New Shocks or Lifting...

[dtt255]

Do I have to wait for an actual kit to come out to lift the truck a few inches or is it just a matter of purchasing the products that produce the lift I need?

How do I figure out what shocks, springs, etc. For my acura I knew this....for a truck I have no idea!

 

[007-FJC]

Obviously, longer travel shocks = more flex. Taller springs = more lift, but your better off with a lift kit wich is spacers for the cheap stuff.

 

[dtt255]

Obviously, longer travel shocks = more flex. Taller springs = more lift, but your better off with a lift kit wich is spacers for the cheap stuff.

I understand that stuff. What I am wondering is do I have to wait until someone says.... 2008 or 200 series LC lift kit or how else do I know what would work on my LC?

 

[FirstToy]

you can look at the lift options for the 08 Tundra, that will be the most likely product that will actually fit your LC.
It would be a shame to get rid of those nice adjustable shocks you have on there tho! Maybe go for a spacer lift for now and call it good, that's what i'd do anyway.

 

[007-FJC]

you can look at the lift options for the 08 Tundra, that will be the most likely product that will actually fit your LC.
It would be a shame to get rid of those nice adjustable shocks you have on there tho! Maybe go for a spacer lift for now and call it good, that's what i'd do anyway.

The 200 LC doesn't have the adjustables. Were still not sure if the 200 and the Tundra have the same suspension.

 

[dtt255]

The 200 LC doesn't have the adjustables. Were still not sure if the 200 and the Tundra have the same suspension.

Is there a way I can find out? Something on the truck I can look at?

 

[dtt255]

you can look at the lift options for the 08 Tundra, that will be the most likely product that will actually fit your LC.
It would be a shame to get rid of those nice adjustable shocks you have on there tho! Maybe go for a spacer lift for now and call it good, that's what i'd do anyway.

I don't think I have adjustable shocks....

 

[007-FJC]

I don't think I have adjustable shocks....

Adjustable shocks is what Toyota calls TEMS (Toyota Electronically Modulated Suspension). Its basically a motor on each shock that adjusts the firmness of the shocks. Comfort mode makes the shocks react slow so you can have a fluffy ride, and Sport mode is to make them firm to keep the vehicle in a straight posture when maneuvering.

TEMS found its way in the Century, Crown, Cressida/Chaser/MarkII/Cresta, Supra, LS400/430/460, GX470, LX470, LandCruiser 100 vehicles. Its also found in the new LX570. The new 200 LC doesn't have it, unless Toyota might give it to the middle east just like they gave it to the 100 LC back in 98. The cons about these TEMS shocks is that since they have a rod for the adjustment valve inside the strut is that when they go out, they cost an arm, a leg and a left nut. I know based on my experience with my Supras and Cressidas.

On a Side note, HKS performance introduced a suspension module controller a while back for the Supra and Cressida to override the system and have a far more stiffer ride. Wonder if it works for the other vehicles? Just a thought.

 

[calamaridog]

You are going to have two basic suspension upgrades. First will be taller/stronger springs and replacement shocks. This would be your Old Man Emu (ARB) stuff. Your second option will be adjustable race style coilovers. This would be your Camburg or Donahoe type stuff.

I would try contacting ARB USA or one of their vendors like Slee Off Road and find out how long it will be until they ship some new replacement springs and shocks over here. If you want to clear a larger tire and upgrade your carrying capacity some, then OME stuff may fit your needs.

I would also contact Camburg Racing and Donahoe Racing. Don't mention either shops name to the other since they hate each other They have both worked on kits for the new Tundra. Both of these shops will be prepping for the Baja 1000 so you won't get hold of anyone until the race is over. If you want to haul ass, then this would be a good option for you.

You could even try calling Allpro in Hemet. They have done a bunch of products for the FJ Cruiser and new Tacoma trucks. Who knows, maybe they would want to check out your truck?

Or you can try and contact the shop that prepped the 200 series for SEMA and see what they say. Not sure who that was?

 

[hoser]

The cons about these TEMS shocks is that since they have a rod for the adjustment valve inside the strut is that when they go out, they cost an arm, a leg and a left nut. I know based on my experience with my Supras and Cressidas..

The actual shock for the TEMS shocks on a 100 can be had for $120-130 each. It is the damping force actuators/accumulators that can cost some money.

The TEMS/AHC suspension on the LX570 is supposed to be much more improved over the 100.

"Significant upgrades to the suspension and full-time four-wheel-drive system raise the LX to new levels of driving comfort and performance, on- and off-road. A Four-Wheel Electro-Hydraulic Suspension with Active Height Control (AHC) and Adaptive Variable Suspension is quicker and allows for a greater range of adjustment than the system it replaces. The new cross-linked system allows each wheel to react to the driving surface it is in contact with and also react to the actions of the opposing wheels. Using a valve at each corner and a center or master valve, the cross-linked suspension system detects the extension or deflection of each of the LX 570's 20-inch wheels and counters that with appropriate response at the opposite wheels.

The intelligence built into the LX 570's new suspension senses chassis roll and helps reduce that roll by more than 30 percent. The system also controls ride height quickly, lowering the chassis by an average of two inches for entry and exit and returning automatically to its normal height when the vehicle begins acceleration.

For improved aerodynamics, the new AHC system lowers the vehicle by nearly one inch in front and by a little more than a half inch in the rear at highway speeds. Finally, when the transfer case is shifted into low range, the AHC system raises the vehicle by approximately three inches to provide additional ride height in driving situations where chassis clearance is at a premium."

 

[dtt255]

You are going to have two basic suspension upgrades. First will be taller/stronger springs and replacement shocks. This would be your Old Man Emu (ARB) stuff. Your second option will be adjustable race style coilovers. This would be your Camburg or Donahoe type stuff.

I would try contacting ARB USA or one of their vendors like Slee Off Road and find out how long it will be until they ship some new replacement springs and shocks over here. If you want to clear a larger tire and upgrade your carrying capacity some, then OME stuff may fit your needs.

I would also contact Camburg Racing and Donahoe Racing. Don't mention either shops name to the other since they hate each other They have both worked on kits for the new Tundra. Both of these shops will be prepping for the Baja 1000 so you won't get hold of anyone until the race is over. If you want to haul ass, then this would be a good option for you.

You could even try calling Allpro in Hemet. They have done a bunch of products for the FJ Cruiser and new Tacoma trucks. Who knows, maybe they would want to check out your truck?

Or you can try and contact the shop that prepped the 200 series for SEMA and see what they say. Not sure who that was?

Thanks for the lead to AllPro in Hemet...that is about 45 min away! They also seem to be totally Toyota...so they will know the ins and outs of my truck....

They are closed on the weekend, but monday first thing!

 

[justimaginejack]

I am glad somebody is blazing the trail!
Check out the company that built the suspension parts, Kinetic...
http://www.kinetic.au.com/

Also, the Lexus GX has a similar set up to the 200 series LC, and Four Wheeler mag lifted and modified it with great succuss, If you are willing to be the First, I am sure they will help you and they would probable do an article on you for the Mag,


http://www.fourwheeler.com/projectbuild/129_0407_2004_lexus_gx470_customization/index.html

Also, the guy that Owns 4 wheel Drive Toyota owners mag is on here and he would want to do an article too, I imagine. Everyone will be willing to help. This is going to be awsome!

https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=178287
David Zartman and 4wdtoyotaowner.com

 

[007-FJC]

Well, in reality, the AHC is an airbag to replace the conventional coil spring. The TEMS unit is the shock absorber. The absorbers are the same technology as used in the old school Toyota cars, its just the settings. I've mentioned that HKS introduced a controller that overrides the stock controller and you can adjust to a far more stiffer setting than the Toyota sport mode. I guess Toyota found out that people sometimes want a stiffer ride for cornering so they put a real "Sport" setting.

 

[carboncycles]

If i recall the article jsutimaginejack is referring to, didn't four wheeler disable (i.e. rip out the KDSS suspension) to modify it? I don't think you can do an easy "upgrade" to the suspension with KDSS in it, but i could be wrong and it would be nice to see additional mods to it.

 

[007-FJC]

If i recall the article jsutimaginejack is referring to, didn't four wheeler disable (i.e. rip out the KDSS suspension) to modify it? I don't think you can do an easy "upgrade" to the suspension with KDSS in it, but i could be wrong and it would be nice to see additional mods to it.

That was project TrailLex. They didn't remove the KDSS. Why remove something you'd benefit from? KDSS senses that when your offroad and the suspension is articulating, KDSS releases the swaybars so you can get more wheel travel. Without it, the swaybars would be the main limit for the articulation.

 

[dtt255]

That was project TrailLex. They didn't remove the KDSS. Why remove something you'd benefit from? KDSS senses that when your offroad and the suspension is articulating, KDSS releases the swaybars so you can get more wheel travel. Without it, the swaybars would be the main limit for the articulation.

I read the article last night....all 4 parts

Great article, although the first rip apart of the GX looked like it was at a junk yard The end result was nice.

They mentioned that only thing that they wanted to change form stock equipment, which they did not change, was the gears.

Otherwise they left everything the way it was.

My biggest reason on wanting to know about changing the shocks is thinking about the additional weight that new bumpers and a 50 gal gas tank is going to weigh.

If getting springs is the better choice...then so be it. That is fine with me

The question I still don't know the answer to is HOW do I check what springs are in there (model, type, etc) so I know what I can change to.

Are they sizes like tires? Just some numbers I can look for and then see what else is available in that "size"? I don't mean to ask dumb questions. I am just trying to get a handle on WHAT to look for on the stock stuff, so I know WHAT to look for in new stuff.

I am sure the stock shocks are going to be great for a while...but adding those items is going to add alot of weight and it may just be better overall to replace either the shocks or springs to compensate.

I just don't know HOW to look for new ones, and WHAT to look for.

I don't want to be one of these owners who just waits for a company to say it works for this or that truck and just say "Ok, here is my Credit Card"

I want to know how to figure out what sizes fit, and why, so I can make an educated decision.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[sleeoffroad]

OK, you need to slow down. First off shocks does not give you lift, springs does. Other than trying to fit something from another similar vehicle, you are not going to find anything for that truck right now. The shocks and springs for that truck is specific for that vehicle.

The issues with fitting something else is firstly the dimensions, bolt/bushing sizes and mounting systems used. Secondly if you do find something from another vehicle that fits dimensionally it does not mean that the spring rate or dampening of the shocks would be even close to what you are looking for.

You can not just call someone and ask for XXX spring and YYY shocks. No-one will know. If we had that truck in the shop we would first figure the dimensional aspects out, then fit test parts and see how it handles.

It will be a while to get suspension kits for it. Most likely ARB will be the first, but to give you an idea we just received Tundra suspension parts and that is about a year after it was released.

Slow down and enjoy the truck. You do not have to rip it apart just to enjoy it. It is probably pretty capable in stock form, other than the plastic bumpers.

 

[dtt255]

OK, you need to slow down. First off shocks does not give you lift, springs does. Other than trying to fit something from another similar vehicle, you are not going to find anything for that truck right now. The shocks and springs for that truck is specific for that vehicle.

The issues with fitting something else is firstly the dimensions, bolt/bushing sizes and mounting systems used. Secondly if you do find something from another vehicle that fits dimensionally it does not mean that the spring rate or dampening of the shocks would be even close to what you are looking for.

You can not just call someone and ask for XXX spring and YYY shocks. No-one will know. If we had that truck in the shop we would first figure the dimensional aspects out, then fit test parts and see how it handles.

It will be a while to get suspension kits for it. Most likely ARB will be the first, but to give you an idea we just received Tundra suspension parts and that is about a year after it was released.

Slow down and enjoy the truck. You do not have to rip it apart just to enjoy it. It is probably pretty capable in stock form, other than the plastic bumpers.

That is just the information I wanted to know. Thanks for the help.

I have a better understanding now what is involved in this project.

Now here is another set of questions for you

The reason I am asking about the lifting and shocks is because of the extra weight of the bumpers and/or fuel tank.

So if I find a local (SoCal) shop to fabricate some bumpers for me, and even a gas tank, would I not be hard pressed for a solution to not let the whole truck drop like a rock?

I realize that by trying to find 1 or 2 solutions (new bumpers and fuel tank) that I may be creating 3 - 4 problems.

If that is the case then I need to look at that carefully.

There is no use (in my opinion) to get the bumpers and everything fabricated IF by doing that, I would end up making the truck drag so much that the fun of wheeling would be lost UNTIL someone comes up with a spring solution.

If I had a choice, I would rather have the fuel tank then the bumpers....at first. The ability to have 50 gallons, where I could go upwards of 500-600 miles on a tank would be much more worth it!

Then again that leads to the issue of moving of the spare tire for the extra tank room, and I know enough to know that I don't want to go wheeling without a spare. So a rear bumper would be optimal for storage of the tire, but I guess a roof solution could also work. Until bumpers are released and springs...etc.

Am I thinking correctly? (Meaning correctly along the correct path of wants, issues that arise from those wants, and then possible solutions?)

Thanks again for your help.

DANG I wish I lived closer to your location...don't you want to move your shop to SoCal?

 

[calamaridog]

Slow down and enjoy the truck. You do not have to rip it apart just to enjoy it. It is probably pretty capable in stock form, other than the plastic bumpers.

Good point to keep in mind dtt. Unless you just can't help yourself!

 

[dtt255]

Good point to keep in mind dtt. Unless you just can't help yourself!

I agree. I think my response to the post I think best describes my thoughts.

The only thing I am really really really wanting to do is the larger fuel tank. Then again, like I mentioned above, I cannot help but see the issue that arises with me doing a larger tank. Weight, then suspension, and spare tire.

You can see my thought process above.