Motorcycles: air or liquid cooled best? (1 Viewer)

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e9999

e9999

Gotta get outta here...
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been looking at buying a bike.

I see some new bikes being essentially in 2 versions: air and water cooled. Always had air cooled bikes myself.

So what are the main pros and cons of each. Obviously, another layer of potential problems with liquid so maybe less desirable for long expeds in the middle of nowhere, but probably better cooling.

Best way to go overall?
 
Water cooled has generally better performance, emissions and mileage due to a more consistent heat. it also has considerably longer service life. You can figure about two to one given the same maintenance. Again due to more consistent heating and the tolerances that the engines can be built to.

Water cooling adds complexity, weight and seemingly most importantly takes away from aesthetics. Many water cooled twins have hidden radiators and fake fins to try to look like air cooled engines.

BMW's oil heads are the only "air cooled" engine I would even consider on a modern bike. they are primarily oil cooled so I don't know if they count.

I would live with the higher rebuild rate and lack of heating in a Porsche 356 or 911.
 
are there significant chances of catastrophic failure of the liquid cooling system? Like water pump conking out or something like that? (I guess you'd see a serious leak.)
 
On or off road? On road, no reason not to go water cooled, they have the horsepower and the marginal weight increase is not a big deal. Off road, obviously, the water cooled pieces are more vulnerable to damage. My old KLR was water cooled, reliable, and a heavy turd offroad. My current DR350 will run circles around it in every way, more power, much less weight, but is not much for the highway in terms of comfort. Not so sure about the reliability based on water cooling part, many of the mid 80s 4 cylinders went thousands of miles without problems. Primarily off road? I'd go air. And on road? Your choice.
 
well, this thread is telling me more than I need to know...

I've spent allot of time looking at each bikes weight and as soon as I think I find the culprit I see this thread..


IH8W8:mad:

I'm looking for a dual sport cuz I don't want a bike that's only good for one thing. I think I'm going back to school (right at 2miles) and could use a runabout anyway since I live in the city and everything's close. I want a thumper for its simplicity, but it seems they don't get the above 60-70mpg like I thought they would. My plans was to motard it and just swap tires if I wanted to go off road.

Is a Honda XR650 water cooled?


I'm learning that all dual sports aren't what there cracked up to be, they all have there faults. They all have the places where they shine and places they don't. Seems like that water being up high goes with the "top heavy" comments I've been hearing.

That TW200(90mpg, ?mph topspeed) is looking good....if they'd only put another gear in it and about another 100-150c.cs I think I know what my next bike would be....



does anyone make a @400cc Dual sport? I'm thinking 250 is too small and beginning to think 650 is too big....



I like this review...

Yamaha TW200 review... no really - - (beware, long) - ADVrider
 
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Texx said:
On or off road? On road, no reason not to go water cooled, they have the horsepower and the marginal weight increase is not a big deal. Off road, obviously, the water cooled pieces are more vulnerable to damage. My old KLR was water cooled, reliable, and a heavy turd offroad. My current DR350 will run circles around it in every way, more power, much less weight, but is not much for the highway in terms of comfort. Not so sure about the reliability based on water cooling part, many of the mid 80s 4 cylinders went thousands of miles without problems. Primarily off road? I'd go air. And on road? Your choice.
Click to expand...

If thousands of miles is OK with you, and it is with the majority of the motorcycle riding public, then a well-built air cooled is fine.

If tens of thousands is more your speed, then water cooled is the way to go.

I don't know of any bikes that are prone to catastrophic cooling system failure except maybe the radiators on off-road bikes that are prone to crash damage.
 
Gumby said:
If thousands of miles is OK with you, and it is with the majority of the motorcycle riding public, then a well-built air cooled is fine.

If tens of thousands is more your speed, then water cooled is the way to go.

I don't know of any bikes that are prone to catastrophic cooling system failure except maybe the radiators on off-road bikes that are prone to crash damage.
Click to expand...


are you saying that an air cooled engine is only good for less than 10,000 miles or so before problems...? :eek:
 
I'm ok with that. As easy as they are to rebuild....
 
No. I'm saying that it is highly unlikely that you will see 100,000 miles without a rebuild.

I would not be surprised to see head work at 30,000 and lower end at 60-70,000 miles on an air cooled.

Like I said, that's well within most folks tolerances for a bike.
 
went to see some bikes.
The tech was also making the point that the newer water systems are very reliable. Very few catastrophic failures. But especially that the smaller variations in engine temperature would result in greater reliability and less engine problems issues overall. Makes sense.

Interesting to see these new air cooled bikes (DR650, XR650 etc). Seem like 20 year old bike technology, pretty much. How come all bikes are not fuel injected yet...?
 
For the weight that these water cooled Dual sports are...I would just opt for a street bike.


I'm hearing the same thing over and over a gain in the water cooled dual sports. Top heavy and just plain heavy. I can get a 250 Ninja for @ $2k...light, handles, MPG, blah...
Nighthawk 250s are rumored at 70-80MPGs...


Amen on the EFI. I think allot of problems would be solved there. And going by the carb and EFI 22rs I've dealt w/ over the years there's your longer service life and MPG we're talking about to.....

Thumper EFI systems? - ThumperTalk
 
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well, based on the above, I was all set to look for a water cooled one, and lo and behold, an air cooled one fell in my lap that I could not pass... So that took care of that... Oh well.... We'll see how she holds up...
 
So, whad u git?
 
more later when it's all finalized... :D

will just say that she's a big thumper for now....
 
This is where Gumby and I agree to disagree. I've gotten over 50K on my air cooled Harley, and Yamaha twins. I personally know a number of others that have gotten and still have over 100K on their Harleys. With no problems, rebuilds, head work of any kind.

Take care of the maintenance, be religious about the oil/filter changes, and they will last a very long time.
 
the DR650 I got is widely believed to be just about as bulletproof as they come. I see figures in the high tens of thousands of miles before problems. We'll see.

Interestingly, those are actively oil cooled. They have oil sprays on the piston etc like the 80.... Oil cooler too. They're the 80 of bikes! :):) Simple and strong.

Of course, having an outside oil cooler introduces some potential issues not so dissimilar from being water cooled, like broken hoses, pierced rad etc but very unlikely.
 
Thanks you schmucks!


you guys have me lusting for a Yamaha TW200(5sp, 55mph, 70-80mpg) with a XT350(6sp, faster, 90mpg) motor in it.


thanks allot yew guys! :rolleyes:
 
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