70-Series: What Did Toyota Get Wrong? (1 Viewer)

[thebill]

As I get more familiar with my 73, I appreciate it more and more for its sheer simplicity and well thought out design which is what I remember most about the FJ62 I had years ago.
Cruisers are known for this simplicity of design and reliability, but in the opinion of almost 40 years worth of users the world over, are there things Toyota didn’t get right, no matter how pedantic?

 

[OGBeno]

Yes.

 

[Behemoth60]

Leaf springs. probably fine when they were invented by the romans for their racing chariots, but coil springs were invented in 1857. Why did they wait until the 80 series to use this 'new' technology.

 

[FJBen]

Yeah, they didn't sell in the US.


but seriously, yeah there are quite a few things I would improve for sure.

 

[thebill]

No matter the engine, I’ve always considered an oil filter oriented parallel to the ground to be a huge fail.
Looking at you, 1FZ.

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

They screwed up putting the 2LTE/3L and 22R into the light duty IMHO. To much truck for those little motors.

 

[thebill]

Yeah, they didn't sell in the US.


but seriously, yeah there are quite a few things I would improve for sure.

I definitely wonder about the reasoning behind not bringing 70's to the USDM in the 90's. Jeep could have used some competition.

 

[colby1979]

Cup holders and the skinny person passenger seat on trucks equipped with 60/40 bench seats are my two main complaints.

 

[clintnz]

Bolt-on steering arm mounts on the front knuckles. Nissan Patrols have those cast into the knuckle, no aftermarket 6-bolt hoo-haa required. Small front diffs & narrow rear axles on the later 70 series.

Cheers
Clint

 

[joekatana]

Leaf springs. probably fine when they were invented by the romans for their racing chariots, but coil springs were invented in 1857. Why did they wait until the 80 series to use this 'new' technology.

At the end of 1984 the LJ/RJ 70 series came out with coil springs all around , a LJ73 is still a great choice for daily driving duties

 

[FJBen]

In more serious complaints...

Seat doesn't go back far enough for anyone over 5'11"
Arm rests
1/2 rear doors for all soft top and FRP tops
Hood bumpers and hand screws for all foldable windshields
correct sized turbos for the smaller diesels, especially you CT26 on the 13BT
Goofy radiator caps on top of thermostats on the B series, I suppose MR T has a reason

I definitely wonder about the reasoning behind not bringing 70's to the USDM in the 90's. Jeep could have used some competition.

The Jeep was(is) no competition for the 70 series. Jeep had the CJ briefly, then YJ for competition for the 70 series that we can legally import at the moment. TJ coming soon in 96.

Let us compare some of the better selling points

70 Series:
Heavy duty axles
Full floating axles
Cable lockers Front/Rear then electric lockers
heavy duty drivetrain
Diesel: 4 cyl, turbo 4 cyl, 6 cylinder
Gas inline 6
OEM snorkel (if you like that sorta thing)
better frame
Overbuilt, very quiet compared to the wrangler
RELIABILITY!


Jeep had:
4.0L inline 6
terrible axles
weak drivetrain
unreliable
loud
cheap
ugly





You go to a dealer, which looks more appealing?

This:

Or this:

 

[lugueto]

Well, these vehicles being so spartan there's obviously much less to go wrong.

However, if you ask me, there's a couple of things they did IMO from 2008 up.

1) Rear axle width. Why they didn't stretch it to match the front is something I can't comprehend,
2) Seats. They brought the vehicle somewhat up to date enginewise with the V8s and the 1GR and they still used the same freaking seat from 1988? I can't believe it.

Everything else is just fine by me, I only use spartan vehicles so as long as they're fuel injected and have ABS, that's all I need.

 

[Gun Runner 5]

Leaf springs. probably fine when they were invented by the romans for their racing chariots, but coil springs were invented in 1857. Why did they wait until the 80 series to use this 'new' technology.

What‘s wrong with leaf springs?

 

[ceebs87BJ]

I think cost was a big reason they did not sell well in Canada. I read somewhere that in the mid/late 80's in you could get a BJ70 for something like $12-13k, while a CJ started at 7 or 8k. That's a huge difference!

 

[Gun Runner 5]

I think cost was a big reason they did not sell well in Canada. I read somewhere that in the mid/late 80's in you could get a BJ70 for something like $12-13k, while a CJ started at 7 or 8k. That's a huge difference!

Same issue Land Rover had back in the 60’s. (well one of their issues )

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

I think cost was a big reason they did not sell well in Canada. I read somewhere that in the mid/late 80's in you could get a BJ70 for something like $12-13k, while a CJ started at 7 or 8k. That's a huge difference!

That is a big difference indeed. I heard they only sold a few 100 of them in Canada?

Looking at those numbers, it is amazing how times have changed though. Average salary in Canada in 1986 was $24k a year. Average salary in Canada in 2019 was $52k a year.

BJ70 new in 1986 cost $12k. A basic new 70 series today costs $63k (AUD converted to CAD).

So 70 series costs five times more, but we're only payed twice as much. I've noticed this with cost of vehicles in general, and especially cost of houses. The dollar does not go as far as it used to. I was born at the wrong time...lol.

 

[SNLC]

I have no issues with belts or timing chains but sticking to a gear driven timing and cam setup I like better.

8” hp front axle, Patrols got 9.5” hp front so

More turbo engines in the 70-series *cough* 1HDX series *cough*
That is about it really for any complaints I would have.

I like their simplicity but the better Cruiser engines and a bigger front axle would have been nice.


Cheers

 

[Gun Runner 5]

All these “negatives” and yet there are dozens of threads titled “When Is Toyota Bringing The 70 Series To The U.S.?”
Kinda Ironic.

 

[flx]

1) Rear axle width. Why they didn't stretch it to match the front is something I can't comprehend,
2) Seats. They brought the vehicle somewhat up to date enginewise with the V8s and the 1GR and they still used the same freaking seat from 1988? I can't believe it.

1) In an interview some years ago, the project manager explained that the 2007 update was supposed to be a small update but to fit the V8 they got dragged in a big update of front design and front axle so re-designing the rear axle was out of question. => On a sidenote a lot of Youtuber like to cry about this and pay a ton of money to ruin the reliability in swapping a Toyota axle by an aftermarket axle but in the real world people cross the Sahara with bone stock 79 highly overloaded without a sweat.

2) I often heard that discomfort was a kind of feature of the 70. Most buyer are corporate / NGO / armies and they know their employees that will drive them will not care a single second about the vehicle, so discomfort = driving slower on bad terrain and preserving the vehicle.

That is a big difference indeed. I heard they only sold a few 100 of them in Canada?

Looking at those numbers, it is amazing how times have changed though. Average salary in Canada in 1986 was $24k a year. Average salary in Canada in 2019 was $52k a year.

BJ70 new in 1986 cost $12k. A basic new 70 series today costs $63k (AUD converted to CAD).

So 70 series costs five times more, but we're only payed twice as much. I've noticed this with cost of vehicles in general, and especially cost of houses. The dollar does not go as far as it used to. I was born at the wrong time...lol.

I don't think the Australian price is representative for your example. I think a 70 series in a de-taxed context or in Africa starts under 35k€.

 

[GTSSportCoupe]

I don't think the Australian price is representative for your example. I think a 70 series in a de-taxed context or in Africa starts under 35k€.

Australia is the closest market to what Canada would be today though. Africa is very different. In any case, 35k Euro is still $52k CAD. So my point remains valid.