser utes at work (and not have to fix or fuel 'em, AND get paid for it, sweet, eh?)

We love the styles and toughness of the 40 series, and the reliability and durability of toyotas, and are planning to own it for the next 10 years or so as our primary vehicle (at least untill fuel gets too expensive)

Unfortunately, on our end of the price range, ( hopefully at the $5000 mark, but up to $8000 Aus.) most hj45 and hj47's have 300 000 km or more.

How many km's can be coaxed out of a 2h diesel motor before it needs a reco? (I realise there's alot of factors, mostly regular maintenance and excessive start-stopping)

and how much does reconditioning cost?

With our previous old vehicles, our upkeep costs have been around 200/year, should I assume upkeep costs are about double for an old ute?

Oh yeah, and anyone have one for sale??

Thanks heaps,

Brad and Kazz

 

[amaurer]

Hello,

Me and My girlfriend are getting hyped about getting a hj45 or hj47 ute here in Australia.

We live in the Grampians nat'l park, and are trading in our trusty self-camperised japanese van for our first 4wd, to do some non-flogging offroading, commuting, and outback tracks.

We work as forest firefighters, so we get to 4WD drive the new hiluxes and landcruiser utes at work (and not have to fix or fuel 'em, AND get paid for it, sweet, eh?)

We love the styles and toughness of the 40 series, and the reliability and durability of toyotas, and are planning to own it for the next 10 years or so as our primary vehicle (at least untill fuel gets too expensive)

Unfortunately, on our end of the price range, ( hopefully at the $5000 mark, but up to $8000 Aus.) most hj45 and hj47's have 300 000 km or more.

How many km's can be coaxed out of a 2h diesel motor before it needs a reco? (I realise there's alot of factors, mostly regular maintenance and excessive start-stopping)

and how much does reconditioning cost?

With our previous old vehicles, our upkeep costs have been around 200/year, should I assume upkeep costs are about double for an old ute?

Oh yeah, and anyone have one for sale??

Thanks heaps,

Brad and Kazz

Head over to the Diesel Tech board with this question, there are a lot more diesel owners there.

300,000km is middle-aged for all the Toyota diesels, but a well cared for engine will have lots of life left at that point. Note that some of the H/2H's are sleeved engines and some are not, which has an effect on longevity and rebuild costs.

Also in the last month or so several people have posted up problems with the H or 2H (I forget which) wearing the ring grooves in the pistons to double size in the 300k range. Probably an anomaly, but go read up.

When you buy one, however, especially with 300k, get a compression test done before you drive away, that will tell you a LOT. If it has good compression and doesn't billow smoke I'd be happy to buy one with 300k, myself.

 

[herbs]

A full reco on a diesel motor = $$$$ - 5-6 grand or more, depending on where you are. The 2H that is in the hj 47 is a better motor, but I don't mind the H that's in my hj 45. As important as anything though is to look for rust, in the floorpan, b pillar, windscreen frame, below the doors, in the bottom of the doors, the seam that runs horizontally in front of the doors and the panel in front of the radiator. No prizes for guessing how I know this.........

 

[Combat Chuck]

I say just bear in mind probably 8 of 10 cruisers will need some work, no matter what, and the level depends entirely on each vehicle. If you go looking at cruisers, bring a friend who either knows cars/cruisers, or is a hell of a bargainer, because some sellers try to inflate the value of the rig in question. Never commit to a cruiser you can't get your hands on, and leave no stone unturned when you look at them (I looked at about seven before I settled on my 40)

Welcome to Mud!
(I like the sound of your job, by the way, I'm training to be a Forest Ranger myself.)

 

[MUDDYTOJO]

Hey how u doin

Well this is my first reply,...post.
I have a HJ47..84 trayback..
Rebuilt the motor for 6grand, took the mechanic 14 weeks to rebuild it, it is sleeved...the block...hmm spent quite alot of money over the years on it.
Built a long range tank..carries 102ltrs, cage...steel, custom towbar so there was room to fit and make the fuel tank, 60ltr plastic water tack under the tray, one you buy for a caravan....the water tank..
It has air con....ive only just put a air locker in the rear ARB.. headlight upgrade.....THAT IS A MUST!!! IPF...lights are BRILLIANT...for the price of 300 more or less...custom recaro seats...buckets...makes the cabin very comfortable.....yet need to do something with the noise from the motor......pretty loud....firewall insulation.
Now the rig is a beauty.....best model people say when i go "shopping" in the arb stores..
Now all i regret is not having a 12HT and a 5sp MORE POWER... conversion done......instead of rebuilding the damn boat anchor 2H motor..
The FUEL ECONOMY IS WOEFULL!! CRAP ON POWER....17ltrs to a 100km..hmm im fairly weighty in gear.....though..i must say.
I will never ever regret buying this model, only deciding to keep with the 2H heap of crap..
So if you come across one that is priced fair...and motor needs doing, throw the motor away, grab a HJ61 and put the 12ht and 5sp gearbox into it...theyre going for around the 9 to 11 grand ..for the whole vehicle...
Im looking at doing this.....when the chance pops up....funds are sitting there, just need the time....and research on the full costs??? anyone got an idea....i hear its a pretty straight forward job..
Oh look up EXploreoz... has an easy search medium on the vehicle trader......the best ive used EVER
BUT you wont find one there.......LOOK UP 4WD action.com.....plenty of old girls theyre,
theyres even a hj47 for sale from tassie though..
He or she wants 10grand for it though..hmm wont sell with what he has on it......it has a long range tank......and its YELLOW..CAB AND TRAY, looks alright the colour and ute......if i was selling mine....hmm nope, sorry...id at least want 9grand minimum.....194000 on the clock......
Oh yes THE 3INCH HOSE....FROM THE AIR CLEANER TO THE ENGINE INTAKE HAS A HABIT AT CRACKING AT THE RIBS NEAR THE ELBOW ON THE RUBBER HOSE......a replacements only 70 bucks or less, but it can only be checked by removing the hose fully and checking for cracks....
i HAVE NEVER BROKEN DOWN IN THE BUSH...its the rescue vehicle on the last few trips weve done......

 

[craptabulous]

Well this is my first reply,...post.
I have a HJ47..84 trayback..
Rebuilt the motor for 6grand, took the mechanic 14 weeks to rebuild it, it is sleeved...the block...hmm spent quite alot of money over the years on it.
Built a long range tank..carries 102ltrs, cage...steel, custom towbar so there was room to fit and make the fuel tank, 60ltr plastic water tack under the tray, one you buy for a caravan....the water tank..
It has air con....ive only just put a air locker in the rear ARB.. headlight upgrade.....THAT IS A MUST!!! IPF...lights are BRILLIANT...for the price of 300 more or less...custom recaro seats...buckets...makes the cabin very comfortable.....yet need to do something with the noise from the motor......pretty loud....firewall insulation.
Now the rig is a beauty.....best model people say when i go "shopping" in the arb stores..
Now all i regret is not having a 12HT and a 5sp MORE POWER... conversion done......instead of rebuilding the damn boat anchor 2H motor..
The FUEL ECONOMY IS WOEFULL!! **** ON POWER....17ltrs to a 100km..hmm im fairly weighty in gear.....though..i must say.
I will never ever regret buying this model, only deciding to keep with the 2H heap of ****..
So if you come across one that is priced fair...and motor needs doing, throw the motor away, grab a HJ61 and put the 12ht and 5sp gearbox into it...theyre going for around the 9 to 11 grand ..for the whole vehicle...
Im looking at doing this.....when the chance pops up....funds are sitting there, just need the time....and research on the full costs??? anyone got an idea....i hear its a pretty straight forward job..
Oh look up EXploreoz... has an easy search medium on the vehicle trader......the best ive used EVER
BUT you wont find one there.......LOOK UP 4WD action.com.....plenty of old girls theyre,
theyres even a hj47 for sale from tassie though..
He or she wants 10grand for it though..hmm wont sell with what he has on it......it has a long range tank......and its YELLOW..CAB AND TRAY, looks alright the colour and ute......if i was selling mine....hmm nope, sorry...id at least want 9grand minimum.....194000 on the clock......
Oh yes THE 3INCH HOSE....FROM THE AIR CLEANER TO THE ENGINE INTAKE HAS A HABIT AT CRACKING AT THE RIBS NEAR THE ELBOW ON THE RUBBER HOSE......a replacements only 70 bucks or less, but it can only be checked by removing the hose fully and checking for cracks....
i HAVE NEVER BROKEN DOWN IN THE BUSH...its the rescue vehicle on the last few trips weve done......

17 L for 100kms in a diesel . sweet jesus my small block does better then that and actually has hp .

 

[amaurer]

A 2H will never win races, but its enough to move a troopy. The opinion above is far from representative, many people are very happy with a 2H.

 

[Vicm]

A 2H will never win races, but its enough to move a troopy. The opinion above is far from representative, many people are very happy with a 2H.

Very true, I wouldn't trade my 2H for 10 2Fs or SBCs.
It has 400k kms and still runs like new. I get around 25mpg ,hj60 with auto trans ,411 gears.

 

[Igottagettacruiser]

Thanks heaps for all the info, I'll definitely get a compression test done when i'm shopping then...

I'm planning on looking at this ute in a few days (I hope the Pic upload works):

Vehicle 1983 TOYOTA LANDCRUISER HJ47 LWB
Colour Mustard
Interior Colour Brown-new upholstery
Body 2 door 3 seat UTILITY
Transmission 4 speed Manual
Drive type 4X4
Engine 6 cylinder Diesel Multi-point injected 4.0L (3980cc)
Kms 300000
Miles 186000
Price $5,500*
Price Denomination AUD
Registration Expiry AUG-2009
Registration number FXY 147
Road Worthy Certificate No
Vehicle ID 7328778
Short Description A very reluctant sale.
Description As new starter motor and alternator. Upholstery has just been redone. Tray rebuilt. No roadworthy but currently registered. Electric winch and UHF radio (if required). Always garaged, regularly serviced. Last serviced Tuesday 30th June 2009.
A very reluctant sale as it has been a good reliable farm ute. One owner.
Best offer considered.

Bull Bar
Electric Winch
Heavy Duty Suspension
Tool Box - Under Tray (Trundle)
Tow Bar


So hopefully if it's not too rusty, it'll turn out good...

17l/100km sounds crazy is that about the norm with a 4L 2h motor, or is cause it's sooped-up? , I was getting 8L/100 in my last vehicle!!

 

[Igottagettacruiser]

http://carpoint.com.au/used-car/TOYOTA/LANDCRUISER/Victoria/csn7362129.aspx?State=VIC

 

[herbs]

Looks alright, being an '83 it should have front disc brakes too. Also, check the chassis over, get right underneath the sucker, look for rust in the crossmember underneath the radiator, cracks in the chassis near the rear spring hangers and the rear crossmember where the rear towbar is attached, they can break if someone's hooked up to the moon and tried to pull it out of orbit...........

 

[Combat Chuck]

I like the look of it from here. definetly look it over with a discerning eye. What's that on the passenger rocker panel?
Gas mileage sounds about normal, it's an older four speed tranny, and I-6 engine, so not your most efficient setup, but a sipper compared to most gasoline engines, nonetheless. H engines are great for their torque and stability, I'd take a Toyota 2H or 3B over just about anthing else on the diesel lineup any day, becasue it'll last forever, and run well on an eyedropper full of gas.

If you do go for it, my 2 cents is to loose the bull bar. Just my own opinion, never was a big fan of catcher's masks...

 

[Combat Chuck]

an H55f tranny would increase efficiency, f you're really worried about 100km on 17 liters thing, overdrive would help some, but honestly, if it's ready to drive now, forget it, and just enjoy, don't turn it into a build if you don't have to.

 

[lostmarbles]

.....What's that on the passenger rocker panel?........

Hey - You're in OUR world now. That's the driver's side

 

[MUDDYTOJO]

Well, not a bad buy...for 5500..
It would be worth your while and take it for a day and get that blue slip....and see what stuff needs doing for the amount of the blue slip fee....with it already registered...be worth seeing if anything would pop up and how much it would be too get it on the road....and make your choice then...
As for my rig......ive had extractors fitted, i made a 3inch snorkel, and cut the 2inch inlet to the air cleaner and welded a 3inch inlet to it....made A HUGE DIFFERENCE...oh the exhaust is 2.5inch not mandrel bent though to get more ponies.....hmm couldnt tell you if it helped my economy....i think i got a little more power and economy.....it needed doing...the muffler was rusted...out nearly, still passed rego....if you get what i mean..sounds great though..
Hmm the best thing i did to mine.....was the ARB SUSPENSION......absolutely brilliant.....wished i did it from day one......nearly 9 years ive had it..2500 though but well worth it.....the emu dakar gear...
And upgraded the headlights was the next, and then fitted some recaro bucket seats......comfy ride now....
What tends to wear out is the IDLER ARM...every two years,.
I do on average 9thou a year, running 33 by 12.5 muddies, you get better milage.........a little if you drive under the speed limit........BUT WHO DOES THAT..
As the alternator has been replaced.......youve saved 500, because they cant be rebuilt, they have the vacuum to run the brakes......i had mine replaced upped it to a 100 amp one....total cost fitted 600 or near that mark, as ive got a winch and a heap of electrical stuff im running..
For long trips....jerry cans become a pain......so i made a LR fuel tank..
If you wait any longer........theyre in demand........that model......
Ive been asked to sell mine a couple of times..
The milage in mine is standard.....no souped up motor, injectors or pump.....stock standard...i am carrying a bit of weight with all the mods ive done......but its standard across the board....
Id like to find out.........anyone care to comment...
Yes the 2H is a solid motor.......but what it lacks is power and economy........and thats all........
Hmm...overdrive people say....... well theyre getting hard to come by, and the spare parts are drying up...if not gone already.....as in the fairy overdrive..
I will send you my email addy.......if you want some pics.......or questions......
Hmm the compression test......yes, wished i did that to mine, as i bought it at auction......theyre were two in stock.......i paid 5500 in 2000...123000 on the clock..
Dont factor that into it, just chuck that motor and do as i said....12ht.....5spd..if your going to keep it for a while..

 

[Igottagettacruiser]

I called the bloke today to have a chat before making a 8 hour round trip to look at it. It dosen't come with the roadworthy needed in Victoria and IT BLOWS SMOKE (and burns a bit of oil) the owner sais it's just the injectors. I called a motorhead friend of mine with a 1976 hj45 and picked his brains a bit.

His advice: Start it from cold to see how easily it starts, if the smoke stops when it's warmed up, it's the injectors, if not, it's something more major like the piston rings, etc...

and to walk away from a rusted chassis or too much smoke...

I'm still working on my mechanical aptitude, just clutches, brakes, steering, water pumps, alternators so far, how difficult is it to replace the injectors myself? One of the reasons Im looking for an old ute is cause i can work on it myself (best way to learn). My father in law's pushing for a 70's series, too much like the utes at work.

The Bull bar is Definitely staying on, I live in the Grampians, which is packed with Kangaroos, I even hit one on my kawasaki KLR motorbike last year!

I made an inspection checklist from the MUD FAQ
The seller says the price is flexible too. (it's been up for sale for almost a month now, I was eying it up when I was still overseas)