Wolf Den needs work badly before trails open.

[krzyabncanuck]

Guys, OUR trail needs work done before the trails open. Our rock bridge has backfired and it is not working the way it is supposed to. I found this after working all day on Daniel and went to glance at our trail late yesterday afternoon after everyone was gone. I will post pictures today about what i am talking about but lets just say the water is tearing our trail up right now. The water is not going thru the rocks but down into that wide area where we had parked the trucks and has made its own little creek in our trail which is the opposite of what we wanted. Had there been more than just me there yesterday we could of done something to try and fix it temporarily, but i had walked into the trail and did not have any tools with me in the truck either.

I am going to call Terry ( USFS ) tomorrow but we will need to do something here very soon out there. You will see by the pictures i will post off of my phone here soon. Brian, might need your wife to look at these pictures also and see what she thinks we can do to fix it permanently.

 

[mtweller]

Is a concrete tube and bridge over that an option?

 

[krzyabncanuck]

Not at this point. No funds for it at all.

 

[krzyabncanuck]

We have to fix this with stuff we have at this point .

 

[southerncruiser62]

One option is if funds aren't available and they need RCP or other such utility items some local utility subs my have leftover job materials they would be willing to donate. I have a relative at Fred Smith company (large grading and utility company) that I'm happy to ask. If they have what we need it would just be a matter of transport.

Let me know if anyone wants me to ask.

 

[krzyabncanuck]

 

[krzyabncanuck]

 

[krzyabncanuck]

There are some pictures of what I am talking about. Not easy to see it but the water hits the rocks and then goes around them to then travel down the trail. I am afraid this is going to tear this trail up bad as creeks are not supposed to go down the trails at all.

 

[jfz80]

I was a bit concerned about that when I saw some of the pics from last month. But awesome amount of work completed. Nothig wrong with tweaking a project to get it right. After all Rock is solid and water flows around it so when filling in a low zone you've effectively reduced the cross sectional area to flow through. Couple that with a wet winter season.

If equipment is available then we could open it back up and define a crossable swale, staple some geotex fabric down and then add the rock back. I can donate fabric and staples.

A better solution in my eyes would be pipe for sure.

NDS plastic has. 12000 crush rating once below 12" of gravel. Which may be deep for that spot depend on daylight level. . Unfortunately a drop inlet box a that size gets pricey and would require occasional maintenance but we are there on a regular basis.

Another option may be sticks of perforated s&d pipe. Bell ends to keep coupler cost out and stacked 3 wide and two deep in swale as described above. . Recover and fill swale with gravel. Maybe some smaller grade if avail.

Would be easier to say for certain in person. If no donated materials become available I could price the two pipe options above.

 

[77cruiser]

While I physically can't be there I am happy to chip in for equipment rentals or materials.

Jason/darin let me know how I can help once you figure out a game plan.

 

[Rice]

H2O

Jason,

Sign me up for labor when you go down. Enough Aleve in me and I'm good for a 10 hour day.

Rice

 

[krzyabncanuck]

Just left a message on Terry phone. I am waiting to see what she says we can do before we come up with something not approved. Why I was wanting Brian's wife to look at the pictures.

 

[custyota]

Can we make this our project for the meet and greet weekend?

 

[SchniperJB]

I am down for 3/15 work day. I might be able to squeeze in a weekday workday, depending on my work calendar.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Holy hell, that backfired bigtime. Who approved that project, seems way worse now

Let me know when and I can make it down to fix her up if we don't do it on the M&G weekend.

 

[Burt88]

That's gonna happen at every location where the logs were replaced with rocks. Sediment always fills in and water will find the path of least resistance. A pipe is the only way to fix that permanently. The logs were better because they allowed more space underneath them for water to erode downward keeping the creek in its natural path. Piling rocks like that into a creek is just another way to dam it up. I guarantee that every creek crossing where this rock method was implemented will do the same thing. If a berm is built to keep the water in the same path.... well, it's gonna be an ongoing battle that drains labor and funds. It needs to be piped for at least 5X the expected water flow, at least. Just my two cents from a life of experience dealing with drainage and runoff. Something tells me there was an engineer that had something to do with the rock idea.

 

[krzyabncanuck]

Mike. I agree. I have no earthly clue who made this decision. Just now have to try and fix what was not broke.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Mike. I agree. I have no earthly clue who made this decision. Just now have to try and fix what was not broke.

If we can get a backhoe in there, it wouldn't take us more than a day to lay a nice big culvert in that spot.

 

[SchniperJB]

More Rocks! Johnny, bring your trailer!

 

[krzyabncanuck]

Just got off the phone with Terry and she is going to have the FS engineer go out there and figure out the size of the culvert we would need to put in. Then we have a go ahead to put one in, instead of these rocks.