Water softener / filter suggestions?

[MoJ]

New house with a well and I have hard water. I verified with a few test strips and it was at the max of the color range. I also believe I have an issue with very fine sediment. It's my understanding that in this case I need both a whole house filter and a softener. At this point I can't even wash a car at home because it spots very quickly.

Anyone have a good trouble-free system? I've been looking at the Maytag softener units at Lowe's for around $500. Is there an alternative to the potassium or salt based softeners? I'm not really looking forward to the slimey feeling that comes with a salt softener.

 

[reffug]

New house with a well and I have hard water. I verified with a few test strips and it was at the max of the color range. I also believe I have an issue with very fine sediment. It's my understanding that in this case I need both a whole house filter and a softener. At this point I can't even wash a car at home because it spots very quickly.

Anyone have a good trouble-free system? I've been looking at the Maytag softener units at Lowe's for around $500. Is there an alternative to the potassium or salt based softeners? I'm not really looking forward to the slimey feeling that comes with a salt softener.

I've got a whole house and softener both from Lowe's. I believe they were maytag if my memory serves and I have not noticed any slimey feeling. The dishwasher as well as the washing of cars now are both improved processes. I think the whole thing ran me about 800$ installed.

 

[MoJ]

I've got a whole house and softener both from Lowe's. I believe they were maytag if my memory serves and I have not noticed any slimey feeling. The dishwasher as well as the washing of cars now are both improved processes. I think the whole thing ran me about 800$ installed.

Thanks. Whenever I've showered at a house that has a softener installed I've noticed a feeling that you can't get all the soap off of you - slimey. You're using a salt based softener and haven't noticed it? No complaints from the wife?

 

[reffug]

Thanks. Whenever I've showered at a house that has a softener installed I've noticed a feeling that you can't get all the soap off of you - slimey. You're using a salt based softener and haven't noticed it? No complaints from the wife?

No as a matter of fact it was the wife that insisted I drop the coin to get the system where I was kinda like meh about the whole thing. However I do see the upside to fixtures lasting longer and looking better due to not having hard water stains which are a pain to clean. They are adjustable so you have control over how much softer your water will be.

 

[fsusteve]

Thanks. Whenever I've showered at a house that has a softener installed I've noticed a feeling that you can't get all the soap off of you - slimey. You're using a salt based softener and haven't noticed it? No complaints from the wife?

that's caused by a salt based system, I know the feeling. How about a whole house R/O?

 

[MoJ]

that's caused by a salt based system, I know the feeling. How about a whole house R/O?

It's my understanding that R/O would do nothing for hard water. With hard water the R/O sites recommend installing a softener upstream otherwise the filter membrane is clogged quickly by the minerals. I really like the taste of R/O water. Perhaps I could get a softener for hardness and then run it through a R/O for desalination.

 

[reffug]

It's my understanding that R/O would do nothing for hard water. With hard water the R/O sites recommend installing a softener upstream otherwise the filter membrane is clogged quickly by the minerals. I really like the taste of R/O water. Perhaps I could get a softener for hardness and then run it through a R/O for desalination.

Bet that would get kinda $$$$.

 

[nuclearlemon]

I got a salt softener system for the house along with the reverse osmosis whatever the heck it is system for the kitchen. love it. commerce city has the worst water in the us. it was a small fortune from aquaserve, about 2k iirc, but it's been well worth it. drinking water used to be brownish, now my ice cubes are crystal clear. only occasionally do i notice the slimey feeling when i shower.

 

[-Spike-]

Perhaps I could get a softener for hardness and then run it through a R/O for desalination.

You would probably want to run unsoftened water to the RO unit IIRC. Also, a whole-house RO unit isn't really feasible- it would run in the tens of thousands of dollars. I wouldn't be without RO water.

-Spike

 

[spressomon]

Have been using a Potassium Chloride (99% sodium free) whole house softener for the past 6-years. Works just fine...no slimy water feel. The downside to all softeners is how much water they waste apart of the process...and of course the $ on tablets each year....

 

[RavenTai]

will a water softener also remove iron and sulfur from well water?

 

[amos715]

water softener makes it easier to remove or filter sediment.

after trying to find a filter to remove iron i found none under $1200.

so i built a filter myself for about $300.00. an old pool filter filled with sand, birm and gravel. i inserted chorine pool tablets every month and had to manually back flush it. but i got my iron down to less than 1 part per million.

i got the bag of birm from these guys http://northerngravel.com/

the birm removes the iron, they have other stuff that will remove sulfur. sand removes the other sediments.

if it is for your home you might want to pay the bucks for a good media filter, you can physically pour a little bleach down your well from time to time and it will give your water the good community water feel.

 

[RavenTai]

I have heard of locals putting bleach in the well, this is actually at my moms property in FL, she originally had a shallow well (23') that had good clear water with only a little iron but it started to run dry during the dry season, had a new 40', 4" daim "deep well" and it gets very bad iron, you can pour a glass of water and it is somewhat clear at first but after 30 min there is a 1/4 is iron sludge at the bottom and a nasty smell, she is used to the taste, but does not like what it does to plumbing fixtures,

even though the original well cannot keep up with a electric pump it still has enough in it that I put on a hand pump for when the power is out.

Thanks for the info on the rool filter setup, heading down there this week, gonna get a water sample and have it tested at the county so I know what exactly we are dealing with.

 

[amos715]

I have heard of locals putting bleach in the well, this is actually at my moms property in FL, she originally had a shallow well (23') that had good clear water with only a little iron but it started to run dry during the dry season, had a new 40', 4" daim "deep well" and it gets very bad iron, you can pour a glass of water and it is somewhat clear at first but after 30 min there is a 1/4 is iron sludge at the bottom and a nasty smell, she is used to the taste, but does not like what it does to plumbing fixtures,

even though the original well cannot keep up with a electric pump it still has enough in it that I put on a hand pump for when the power is out.

Thanks for the info on the rool filter setup, heading down there this week, gonna get a water sample and have it tested at the county so I know what exactly we are dealing with.

i knew a farmer had similar problem, if water ran constant it would dry his well in about an hour or two. took about that long to fill up again. so he got a holding tank and put a float valve switch in the well, when the well got high enough the pump switched on and filled the holding tank.

of course if the well is running dry and not refilling none of this matters.

the filter i biuld could be adapted with an automatic backflush valve, these valves where running about $300- $400 back when i built my filter. i decided to do the manual flush valves, about $60.00. if it was my moms drinking water i think i would go with the auto.

also make sure the pump is not setting on the bottom of the hole. it should be several feet from the bottom. and when the pump was first put it it should have been cycled for about two days non-stop. that should help reduce the sludge or sediment. both of those are easy to filter and when you filter those alot of the smell and iron will be removed.

that northern gravel company has a calcium something that is a good softener and you can build a treatment tube to pre treat the water before it hits the sand filter. and it will not have the salty taste.

 

[MoJ]

For those of you who have purchased an all-in-one tank softener from Lowe's etc ---- how often does it backflush?

 

[reffug]

once a day.

 

[Mace]

"hard" water is caused by dissolved calcium and magnesium. Water softeners replace the Ca/Mg salts with another type of salt. IMHO, I am not a big fan of them. BUt they do make it easier to get your car washed...

Iron removal is easiest with a flocculent. But that is cumbersome for the average home user.

There are some very cool whole house deionization filters out there that are not too expensive.. They do a very good job of removing the dissolved solids instead of just replacing solids...

The varrying filter medias that are available typically do not remove dissolved material but suspended material. Not to say they do not work. If the water is not in equilibrium with a certian Ion they will work very well..

You cannot remove calcium with calcium...

There have been studies that show that CL introduction into the wellbore can actually increase Arsenic concentrations. I would not do it personaly, but there have been a lot of people that have been doing it for years. A lot depends on the inital well water. BTW, if you need to add Cl to your well because of bateriological growth. You have bigger problems..

 

[Toyo FJ40]

Softeners work by a process call ion exchange. They give up a sodium atom for a calcium atom. They unit backwashes with salt to release the calcium and then flush itself with clean water. Then amount of salt that the unit puts into the drinking water is very small. Most of the salt goes down the drain. How often the softener has to regenerate is controlled by a clock or on more expensive units a water meter. Regeneration is dictated by your hardness and water use, the harder the water and the more water you use the more often it will need to regenerate. a 32000 grain unit in a house with 4 people with 15 grains of hardness will need to regenerate about 3 times a week.

There are a few softners that allow you to control the amount of softness by bypassing some of the water. But with most softners you can have soft or hard water not degrees of soft.


Kevin

 

[Mace]

Softeners do use an ion exchange method. But they replace calcium with sodium. It is not an "increase" in salts per se. It is more of an exchange of one salt for another..

 

[Toyo FJ40]

We have hard water in some areas and acidic water in others. My wells PH is 4.7 which is too low to treat with a neutralizer (a tank filled with crushed lime stone). I use a chemical feed pump with soda ash to bring the PH up to 7. The trouble is that the byproduct of the reaction is sodium so I get the salt without a softener.


Kevin