hj 45 fuel feed pump strange mistery connection

[tornio]

Hello guys, looking for a possible source of air into the fuel circuit I noticed that my lift pump (feed pump) is connected the wrong way: in the manuals and photos I have seen here on the site, the inlet is towards the tank and the outlet towards the radiator with a metal tube that carries the diesel to the filter... as you can see in my vehicle it is the opposite... I am confused... on the other hand, everything seems original..... the truck run....

from this site like factory manual

thi is mine you can see the inlet (yellow circled) , the outlet red circled ...?????....

also this pipe (copper i believe) seems factory

but the pipe that goes from the feed pump outlet to the filter is not all hard line as you can see while from the filter to the pump it is hard line as per the manual

very very strange ...

has anyone already seen an assembly like mine ?

what the copper pipe does?

i see that also the priming pump is on the right of the housing and the check valve chamber plug is on the left ...
Even though this seems logical to me, after all the engine runs ...
I have my doubts that perhaps this feed pump is not a Toyota derivative but maybe a Mercedes or something else, after all it's a Bosch style.

every piece of advice will be greatly appreciated

 

[duncanrm]

I like your theory that the feed pump was from a different vehicle. Anyone know if the B/3B engines feature a feed pump that has inlet/outlet reversed for operation on the left hand side of the engine?

 

[tornio]

hi duncanrm, my 40 and my 42 all have inlet toward the tank and outlet toward the filter...
but if the feed pump is from a different vehicle why the copper tube seems factory ?

 

[tornio]

i discovered these photo :

this is my 45 when the PO did the camper conversion (1996)

and this photo before conversion

you can see that there was the same hose/pipe orientation

but this was in the 1996 ... the truck is an 1976 so there is no warranty that the feed pump was factory....


i'm confused...

 

[duncanrm]

I really do feel another lift pump from a different vehicle has been used and the system replumbed.

I've never seen a factory copper pipe like that on a Toyota diesel

Those photos are very cool, so nice to have some history on your vehicle.

 

[tornio]

What do you think the copper tube is used for?
at that point it should be the air bleeder.... black circle , at this point i think that i can cut / delete this tube and the connection at feed pump inlet ...

By any chance, do you know what the yellow circled piece means or what it is for?
THE FSM call it injection pump cleaner ... ?

 

[duncanrm]

All odd.. they do appear to have plumbed the pump body bleed point back to the inlet of the lift pump.. the 12HT had this done from factory. I do feel you can delete it without issue.. but you'd need to reseal the bleed point somehow.

I think you are right to be suspicious of all that non standard fuel plumbing.

For sucking air, here's my checklist for the 2H..

2H - Sucking Air/Fuel Restriction

docs.google.com

 

[tornio]

By any chance, do you know what the blue circled piece means or what it is for?
THE FSM call it injection pump cleaner ... ?

 

[duncanrm]

By any chance, do you know what the blue circled piece means or what it is for?
THE FSM call it injection pump cleaner ... ?

I am not entirely sure what that is..

If the lower part of the pump doesnt have an engine oil feed (like the 2H pump) I am wondering if its some kind of breather.. some of the earlier B series pumps that didn't have an engine oil feed had a dipstick to check the oil level in the pump.. have you opened it up?

 

[LDRF]

What do you think the copper tube is used for?

For plumbing the ice maker?

I wouldn't expect any copper tubing in a factory engine. That would be backyard/shade-tree mechanic stuff. It's been working for, at least, 29 years, so you'll probably want to keep it. You can always try to tighten the banjo fittings and/or open them up and tighten them down, if you suspect an air leak at the connections. There may be copper washers that you may need to replace if you open it up.

 

[tornio]

If the lower part of the pump doesnt have an engine oil feed (like the 2H pump) I am wondering if its some kind of breather.. some of the earlier B series pumps that didn't have an engine oil feed had a dipstick to check the oil level in the pump.. have you opened it up?

yes i know it , my 40 has this earlier b engine
on the 45 I changed the oil of the pump a little while ago.

I know your documentation about air problems and the others , GREAT WORK
THANK'S to share

for the air , i have a lot of copper whasher and i bought the primer pump because I suspect that it is the cause....
I changed the hose from chassis to lift pump and the hose from lift pump to filter so this section would be fine
to be honest when i replaced the fuel filter that is the old immersion style i had to disturb one of the two banjo and i didn't replace the whasher...
so my plan is :
1 replace the whasher and the "o-ring" at the filter air bleed
2 replace the primer pump
3 tighten a little the banjos
4 install a new hose from tank straight to lift pump then install a transparent hose from lift pump to filter to see if there is air
if there is no air install a new hose from tank to chassis hard line to check if this line is ok
5 because my plumbing from lift pump to filter is not factory I think of modifying it like the bj40/42 : banjo with hydraulic hose crimped

have a good day!

 

[tornio]

I wouldn't expect any copper tubing in a factory engine.

yes there is no evidence in any manual but probally this tube is not the cause of the problem

 

[tornio]

hello guys,
the hj is at mechanic shop ( bosch diesel specialist)
he has rebuild the injectors (nozzles ecc) , changed the pump diaphragm and yes now the hj It's going much better than before...
BUT like i suspected before also him believes that there is air sucking problem so we have agreed to replace the fuel feed pump

my problems now is : which is the number of fuel feed pump ?
the pump istalled now has no useful number and we know it is not toyota factory

on amayama i found
22510-48010 from 1972 to 1977
or
22510-77130 from 1977 to 1980

the truck is 1976 so the answer is simple but it is not simple to find the factory one's here in italy

my question are :
22510-48010 and 2250-77130 They look the same, in your opinion , are they ?

and more :
the fuel feed pump i have on the 40 and on the 42 they look the same from what i can see .... are they ?

amayama listed
22510-56010 1974 to 77
22510-56040 1977 to 80
they all look the same....humm

Can someone help me ?

 

[duncanrm]

my question are :
22510-48010 and 2250-77130 They look the same, in your opinion , are they ?

and more :
the fuel feed pump i have on the 40 and on the 42 they look the same from what i can see .... are they ?

amayama listed
22510-56010 1974 to 77
22510-56040 1977 to 80
they all look the same....humm

Can someone help me ?

The lift pump (feed pump) are very simple little pumps.. not highly calibrated.. if the outlet, and inlet are on the correct sides for your application and they visually look the same in form factor then you wont have an issue. It will work.

Has your mechanic ruled out all other causes of air?

This guide I wrote for the 2H is relevant, but this is simple stuff for any experienced diesel mechanic so hopefully your mechanic has checked all other causes.

2H - Sucking Air/Fuel Restriction

docs.google.com

 

[tornio]

hi duncanrm, the mechanic has a lot of experience every day he rebuild injector or h/pump ...
but no time for me , he has a lot , a ton of work to do and he is doing ma a favor
so i don't think he has ruled out all other causes of air but we will do

he only asked me : if necessary you are able to find the factory feed pump ?

For this reason, I am looking in advance

like said the hj runs well now , no smoke ( a very little ) but when it stay stopped some day it struggles to restart , smoke and misfiring : AIR

i have buoght clear hoses and If my friend has time this weekend, we will go hunting for air.

thanks