Just going replace the 2L in my 94 2wd hilux LN85 with a 5L I got out of a 2000 hiace. The 5l Pump has a thing on the top that looks like a boost compensator but is not, does anyone know what it is? Can I take it off and swap the top off the 2l Pump, or fit the 2l Pump to the 5l engine. I am making a new intake manifold and it is in the way. I plan to run 60psi with compound turbos.
5L Pump or 2L Pump 60psi boost (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Boosted
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GTSSportCoupe
2LTE abuser
It's probably an altitude compensator, but I'd have to look in the manual to know for sure. I do have .pdf versions of the 5L manual from toyota if you want. I think the altitude compensator is basically the same as a boost compensator, but you'd have to read into it. Maybe need a different fuel pin etc. for a turbo system.
Edit: Found the manuals I've posted before. RM520E and RM582E are the ones that include the 5L. They're at this link: Builds - My build thread
- Thread starter
- #4
I swapped the top of the 2L pump because that compensator is going to be in the way of the intake manifold I am making, just wondering what it did
Do you know what the numbers on the bottom of the pump tag mean
2L 0.9 40
5L 0.7 22
I would have thought the 5L would have higher numbers
GTSSportCoupe
2LTE abuser
It may have something to do with injection timing setting, but I'm not sure. Here are the links to the manuals if you didn't get them from the other thread. I have another manual for the 5LE if you need it also. I'll have to host it somewhere.
RM520E (Main for 2L, 3L & 5L engines)
Dropbox - 2L 3L 5L ENGINE RM520E.pdf
RM582E (Supplement for 2L, 2L-T, 3L and 5L engines)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/1joci2o0xtg6ujv/2L%2C2L-T%2C3L%2C5L ENGINE SUP. RM582E.pdf?dl=0
GTSSportCoupe
2LTE abuser
Just a thought. I've never heard of anyone running 60psi on an indirect injection diesel? I know it's done on new direct injection common rail diesels, but they are lower compression and have better injection systems.
Second thought, I don't think the factory 10mm injection pump will provide nearly enough fuel to match 60psi. I think you'd need a custom built 12mm pump to really make use of all that air.... Running more boost (than needed to achieve a safe AFR) results in loss of efficiency. Meaning, if you cant fuel enough for 60psi, there is no point in running that high.
That said, a compound turbo system can have other advantages like a broader power band. If the turbos are carefully chosen.
Will be quite the beast to behold in any case!
Second thought, I don't think the factory 10mm injection pump will provide nearly enough fuel to match 60psi. I think you'd need a custom built 12mm pump to really make use of all that air.... Running more boost (than needed to achieve a safe AFR) results in loss of efficiency. Meaning, if you cant fuel enough for 60psi, there is no point in running that high.
That said, a compound turbo system can have other advantages like a broader power band. If the turbos are carefully chosen.
Will be quite the beast to behold in any case!
Most boost i've seen with the fuel to match from a IDI engine in a 4x4 is a 2H that produces 287rwkw on 45psi which ran a 12.7 @ 102mph down the strip. Then just a fraction behind the 2H is the 1HZ stroker running 283kw also at 45psi (It did make 1261Nm and 378kw with some NOS).
But with non 4x4's there's chit loads of IDI engines like the Merc OM606/605 etc that are running that much boost, most of them are race/drift cars though.
Looking forward to seeing how you go with your setup @Boosted , any idea which turbos you're using yet?
- Thread starter
- #9
Yeah not sure if the pump will have enough fuel to make 60psi but I will have go. I don’t think a diesel can have to much air, not enough air and too much fuel would be more of a problem. Too much boost is hard on turbos that’s why you do compound so each turbo has a lower pressure ratio.
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- #10
Yeah I know IDI is a bit gay, I think it is definitely a limiting factor a lot of heat and energy is left in the pre combustion chamber. I do have a 1KD motor that I would like to make mechanical injection for.
The turbos I am using is the ones I have spare a T2554 for the primary and a GT2876R for the secondary. I will post a pic in the next few days I am making the manifold at the moment
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- #11
Not sure how sure how strong the crank but I am gonna find out. Just the standard 2wd hilux G box similar to a Toyota W box should be good for around 400hp I would lucky to make 3/4 of that. I would like to convert to auto but I don’t want to $1500. For second hand 300+k auto.
Have you done the maths on turbo sizing?
A lot of 2.8's (3L) wore out cranks when turbocharged because the cranks weren't hard enough. It's torque that kills gearboxes. 300hp (222kw) at 4000rpm is 530Nm.
To get 530Nm with a BSFC (efficiency) of around 300g/kwh you'll need to inject around 110 cc/1000 shots (that's doable depending on your injection pump plunger size).
To burn that much fuel cleanly and safely (A/F 18:1) you'll need 45 lb/min of airflow. 600 CFM.
To fit that much air into a 3 litre engine with 80% VE and a decent intercooler you'll need about 45psi (PR 4).
I have a map for a 2009 GT2876R. It's close to tapped out at 45lb/min and you'll want to run it with a PR of about 2.5 to get decent efficiency from it. That pulls the little one down to a PR of 1.6
The turbo sizing I've only run one rpm on (because it's a full days work to do a complete engine rpm range) and that's 4000rpm for max power.
I've used a 0.86 housing on the big turbo and a 0.64 on the small.
Wastegate the big turbo to 22psi.
Wastegate the little turbo to 45psi (max boost).
Small turbo is generating 28kw of power. Big turbo is generating almost 46kw of power.
Your intercooler has to shed 55kw of heat to drop the intake temp to 60C.
Drive pressure should be around 63psi.
Net power around 187kw.
You can do better with a bigger big turbo. Especially on the turbine side. These two have turbines that are too close in flow numbers to work well in a compound set.
I haven't checked spool up. My preference is to go with a smaller small turbo. But that one shouldn't be horrible.
You'll need a decent sized air-filter with a good cold air feed.
Good luck.
GTSSportCoupe
2LTE abuser
^^ That's great info; definitely worth paying attention to that. Dougal knows his stuff! I've learned a lot from his posts over the years.
45psi seems like a good goal. If you could find yourself a 12mm 1KZ-T injection pump, you should be able to achieve some pretty impressive power numbers. I know a 1KZ-T head/plunger can be put on the L series injection pumps. China sells the 1KZ-T pump heads/plungers pretty cheap. I've always wondered about the quality though.... I've got a spare pump and might try converting it to 12mm for the heck of it sometime (2LTE pump with 1KZTE head/plunger).
45psi seems like a good goal. If you could find yourself a 12mm 1KZ-T injection pump, you should be able to achieve some pretty impressive power numbers. I know a 1KZ-T head/plunger can be put on the L series injection pumps. China sells the 1KZ-T pump heads/plungers pretty cheap. I've always wondered about the quality though.... I've got a spare pump and might try converting it to 12mm for the heck of it sometime (2LTE pump with 1KZTE head/plunger).
- Thread starter
- #14
No haven’t done the math
Yeah I have had this 2876 since 2009 so that map should be right. I am just going off my limited experience, I had that turbo on a 2L and it was a bit to big no boost under 2000rpm set up free floating running 30-35psi no intercooler. Then I swapped to the T2552 turbo off a CA18 Nissan 200sx this was a good match for the 2L coming on boost 16-1700rpm. So I think they would be a good compound set up for the 2L, but you are right might be a bit small for the 5L. If so I might rebuild the 2L with some stronger piston pins.
the pic is my old 2L with the small turbo.
- Thread starter
- #15
But my boost gauge goes to 60 seems like a waste not to use all of it, Lol
Ok I might look for some 1kz pump parts, does the head fit or does it require Engneering. Stuff from China is a bit hit or miss, sometimes great sometimes a waste of metal.
Ok I might look for some 1kz pump parts, does the head fit or does it require Engneering. Stuff from China is a bit hit or miss, sometimes great sometimes a waste of metal.
60psi is a good range for a drive-pressure guage.
GTSSportCoupe
2LTE abuser
I've seen pictures of the 1KZ pump head/plunger being put on the 2LT-II pump body. A fellow detailed it with pictures etc. I don't think there was any custom engineering involved. I can't find the thread for the life of me now (it was on another forum). Probably best to have an injection shop do it though, or at least test it before installing to your motor....
I looked at some 5L piston pictures on the web just now and was surprised some had cooling passages in the crown as well. The 3L doesn't have this. Only the 2LT-II/2LTE from what I've seen before. The 5L pictures were not OEM parts, and not all had the passages. Hopefully Toyota did put them in at the factory.... The oil squirters in the block shoot oil up and it circulates through the internal passage to cool the piston crown. Protect against high EGT's I guess....which won't be a problem for you, hahaha.
Your problems with the 2LT before might have been because of injection timing? Might have to retard base timing a bit if running so much boost; especially if you have no intercooler.
Lol yes indeed, only live once so make the most of it!
Besides if it's setup correctly your EMP gauge doesn't need to go as high as the boost gauge because boost will always be higher than EMP in a well thought out and optimised setup, especially on a compound setup where it's quite easy to achieve
GTSSportCoupe
2LTE abuser
The 2LTE and 2LT-II of that vintage had ceramic fiber reinforced ring lands (I found an old SAE paper on them). Maybe the 5L has something similar? Or Toyota may have gone to regular alfin style reinforcement. I can say that after years of 20psi and fuel to match, the piston ring clearances in my old 2LTE short block were well within spec still and looked great. Still have the pistons on a shelf actually. Rods and crank too for that matter.
Edit: Found a picture of an OEM 5L piston.
