1978 M416A1 Build (1 Viewer)

[iptman]

I got the rest of the frame broken down and axle pulled, loaded it up on a pallet and put in the shed until I can find someone to sand blast it. I need to get some Koyo bearings ordered and the replacement master cylinder. I'll probably make new brake lines with nicopp and use the factory ones as a guide. I also need to pull the wheel cylinders apart and see if they're re-useable. I want to strip all the paint and grease off all the fasteners. So far I've bagged and labeled them all so I might need to sit down and inventory and measure everything before dunking them all. I'll start on the wiring and lights too.

 

[iptman]

What do you guys think about paint versus powder coat for the frame, axle and surge brake bracket and support leg? My thought was to go black for the frame and a FDE like color for the tub and fenders.

 

[KZN130Alabama]

What do you guys think about paint versus powder coat for the frame, axle and surge brake bracket and support leg? My thought was to go black for the frame and a FDE like color for the tub and fenders.

I did flat black rustoleum (it was sandblasted so I didn't feel like POR15 was super necessary at this point) on the frame, axle, brakes and basically everything underneath. I did black raptor liner on the inside of tub and grey raptor liner on the outside of tub. I primed everything obviously.

 

[ntsqd]

Prepped correctly, and cured in a moist environment POR is remarkably tough stuff. I know of a rear axle housing that was coated with POR about 20 years ago that has occasionally been getting rock, grit, and sand blasted and doesn't show it. I coated Patch's front bumper with it (doing an amature prep job) and got about 20 years out of it before the on-shore winds blew in the rust off the ocean onto it. Prepping and coating with Rustoleum after that was only good for a couple of years each time.

I'd guess that not living on the Left Coast Lower Coastal Desert would buy you more time with Rustoleum, but I know that POR will last longer.

 

[iptman]

Do you think POR is tougher than powder coat? I got the quote back for blasting and powder coating. $600-800 for blasting, $600-800 for powder coating everything. But I don't think I'd have him powder coat the tub or fenders, just the frame and axle. I could definitely do the POR myself and save a good bit of money although POR isn't inexpensive. I don't plan to bash this thing in the rocks at all. The worst case would be doing a longer excursion out through Colorado or Utah. I'll probably paint the tub and fenders myself. I've been wanting to learn how to spray so figured this would be a good opportunity. Maybe I'll roll POR on the tub and fenders and spray over top of it with the color I want.

 

[ntsqd]

I'd really read up on Moisture Curing Polyurethane Coatings (MCPC) because that is what POR-15 is. POR-15 is easy to get, but it might not be my first choice.

The problem with powder-coating is when it gets pierced. Once that happens moisture can get under it and then eventually the rust loosens it and the powder-coat comes off in sheets. Factor in that your tow vehicle(s) are going to be slinging rocks and grit at all of the exposed forwards facing surfaces and powder-coating doesn't seem like a good idea for those areas.

Taken to an extreme you'd want those areas covered in bed liner or "Helicopter Tape" (which the same stuff that late model trucks & SUV's have covering high abrasion areas). From my experience with POR it would be a reasonable compromise, however POR specifically has issues with UV exposure. On my bumper and front axle projects I waited until the POR was just tacky and then top-coated it with Rustoleum aerosol. That considerably slowed down the curing of the POR (at least a week longer), but it also shielded it from UV light. You don't want to wait until POR has fully cured to top coat it because then you'll need to scuff it for good adhesion, and that isn't easy or fun. There are other MCPC's sold for auto hobby use that may be better about UV resistance. I used an industrial MCPC on a trailer that has had no problem with UV exposure, but if anything it is too brittle for a trailer as it chips too easily.

 

[Gretsch]

I'll probably paint the tub and fenders myself. I've been wanting to learn how to spray so figured this would be a good opportunity.

That's how I ended up doing things after I got a quote to powder coat that stuff on mine. Bantam T3-C but same sort of trailer. I didn't even have a spray gun before this but spent $150 on a hose, gun, drier assembly for my compressor and some single stage paint and painted it myself. I will say if I had to do it again I would likely use something a little more forgiving and easier to touch up than single stage. I have all sorts of blemishes on it from use which are not as easy to fix as just some flat quality spray can stuff. I did have the wheels powder-coated though. HTH.

 

[ntsqd]

I bought an Harbor Fright HVLP with a remote paint pot to paint the ex kitchen cabinets that I put in the garage. I used Rustoleum on them.

 

[iptman]

Working on getting all the fasteners derusted and degreased. Using a HF rock tumbler, media and ultrasonic cleaner with Purple Power. So far so good. I've been running the tumbler media dry and it's been working pretty well. This last time I'm trying it wet with 50/50 purple/water.

 

[iptman]

Most of the fasteners look to have a zinc type finish on them (maybe something else from the 70s?). Should I run them as it or will this poly media and/purple power remove it?

 

[ntsqd]

They likely have a cadmium plating on them and anything abrasive or aggressively corrosive will degrade that plating.

 

[iptman]

They likely have a cadmium plating on them and anything abrasive or aggressively corrosive will degrade that plating.

Yeah I was afraid of that. The media I'm using is some sort of plastic and I'm trying to pull the parts out of the ultrasonic cleaner shortly after the cycle is done so hopefully there's some plating left. Most of these fasteners were painted over but I was hoping to paint all the parts separately then assemble.

 

[iptman]

I just dropped the tub, fenders and frame off with the media blaster/powder coater/painter. He said he's very confident the powder coat will be durable. He said PC coming off in sheets after a chip is caused by poor prep and ensures me it wouldn't happen. He's fine giving it back to me primered too though. If he powder coats he'd do a layer of PC primer before doing the PC top coat color. It'd certainly be nice to get everything back ready to reassemble. What do you guys think?

 

[iptman]

I finally got my parts back from the powder coater. I just need to figure out what to do with all the fasteners. i don't want to start reusing them and they just start rusting. It'll also be a pain to measure each one and buy all new zinc coated fasteners. What do you guys think? I wonder if there's a list of sizes and quantities over on Steel Soldiers.

 

[iptman]

I got my 40's fuel lines replaced so out it goes and in with the M416. I got new C shackles and spring pins. I decided not to do anything with the springs. I figure they've lasted 40 years with the 70s era paint and grease so why try to do any better. I plan to woolwax them later though. I'm going to use Massey Ferguson implement paint on the wheels. It's what I used on my 40 wheels and it's held up well.

 

[iptman]

I'm using the bushing that came with the new shocks and I can't get them squeezed in enough to get the washers on. Do I need to take the shocks off and grease them up so they'll slide/squish in?

 

[iptman]

Ran in to another snag. The 4 layers of powder coat (between them) on these parts is too much for them to seat together properly which is causing holes not to line up on the front A arms and I bolts. I don't want to grind off powder coat but I don't see any other way to get these seated.

 

[iptman]

I took everything apart this morning and was able to get holes lined up this time around. The C channels are still bowing a bit but I'd rather that then grind away powder coat. I got the backing plates and brakes reinstalled and the new master cylinder.

 

[iptman]

Here's a tip for anyone rebuilding an M416. Don't powder coat the shock mounts. The washers are a really tight clearance and I had to take them down to metal to get them to work. Obviously you can drill them out but I don't have a drill press.

 

[iptman]

Service brake installed and I didn't even need to adjust the brake shoes. I'm really hoping they don't need to be adjusted to make the surge brake work properly.