thinkin bout lightbars

[Nemesis Gnat]

so ive got a pair of hella 4000s on the roof right now along with my hi lift. the lights are just mounted to a thule crossbar with some lil brackets i made up, and the hi lift is just tied down to the crossbars of the thule rack.

but they sorta smack on stuff from time to time, and after a recent run in with a parking garage, i wanna move um to the front bumper

its a stock front bumper, but the wings (everything outside of the frame rails) are bent up and get frequent massaging courtesy of our good friend mr rock, so anything i make will have to attach inside the frame rails

now the 4000s are pretty deep, and i dont want um hanging way out front hangin up on stuff... so my idea is to cut the sides (everything outside of the word TOYOTA) out of a grill (not my grill, id pick up a junked one), and mount the lights set back into the cut out parts of the grill. i also want to make up some mounts for the hi lift in the same spot.

my first thought is a tube, running up to mount the lights on, with a lil hi lift bracket put somewhere below the top pf the hoop and light tabs and in front of the tube

my second thought is pendulum mounting the lights from a tube in a similar set up as above. i figure this will add some more protection, and frankly if i made some sturdy brackets, i could try to straighten my pretzel bumper and mount to it, maybe giving it a lil more support?

then reality hits my third thought... i dont have a tubing bender, and not only that, itd probably end up being painted black... yall think itll look too goofy if it were made out of square tubing and on a chrome bumper? all i have to work with here is a stick welder and an angle grinder with some spare change for scrap metal

i dunno, im just bouncin some ideas off you guys... any thoughts? any pics of similar set ups?

 

[Nemesis Gnat]

after lookin at it some more, i think that the way to do this will be to mount the lights regular style, and mount the bar outside the frame rails, but as close as possible to the frame on the bumper

i have a drawing i doodled during cad class, ill throw something together in about a week when i get my welder back and post it up

 

[Nemesis Gnat]

its been a lil while since i started thinkin about this, but over the last 2 nights i got something worked up during the breaks from workin on my buddies p/u... its not at all final, and has a design flaw or 2, but...

ill snap some pics in the mornin and see what yall think

 

[Nemesis Gnat]

so i guess no one is really that interested... but ill plow on ahead in case people are lookin and just dont really have much to say

anyways, heres my first draft of sorts, i wasnt sure about my measurements and the fitment and all, so i just made this doohicky out of some angle from another project. turned out alright i guess... sure enough you can set the lights back pretty far, theyre a couple inches back from being the leading edge on the front of the car

looks like when i redo it, ill do it with square tubing for the torsional rigidity, extend the uprights to get rid of the risers for the lights, incorporate a hi lift mount onto the uprights, and fit up some expanded metal or something for a grill with the lights recessed into it

whatcha think?

 

[cody c]

looks good, nice idea for keeping a more stock look to the front end by incorporating the front bumper!

 

[ntsqd]

Tube will be the move if you notice the lights "fluttering" on rough stretches. At the extreme it'll look like someone is rapidly turning them on and off. Either round or square will work. Round is best when you aren't sure of the direction of all of the forces, and OD means more for rigidity than does wall thickness.

 

[Nemesis Gnat]

ya i knew i was gonna get flicker with angle, thats sorta why i didnt try to hard to make proper cuts or good welds on this one...

the od vs. wall thickness thing is something i didnt know about... is there a reason why? and what directions of force does square tubing handle the best? material properties is the kinda stuff that really interests me

 

[ntsqd]

The very short course with lots of details ignored:

Picture an I-beam as used under a bridge. The web btwn the flanges basically serves to maintain the distance btwn the flanges. The flanges themselves take all of the load. The top is in compression and the bottom is in tension. If you need more load capacity, move the flanges further apart (more height in the beam).

Now put a square tube in there instead. The load is handled the same way. The sides only serve to keep the top and bottom the same distance apart. So ideal loading of square tube is when the load(s) are applied perpendicular to the sides. If you need more load capacity in the vertical direction, change to a rectangular tube with the large dimension oriented vertically. If you need more load capacity in the horizontal direction, move to a rectangular tube with the large dimension laid horizontally.

When the load comes to the beam at some odd angle is where round tube shines. It won't be any stronger than a square of the same size (it's actually a little weaker), but it is equally strong with the load coming from any direction unlike a square or rectangular beam. Not to mention that they're easier to use in building non recta-linear structures like roll cages.

The empirical formula (meaning derived from actual testing, not someone's theory) for the strength of a hollow section (round, square, rectangular) beam has the height of the beam to an exponent, where the wall thickness is simply linear. So doubling the OD could make the tube 16 times stronger, where doubling the wall thickness, at best and not very often, will only make it twice as strong.
There are places where you want wall thickness not for bending or tensile strength, but for abrasion and impact resistance.

I wish that colleges would teach Statics and Strengths of Materials at the Trigonometry level rather than being Calculus based as then they would be useful to far more people.

 

[Nemesis Gnat]

thanks!

 

[NorCalBorn]

been watching and I think the idea has merit. Only reason I didn't chime in earlier is my opinion don't count as I don't own a 60.

 

[Tinker]

Being Mr. Bad News (sometimes), it looks like another damage multuplier. If you hit anything with the lights they're going to hit the AC condenser & then the radiator.

Why don'tcha make a real HD bumper since you've been massaging rocks with the wings. Mine's 5" C-channel, bent back outside the frame with 1x2 box tubes reinforcing the ends to the 1/2" frame mounting plates which bolt on with 5 GR8 1/2" bolts on each side. (Also has 3 receivers: center for hitch & outsides for removable winch mount.)

Otherwise, you're (as my Dad would say) cutting a dog's tail off a little bit at a time.

 

[Nemesis Gnat]

the damage thing occured to me once i made my rough draft bar... and now that i managed to break another turn signal on a tree, im starting more and more to think about full on protection for the front end. i was already sorta thinkin about better front protection cause i spend a decent amount of time driving open highways and after a few close calls with cattle and other wildlife, i want a proper deerslayer front bumper

so now im weighin deals on premade bumpers vs makin my own...

 

[IrollwithTojo]

If you have some money to spend (which unfortunately I dont) I think you should go with a good ol ARB bullbar.

-Carl

 

[Nemesis Gnat]

im a professional mt biker... i can barely eat