EMS Powered Exhaust on 92 3FE (1 Viewer)

[jcarter]

I finally got some good weather to put the exhaust system on.

Instructions on their website are for the 93+ 80's, had them anyway for hints.

Summary of system:
1. Down pipes from manifold with built-in flex sections and O2 mounts.
2. Cat with 1 mounting point
3. Crossover pipe with 1 mounting point at gas tank strap
4. Muffler pipe with 1 mounting point downstream from muffler
5. Tail pipe with 2 mounting points.
Plus 4 pipe clamps, 2 sets of small nut/bolt/lock-washer/flat-washer, studs/nuts I think for O2 sensors, 4 sets of nut/"unscrew stopper thing"/c-clips for manifold studs.

Removing the old:
Used a lot of PB Blaster! Started at the engine. This was not too difficult for I had the pipes off the manifolds recently and used anti-seize so 4 manifold/pipe nuts came off easy. I put a jackstand with 4x4 block to hold up cat so as not to bugger up the manifold threads with the exhaust flange.

I was also able to unbolt the connection near the Y-pipe. After that, the sawzall came out near each of the other (2) exhaust pipe junctions.

Now onto the supports. Hint: The system is solidly mounted to the frame, so any small bolts/rubber will not be reused, so go ahead and torque them off. Started at the engine. I already had the (2) supports for the (2) down pipes off the manifold out. The support by the cat was rusted through, so nothing too do there. I believe the next support was just downstream from the muffler. I left the bracket on the frame, and unbolted/broke-off the small bolts through the rubber. Last support was by the tailpipe. There I did take off the bracket on the frame. Walla, old system out!

New System install:
Again, started at the engine.

Per the instructions, I put RTV on gaskets and stuck them up in the manifolds just to hold them there. Had a buddy support the cat part while I slid flanges over the manifold studs. WOW! The flanges are huge compared to stock manifold. I assume this is in case there are headers. The "slot" on the flanges just fit on the stock studs. I'll get a pic later, looks funny, hope it seats properly. Used the jackstand to support the cat and relieved my buddy.

Next step said to skip the cat part and install the next one, crossover pipe. This was difficult. Baktasht (Mr. EMS) told me some folks complained about this mounting spot. Now I know why. It uses a bolt that holds on the gas tank strap. Once you remove this strap bolt, the strap unsprings and you can't stretch the strap to get it back on. After messing with it for a while, we put a jack under the gas tank and totally removed the strap. The other side of the strap has a long bolt and is how the strap is tightened, in other words, YOU CAN'T DO IT WITHOUT REMOVING THE STRAP! Then, its tough getting the bolt started since the thickness of the support leaves less room.

Then we put the cat part on, pretty straight forward. Kit comes with 2 sets of small, bolt/nut/lock-washer/flat-washer. I put lock-washer on bolt and flat washer on nut. I think I'll get another flat-washer and do flat-washer on bolt and flat-washer, then lock-washer at nut.

Next was muffler part. Pretty straight forward. Cross-over pipe to muffler pipe connection was easy. To be thorough, at this point EVERYTHING connected, but loose, ready to tweak until right. Mounting point of muffler on stock bracket hasn't much flexibility and muffler isn't flat when installed (not a big deal, just goofy looking).

Last comes the tailpipe. ERRR the dreaded tailpipe. 2 person job for sure. The tail pipe curves up over the frame, so very awkward. Also, for some reason EMS made this pipe connection very tight. I can't understand why the pipe connection at muffler/crossover is "loose" where it's easily accessible and easy to connect, while the muffler/tailpipe connection is incredibly "tight" where it is difficult to get to being above the drive shaft/rear diff? After messing with it, we pulled the muffler back out and connected it with the tailpipe in the yard and turned it several times. Idea was to make sure there were no burrs and pipes can connect at any position (360 degrees). Put it back in and FINALLY got them together.

There are 2 mounting spots on both ends of the tailpipe. The one near the muffler/tailpipe junction did not have a stock mounting spot and it kept hitting the frame so we couldn't slide it in properly. I'm wondering if this is a mistake as all other mounting spots have factory locations.

It got late and we gave up after 6 hours. Today it's raining. In hindsight, I'm going to complete the system through the muffler - tighten everything up, install O2 sensors, etc. I need to think through the tailpipe mounting. Since the muffler mounting spot has no give, I don't see any reason not to do this now. Besides, I can always loosen up the muffler if need be.

Recommendations back to EMS:
1. Add flat-washer to small silver mounting hardware (currently nut, bolt, lock-washer, flat-washer).
2. Inconsistent pipe connections. Muffler/crossover slides in easy, but muffler/tailpipe is too tight. I don't understand why the inconsistency.

Pic of 2 systems side by side.

 

[jcarter]

more pics

close-ups of 2 systems

 

[M32H32is]

Let us know if you can feel the difference in power after install...

 

[Motleyone]

Im interested in Cat temps. I replaced mine with a single Magna Flow. It is a littel cooler but still gets really hot here in AZ. Under hood temps and over heating EFI relays are the only problems I have ever had with my truck. The engine runs cool and never over heats. But man it gets hot around the Cat and under the hood.

 

[jcarter]

More power? I doubt it. I replaced a piston this summer including re-ring, head redone, fuel injectors serviced, etc. Haven't checked compression, but gotta be better than before. I digress, anyhow, everyone was telling me it was going to have a lot more power than the tired, low compression, old nasty head, etc., but I can't see it.

It had an exhaust leak at the manifold, so I figure the O2 sensors weren't working right. Maybe once I get this on and all sealed up I'll notice a difference, but now its the old LC I've grown to love. She ain't fast, radio and AC are broke, but she's dependable, takes a beatin', and get's me down to the river loaded with stuff (okay, sometimes through the river and mud and hills and dried up river beds, shhhh don't tell the wife)!

Thinking out exhaust further: Maybe I'm wrong in NOT reusing the small bolts with rubber mounts and the mounting points are off a bit. When I can get back on it, I'll send some pics to EMS. Baktasht is a good guy and I'm sure he'll help me trouble shoot it.

 

[M32H32is]

Yea I've got an exhaust leak at the manifold / head area as well and can't fig out exactly where. Annoying as hell.

Interesting you say no power though, their website shows nearly a 10% gain.

 

[mickeyt]

I think it refers to buying their custom manifold as a pre-req to that performance metric.

 

[jcarter]

Power Gains

From EMS website:


I don't know if you can read this. The numbers at 3700 RPM are:
Horsepower is 85 OEM and 97 EMS, 14% gain
Torque is 120 OEM and 137 EMS, 14% gain.

So, y'all think I'll notice this?

 

[Mixelplix]

I would imagine you will if those graphs are correct. The noticeable increase of torque throughout the powerband is what's most awesome.

My kit's arriving on Wednesday of this week. I'm excited.

 

[jcarter]

Just some commentary

Mixelplix: I'm excited too! So, are you installing it yourself in the driveway like me? It's cold now in the Lou, but Thursday it'll be nice and I hope to get off work a little early to finish it up!

I've emailed support and Baktasht is going to send me some pictures of how the tailpipe goes on. Hopefully it clears some stuff up because I'm a bit confused right now.

M32H32is: Realize I don't have the new exhaust on yet. My comment about "same power" was from all the work I did this summer. I've been eyeballing the "Desmog using BB's" which looks like it's easy and easily reversible. I DON'T WANT STINKY EXHAUST! But, I have doubts that the EGR system really saves a lot of harmful emissions. Good thing is, if I'm wrong, I can go back to normal. By the way my EGR system is new too!

 

[Mixelplix]

I'll be installing it (hopefully) this weekend.

I luckily have a garage and air tools

Let us know how it feels / sounds after you get it on!

 

[M32H32is]

Keep me posted on your results. Of they're favorable, ill de smog and purchase this exhaust as well. Also having my TB rebuilt and bored a bit @ new flow matched injectors.

 

[jcarter]

HINDSIGHT

1. Clean manifold studs really good and run new nuts up and down studs.
2. Install studs for O2 sensors before installing pipes.

 

[jcarter]

Progress Report

After some thought, I decided to take off the tailpipe which isn't fitting and button up the rest to get it out of the driveway so the wife get's her parking spot back.

Dreaded Tailpipe:

It is supposed to bolt into the frame. You can see the bolt holes. But I can't "move" it left 3" to 4" because it hits the gas tank. I can't twist it because the tailpipe will be pointing down instead of out behind the back tire. I emailed Baktasht who is sending me some pics, hopefully soon.

Manifold connection:

I told you the manifold flange was huge and looked kind of funny. Here's a pic. Notice the "stay on" mechanism that is supposed to keep the nuts from coming off. I only put one on. Other ones are really hard to get to and must go from under the vehicle. I'll try later.

O2 Sensor frustration:

I put the O2 sensor studs in pretty easy. Then went to put on the O2 sensors, but they wouldn't slide on the studs. You can see in the pic there should be PLENTY of room to slide on, but they were tapped for the studs too wide. A 5 minute deal took 1/2 hour, took a drill bit and widened the holes on the O2 sensors a bit then tapped them on.

 

[jcarter]

Body mount

The directions for the 1FZ-FE says you need to cut off the bottom of a body mount, but on the phone they told me on a 3FE, you don't. Then I saw this:


I got the sawzall back out and cut it off. I hit the flex pipe a bit, but not much. I think it'll be okay. You can see some threads coming of it in this after pic:


Still have to figure out the tailpipe, but thought I'd take her for a victory drive with the windows open.

YES! I CAN FEEL THE DIFFERENCE! Jumps off the line. Before you had to get into the pedal quite a bit just to get going, now you barely push it and you're on your way.

Shifts better too? This must be due to something else, but downshifts happen with much less pedal.

Warms up quicker? Again, I don't know how this could make a difference, but she warmed up fairly quickly and got 1/2 way to hot pretty quickly too. It's only about 40 degrees F out and the last few times I had her out I drove a long way in same temp and only got to 1/4 way to hot.

That's it. Now its time to nap before a wild night with the misses. Partying in Soulard this after noon, shuttling to a Blues game, then crashing downtown somewhere. Love the Lou!

 

[jcarter]

Tail Pipe

Baktasht got back to me with this pic:


Good deal! Obviously I was looking on the wrong side of where the bracket was hitting the frame. This spot makes more sense. Pipe will move further away from gas tank and should tuck higher above the frame.

Next break in the weather, I'll loosen it up and try to get the tail pipe in. Now I gotta find a bolt that fits that threaded hole.

More to come. . . .

 

[M32H32is]

Encouraging words ab power gains, but sux that you had to fab a bit of an install on a thousand dollar exhaust. Hmm...

 

[SM Racing]

Video?

 

[Mixelplix]

I got mine on this weekend as well. It was a pain, but none of it was due to the exhaust system.

Regarding the drivers side body mount, I cut my bolt off higher than you did. It clears the flex connection without issue.

Regarding the O2 sensor bung.. mine looked different than yours, and attached without issue. I actually attached the bungs while the exhaust was on the ground, then threaded the sensors in when I was finished.

Overall thoughts on fitment: Like all the exhausts I've done, when you first start putting it together you feel like 'this hanger is NEVER going to reach that hole!'.. but after you fiddle with it for a moment, it lines up perfectly. The fit was well done on this system, and with minimal swearing, it goes into place nicely.

Suggestions for people considering this setup:
Buy new exhaust manifold donut gaskets (manifold to downpipe) - you need two.
The manifold stud size on a 91 3fe is M10x1.25 - I had to drill one of mine out after every method of extraction failed.
Get a few short bolts, nuts, and washers (around M8 diameter by 1" long) to use when you destroy your existing exhaust hangar bolts. The kit states that it includes all new hardware, but mine didn't come with bolts for places where there was a bolt from the factory. In my instance, none of the hanger bolts could be reused, so I had to replace them. The kit does come with two bolts, nuts, and washers for locations where the exhaust attaches to existing holes which did not previously have a bolt going through them.

Regarding performance:
There's definitely a difference, but it's not earth shattering. In my experience with exhausts, most of your punch comes at wide open throttle (which is how the dyno runs are done). I don't run my rig at WOT all the time, so obviously there's less gain at part throttle. Going from a catless exhaust, to the EMS System does provide noticeable gains (in hills, and on the highway mostly), but the 3fe doesn't magically transform to a race motor.

Regarding Sound:
It's louder, of course, but not annoying at all. (It's dramatically better than a leaking exhaust, lol) It's deep, and throaty - it's only loud at 3k rpm and above, the rest of the rpm band is quite pleasant. I bought the no cats, no silencer option, and the tailpipe turns down at a 45deg angle near the spare tire.

It took me about 12 hours to get the old exhaust off (including the one manifold bolt I had to eventually drill out) and get everything hooked back up. I work slow, but I have a garage and air tools (no lift). My LC also spent it's whole life in the northeast, so every.single.freaking.bolt. was rusted to hell. If I were to subtract the time I spend screwing with the manifold stud, I would say I could get this exhaust on in 7 hours.

Overall I'm happy with this exhaust. It's build quality is excellent, the fitment is excellent, and the sound and performance gains met my expectations.

 

[concretejungle]

Not taking sides but i will say when you are welding up a "bolt on" exhaust system on a jig and hope everything lines up when it's put on the vehicles is always going to lend to some fitting issues. When you weld often the metal expands and flexes which can often lead to fitment issues.

Often our trucks have flexed so much over and over, plus body mounts wearing away and cracking with age, again can cause all the stars not to align just right.