Help! Got the dreaded call - need a new motor!

[gijoebruin]

First off, I greatly appreciate all who have commented and given me more to think about. I was in Northern California when I got the cal Friday and made the drive home yesterday to catch the mechanic just before he closed.

Here is what I know.
- A plastic 'T' bracket for the cooling hose broke and caused the coolant leak.
- He replaced both T brackets and replaced all the hoses leading to the engine.
- He replaced all the coolant and washed the engine. He started the engine, and after about 10 minutes, the truck started to overheat.
- They heard a very faint sound from the bottom of the motor, although he is not sure what it is. He thinks it could be a rod but doesn't know for sure.
- Since the car overheated, he then checked for CO2 in the radiator and it tested positive. Based on this, he thinks at a minimum the head gasket needs to replaced and more damage could have occurred to the engine because of the sound.
- I asked him if he changed the oil since coolant may have entered the engine causing the 'white smoke' my wife saw just before shutting off the engine. He said he did not change the oil and he does not believe coolant got into the oil and that the smoke was the steam from the coolant hitting the hot engine.
- The car runs fine right now, but he said it will overheat.

I towed the truck home since I did not want it to sit at this shop over the weekend. I asked him to look into getting a used low mileage engine and go from there. I will do everything I can to make sure I get the best engine I can find, as well as the right person with Landcruiser experience. Thanks again to this community.

 

[Spike555]

I would replace the thermostat, when a thermostat overheats it can fail in the closed position. Which of course will make the engine overheat.
So I would replace that and change the oil, then take it for a spin around the block.
IF the engine is bad, you have nothing to loose by doing these two things.

 

[YardPig]

I would replace the thermostat, when a thermostat overheats it can fail in the closed position. Which of course will make the engine overheat.
So I would replace that and change the oil, then take it for a spin around the block.
IF the engine is bad, you have nothing to loose by doing these two things.

Waste of time and money. If he trusts his mechanic and the coolant tests positive for combustion gases then the head gaskets are blown.
No changing the oil or replacing the thermostat is going to wave a magic wand at the problem.

 

[staggrlee]

Bummer. This is the reason a heater tee replacement post has a really good chance of being in the top 10 front page threads on any given day: When they fail they seem to do so catastrophically and not gradually. Nobody's reaction time to this happening is sufficient to prevent overheating/damage.

When I had mine replaced with metal tees, Torfab told me that I must have only used Toyota coolant because OE ones hadn't turned brittle and and grey/mottled-brown from off-brand coolant. I have, and while how important using Toyota brand coolant is may only be mechanic's lore, Tor only works on LCs and I trust he knows what he's talking about.

 

[biggus]

You can have your oil tested to see if there is coolant in the oil. Send a sample to Blackstone and let them know your concerns. They can also check for wear metals. If the oil is clean, you can do the head gaskets and should be good to go.

 

[Spike555]

Waste of time and money. If he trusts his mechanic and the coolant tests positive for combustion gases then the head gaskets are blown.
No changing the oil or replacing the thermostat is going to wave a magic wand at the problem.

Blown headgaskets do not cause overheating. No replacing the thermostat will not fix a blown headgasket, but if it stops the overheating it will buy him time to figure out what he wants to do next.
If he changes the oil and the supposed bottom end noise goes away then he can stop looking for a new engine.

 

[YardPig]

Blown headgaskets do not cause overheating. No replacing the thermostat will not fix a blown headgasket, but if it stops the overheating it will buy him time to figure out what he wants to do next.
If he changes the oil and the supposed bottom end noise goes away then he can stop looking for a new engine.

HUH? Combustion gases entering the cooling system will certainly cause overheating. It is the number one cause of engine overheating as hot gases are entering the cooling system, literally boiling the system. Please don't post misinformation.

 

[gijoebruin]

I like idea of sending in the sample to Blackstone. I'll send it overnight first thing tomorrow.

If there is no coolant in the oil, how difficult is replacing the head gasket?

Only other concern would be the noise when the engine is running hot, although my mechanic didn't hear it himself and was told by another guy who works for him. It didn't sound like he was 100% certain on the 'knock'.

 

[Spike555]

HUH? Combustion gases entering the cooling system will certainly cause overheating. It is the number one cause of engine overheating as hot gases are entering the cooling system, literally boiling the system. Please don't post misinformation.

Nope. It's not. Literally thousands of Land Rovers driving around with blown headgaskets and no overheating.

 

[YardPig]

Nope. It's not. Literally thousands of Land Rovers driving around with blown headgaskets and no overheating.

We can argue all you want, if it has combustion gases entering the cooling system it's going to overheat. Allowing pressurized gases into the system will force coolant out, it's a very simple principle.
Anyhow, I think the OP confirmed combustion gases are present and the truck was overheated, so at least can agree at least one, if not two head gasket are leaking.

 

[Julian Stead]

I think the op has done everything right on this, it seems the diagnosis is good on the headgaskets and a replacement motor is the best route to go down. Put the new thermostat in the replacement engine and timing belt/water pump service before fitment. Just check that the excessive heat hasn’t affected your coolant hose’s as these might need replacing. If your exhaust manifolds are known to be good then you might think of swapping them on to the new motor. That is if the replacement engine comes complete with them fitted.

 

[gatormark91]

Why does a blown head gasket automatically mean a replacement motor? Get a junkyard head, bolt it on and go.

 

[biggus]

Why does a blown head gasket automatically mean a replacement motor? Get a junkyard head, bolt it on and go.

It doesn't. As long as the oil did not get contaminated enough to no longer provide proper lubrication and the engine didn't get so hot that it became damaged, the head gasket is replaceable and the engine repairable. The head might even still be usable as long as it is not cracked or warped from excessive heat.

It appears the loss of coolant caused the engine to overheat and the head gasket blew as a result. It just depends on how hot it got and for how long. The OP is sending out an oil sample to see the condition of the oil for coolant and wear metals. If this checks out and if it were mine - I'd pull both heads and have them checked for cracks. If they are ok, new HGs would go on and we would be back on the road. All new hoses, new Ts and belts of course as well.

 

[YardPig]

Why does a blown head gasket automatically mean a replacement motor? Get a junkyard head, bolt it on and go.

If it got really hot it could affect the tensile strength of the piston rings, deeming the engine an oil burner after repair.

 

[Julian Stead]

It isn’t just pistons/rings it is the main bearings and big end bearings that get affected due to there tolerences reducing too nothing. Heat means expansion, expansion kills engines.

 

[YardPig]

It isn’t just pistons/rings it is the main bearings and big end bearings that get affected due to there tolerences reducing too nothing. Heat means expansion, expansion kills engines.

Completely agree. Piston rings are usually first on an otherwise healthy engine. Then you invest a bunch of time, energy and money on the repair only to find out it consumes oil or smokes like a choochoo train!

 

[gatormark91]

It doesn't. As long as the oil did not get contaminated enough to no longer provide proper lubrication and the engine didn't get so hot that it became damaged, the head gasket is replaceable and the engine repairable. The head might even still be usable as long as it is not cracked or warped from excessive heat.

It appears the loss of coolant caused the engine to overheat and the head gasket blew as a result. It just depends on how hot it got and for how long. The OP is sending out an oil sample to see the condition of the oil for coolant and wear metals. If this checks out and if it were mine - I'd pull both heads and have them checked for cracks. If they are ok, new HGs would go on and we would be back on the road. All new hoses, new Ts and belts of course as well.

I agree with this. I doubt the engine was run long enough to heat up the oil if a heater T went. If the oil is good and not showing indication it was overheated or contaminated, I'd just pull the heads, get them checked, and go from there.

"The truck left a trail of coolant and she told me it wasn’t on for more than a minute after she noticed the problem."

I've not know of anyone that had to stop driving because of a clearly obvious coolant leak that had to replace their motor.

 

[Julian Stead]

If it was run long enough to make the combustion gases enter the coolant then the cylinders had overheated as this is where the heat is generated, it isn’t generated from the coolant, it is generated in the combustion chamber. It is the same reason why the head gasket would go as to why the pistons/rings could be damaged. Expansion..Why do people think the heads can warp but the pistons won’t get affected.

 

[SEEMTEE]

Did I hear someone say, Diesel Swap? Cummins Crate Engines - Get Ready to Repower - Cummins Engines or maybe even something bigger

Will this thing fit!

 

[Kofoed]

Pull the heads and directly inspect the heads and cylinder walls.