Diesel 60

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I get the advantages of the 3.3 mechanical not a lot of lift required but how much lift would you need to instal the 4 or the 6 Cummings in a 60?

If you do it yourself how long did the install take and how long afterwards where you chasing bugs? I know Profits closed but who is leading the charge doing this professionally?

I personally don't like the 6 option it would be loud in a 60 but maybe not as much of an issue in an 80 series.
 
I feel it's gonna be loud in an 80 too. But is the six much louder than the 4? Perhaps proximity to firewall will affect this but go nuts on the lizard skin and dynomat.


I drove Brandon/Alex's/Dave's 4bt 80 and it was loud. The body roll was more of my concern at the time as it felt like my pig leaving the driveway. Airbags or stiffer away may combat that.

Think the swap was two long days and less than ten days of chasing a fuel pump spring issue. Johnny will give you specifics. It did cost him some beer too :) and I'm sure a couple months of planning and parts acquisition.

Not sure on leading authority 'with cruiser experience' but there are a couple folks commonly doing cummins swaps. One on nc4x4 list flat rate of 2500 plus parts. Darin says he has a swap planned for the future. Once he gets caught up on projects he may be able to get you scheduled. Not saying either is the way to go just relating what I've seen.

There are mixed results of whether a 3" lift will clear in the 60. Most say SOA and others have gotten by/plan on getting by with a notched or custom oil pan.
 
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SHERMAN FJ62 said:
I get the advantages of the 3.3 mechanical not a lot of lift required but how much lift would you need to instal the 4 or the 6 Cummings in a 60?

If you do it yourself how long did the install take and how long afterwards where you chasing bugs? I know Profits closed but who is leading the charge doing this professionally?

I personally don't like the 6 option it would be loud in a 60 but maybe not as much of an issue in an 80 series.
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A regular SOA on a 60 provides just enough clearance for the 10 quart oil pan. I've got a modified pickup and pan from Martin (1947FJ here on the forum) that cuts capacity down to 8 quarts. The sectioned pan is necessary for comfortable driveshaft clearance.

I mounted my motor as low as possible. If you're sticking with an auto tranny, or are willing to cut the floor, then you can move it up and have more clearance. In general though, there's not enough room in a 60, without SOA, to fit either a 4 or 6bt, unless you significantly cut your oil capacity or you went to a dry-sump oiling system ($$$).

There are a couple of shops that do it, but none around here, except for Darin. He's getting into his first couple of customer diesel conversions this year. IPOR may do it, I know TOR does it out in Seattle, then Jonsey's as well. It took us 3 days to install the drivetrain into Moonshine, then a week to 10 days to work out bugs until it was drivable. Many of the bugs would have been eliminated had I been smart and run my motor on a run stand prior to starting the swap. As for after the swap, I'm always fixing / changing things, so I'm probably not the best person to ask. You could say that as a result of the swap, I'm moving to 1 ton axles, but that's stretching it a bit.

I'm not sure that volume would be much different between the 4 and 6 cylinder motors. Sure, you've got two more combustion cycles happening with the 6 cylinder, but I don't think that translates to a bunch more noise. Jason hits the nail on the head about insulating the firewall very well. I'm considering going over my firewall with second skin / lizard skin.

If you're serious about the swap, we'll have arrange a time to meet up so you can drive my truck. I've had a couple of people tell me that the noise level is about the same as a 1st gen cummins dodge ram, which makes sense.
 
GLTHFJ60 said:
:lol:






Not a good idea. There were at least 4 different injection pumps that Cummins put on the 4 and 6 cylinder motors, and only two of them are suitable for on-road use. The off-road or stationary injection pumps (Lucas A pump, Lucas CAV, etc) are load-governed, which does not work well on the road. There are rare exceptions where you'll find a VE pump in a stationary machine, or a P7100, but you have to be very careful, as the off-road pumps look very similar to the on-road ones.
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:doh: I edited that post so many times I forgot to move the last part. I meant that a B3.3 is best to find that way as they only cam in industrial equipment.


Quick Side Note on the B series Cummins. The 6B was the first one built and designed. It was originally intended for a passenger light duty pickup truck in 1982 but that didn't actually come into effect until Dodge (the only 1 ton truck builder who didn't own or have a arrangement with a diesel company) finally drank the cool aid. They were first made in Rocky Mount NC. A few years later the 4B was an after thought and originally intended for agricultural equipment only.

Got all that over beers with my cummins rep over beers years ago when I was buying some to put in our fleet that I had to oversee. :cheers: Great guy had done multiple swaps himself with all kinds of cummins.


If you are seriously thinking about it take up Johnny on his offer.

As for loud...... neither is really louder than the other. Major differences have already been mentioned. 6bt will be less of a paint shaker due to a 6 vs 4 motor and lack of a good harmonic balancer on a 4bt (although a stock 6bt isn't that great)

Fluid mounts and a fluidampr improves a 4bt a bunch.
 
lt1fire said:
As for loud...... neither is really louder than the other. Major differences have already been mentioned. 6bt will be less of a paint shaker due to a 6 vs 4 motor and lack of a good harmonic balancer on a 4bt (although a stock 6bt isn't that great)
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The B3.3 is quieter than the 4BT and 6BT and does not shake as much.

I've seen them running on industrial water pumps. Not as quiet as a Mercedes OM617 but not loud like a real Cummins.

The 3.3 was designed and is built by Komatsu. Sold in the USA by Cummins. More like a Kubota motor than a Cummins. Sound is entirely different. Cummins, Cat, Mack, Benz, Perkins, etc each have their own sound.

Used in a lot of skid steers.

Also the 3.3 costs more because so many 4BT's were used in bread trucks and UPS trucks.

I think 80 HP is on the small side but I am very interested in this motor. I would love to see one in a truck. I wonder how it compares to the real - not rated - output of a 3B or a H/2H.

I would cost more to buy a 617 and rebuild it than to buy a new 3.3
 
the loud comparo is talking about a 6 vs 4bt in response to shermans question
 
kulangot said:
The B3.3 is quieter than the 4BT and 6BT and does not shake as much.

I've seen them running on industrial water pumps. Not as quiet as a Mercedes OM617 but not loud like a real Cummins.

The 3.3 was designed and is built by Komatsu. Sold in the USA by Cummins. More like a Kubota motor than a Cummins. Sound is entirely different. Cummins, Cat, Mack, Benz, Perkins, etc each have their own sound.

Used in a lot of skid steers.

Also the 3.3 costs more because so many 4BT's were used in bread trucks and UPS trucks.

I think 80 HP is on the small side but I am very interested in this motor. I would love to see one in a truck. I wonder how it compares to the real - not rated - output of a 3B or a H/2H.

I would cost more to buy a 617 and rebuild it than to buy a new 3.3
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There is one here in NC with a b3.3 . It is in the mountains i think. I can figure it out if needed. it is in a FJ45.
 
<Please forgive for Hijack>

Johnny,

I'd like to take you up on ride offer next time I see you. No need for me to drive, I just want to feel what the 4BT has to offer.

Is there any adjustability to amount of boost you're now using?

Thanks,
Rice

<Hijack off>
 
lt1fire said:
the loud comparo is talking about a 6 vs 4bt in response to shermans question
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In my opinion 4BT is louder than the 6BT.

I've owned three 6BT powered Dodge trucks an 90, a 93 and a 95 - all were quieter than Johnny's truck.

Aside from the required amount of lift I don't like how loud it is - I already have a 18 percent and 26 percent hearing loss!
 
Rice said:
<Please forgive for Hijack>

Johnny,

I'd like to take you up on ride offer next time I see you. No need for me to drive, I just want to feel what the 4BT has to offer.

Is there any adjustability to amount of boost you're now using?

Thanks,
Rice

<Hijack off>
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Sounds good to me rice! You gonna be at the meet and greet?

What do you mean boost adjustability? My current turbo puts out max of 15. I hope my new turbo will put out a max of 30-35.
 
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