Michelin Defender off road (2 Viewers)

[JohnPW]

I found this link interesting:

Perfect off-highway tire = LTX? What?

The off-highway tire debate is over, and I’m embarrassed. The winner has been anointed. Sans oil. The inevitable my-tire-is-better threads may now cease. Allow me to proclaim: I've found the tire and they are the prosaic LTXen. Or, rather the Michelin Defender LTX M/S as officially called...

expeditionportal.com

I don’t use my Land Cruiser hard core off road like so many on this site, and haven’t done much hard core off road stuff since my Jeep days 30 years ago...so I’m curious what experiences members here have had using these tires off-road. It’s a popular tire on 200’s for street use, what do the experts say about it off pavement?

 

[george_tlc]

LTX came stock on my 80 (given it is stock, that implies it is exactly what is needed to sell the vehicle new off the lot). It's a tyre and it is round. It is fine on the street. It is fine on dirt. It is a 'passenger' tyre.

Off pavement, define what that means for you since it can vary from a nice packed dirt road to...

Tyres can be similar to religion for many and they will justify their choice beyond common sense and logic

cheers,
george.

 

[JohnPW]

LTX came stock on my 80 (given it is stock, that implies it is exactly what is needed to sell the vehicle new off the lot). It's a tyre and it is round. It is fine on the street. It is fine on dirt. It is a 'passenger' tyre.

Off pavement, define what that means for you since it can vary from a nice packed dirt road to...

Tyres can be similar to religion for many and they will justify their choice beyond common sense and logic

cheers,
george.

Toyota puts crappy Dunlops on most of their trucks these days. Whether you like the Michelin’s or not, they’re not a cheap tire. As outlined in the link above, some people much more experienced than me like them off-road...and the author of the link above certainly isn’t “brand loyal” or defending a choice based on his purchase...he’s a long time off-road guy who has owned lots of MT tires.

I’m sure the Defenders are lousy in mud. Any experiences, positive or negative, with them off road?

 

[george_tlc]

Sure, I had them on the 80. They were fine on street and dirt. They will work just fine on moab rock, you could run racing slicks on that kind of surface and be fine, it's essentially high traction pavement.

I got rid of them some 20k miles into their life (were new when bought the 80 new) to move to higher capability rubber with appropriately stronger sidewalls.

Price of tyre means next to nothing. I would never choose a tyre for a vehicle based on price.

Again, you need to define YOUR usage. What kind of offroad are you choosing a tyre for and how much distance offroad per year? If it's the occasional forestry road then I'm sure the michelin tyre will do just fine.

cheers,
george.

 

[RoyFJ]

Check out Yokohama Geolandar GO15, quiet tire with long life and very good performance off road as well unless you are doing extremes, they do very well in gravel and sand.

 

[JohnPW]

Thanks for the posts. My LC is primarily a DD & my tow vehicle for a boat, with off-road amounting to camping trips, dirt roads and an occasional dove hunt. My use is in FL & South GA. Even the P rated street Dunlops can handle what I do with the truck. My post was more curiosity of what more experienced off road guys thought about the Defenders off the pavement.

My link above is from a pretty serious off-road guy who after decades of MT use feels that the LT-E rated Michelin Defenders are as good off road as any AT tire. I found that to be an interesting point of view, and not just typical brand loyalty of someone who bought a set of tires. I think the link is worth a read.

 

[JohnPW]

Here’s another link:

400,000 Miles

My 2006 Tacoma Doublecab TRD Off Road hit 400k miles last night. The truck is still running great although there have been a few repairs including a...

www.tacomaworld.com

Guy has over 400,000 miles on his built off-road Tacoma, ALMOST ALL OF IT OVERLANDING. He did it on 7 sets of tires, 6 of them being Michelin LTX/Defenders.

Anyone else have experience with this tire off road?

 

[Madtiger]

Now if you can make due with 275 tires, then I wonder if these tires from Michelin are even better: Michelin Agilis CrossClimate 275/65/18

 

[roalco]

I've currently got just shy of 500,000 km on my '84 BJ60, it came new with Dunlops, the original owner (who had it just 6 months before trading it in.... ) put on some crap "Baja" tires, that I replaced after its first winter with me. In early '86 I put on Michelin XCH4 (M&S somethings), the precursor of the LTX tires. They lasted me through daily driving (city, highway, logging road, heavy mountain snow) for about 4 or 5 years with no issues. When I replaced them the LTX range had developed and I've used them ever since (on set 4 of the LTX's now), with complete satisfaction. They changed them a few years ago, to LTX-AT 2's, or something, but seem to have reverted back to the original tread in the new defenders. In my books they are premium construction, solid and quiet on the pavement, competent at speed on the freeway, extremely good wear and long life, excellent in rain and wet snow, and trustworthy for rugged FSR travel. I don't imagine they're great in bottomless mud pits, but I've always found picking a careful line offroad to be much better than trying to smash through, then waiting for help getting out.... (Which is why I carry a full set of chains and a winch)
My 2 cents worth, is the new LTX defenders will be the next tires on my cruiser, and probably on my diesel Touareg, too.

 

[Iggsray]

I have installed LTX/defenders on all of my children’s/wife’s cars, mainly because I run them on my 4x4 construction pickup trucks.
I am on and off of muddy/clayey snowy steep graded Construction sites, I rarely ever utilize the 4x4 lever and they last 100,000 + miles on a truck.
I recently purchased a 2002 series 100. I plan to intstall a set of LTX’s on this also.

 

[MountaineerLC]

I've got to be honest, when I first started reading I was ready to call BS, but then I remembered by formative years. I cut my teeth off-roading with my grandfather in his FJ60. His idea of tires was that they were round, made of rubber, held air and most importantly, cheap. We got everywhere we wanted to go and a few places we didn't with nothing more than a standard tire. In late 1999 my father bought a new LR Discovery II that later became mine. We wheeled that crap out of that thing with nothing more than the stock tires on it. Once again we got everywhere we wanted with it and a few places we didn't.

Most of the off roading I did back then was on narrow, largely abandoned logging and gas well roads for hunting, hiking or rock climbing access. Mud, ruts and leaves were common. Not saying an AT or MT tire wouldn't have performed better, but I would certainly agree that 90% of people overbuild their rigs for 90% of the driving they do. If you're wheeling somewhere that is usually dry, I can definitely see where you could get by with a relatively mundane tire.

 

[Iggsray]

The only response I have is, the tread design on the LTX seems to have incredible traction in many applications. The biggest concern i have is puncture resistance,getting them in the 10 ply may help. I also do not rotate or balance them. They stay balanced as long as the weights don’t fly off.

 

[AlaskanWheeler]

I've run the LTX's all the way down to the steel belts, they are a hellava durable tire, it was only at that point, they would no longer hold air on a consistent basis, and soon replaced...

 

[Avalon911]

What does everyone think about the Michelin LTX AT2s? I'm considering them to replace the Dunlops on a new 2020 HE.

 

[CA Cruisin]

LTX came stock on my 80 (given it is stock, that implies it is exactly what is needed to sell the vehicle new off the lot). It's a tyre and it is round. It is fine on the street. It is fine on dirt. It is a 'passenger' tyre.

Off pavement, define what that means for you since it can vary from a nice packed dirt road to...

Tyres can be similar to religion for many and they will justify their choice beyond common sense and logic

cheers,
george.

The LTX's on your 80 (I had them on my 80 too) are not the same tire as this thread is discussing. Sadly, Michelin discontinued the LTX last year.
This thread is about the Defender LTX M/S. I will read the link the OP shared. However: In my opinion the Defender is a city tire mainly; quiet, solid in turns, holds the line well and reliable and long-lasting. They are strong climbers on dry rock. Honorable mention in sand.
However only so-so on dirt and gravel, tread holds rocks, hydroplanes and horrible slippage on packed snow and ice. Maybe I got a bad set, but my 99 LC slips all over the place on Defenders in inclement weather. Not happy with them, and will not buy again.
I ought to write Michelin a letter!

 

[80t0ylc]

The LTX's on your 80 (I had them on my 80 too) are not the same tire as this thread is discussing. Sadly, Michelin discontinued the LTX last year.
This thread is about the Defender LTX M/S. I will read the link the OP shared. However: In my opinion the Defender is a city tire mainly; quiet, solid in turns, holds the line well and reliable and long-lasting. They are strong climbers on dry rock. Honorable mention in sand.
However only so-so on dirt and gravel, tread holds rocks, hydroplanes and horrible slippage on packed snow and ice. Maybe I got a bad set, but my 99 LC slips all over the place on Defenders in inclement weather. Not happy with them, and will not buy again.
I ought to write Michelin a letter!

Your location shows as being "So. Cal." which tradionally gets very little - if any snow, so I'm going to assume you don't drive much in winter type conditions. When I lived down there, I remember how when it just rained, the accidents increased dramatically. So your description "hydroplanes and horrible slippage" is seriously suspect to me. "Hydroplaning" is due to too much speed on wet pavement. And that's what happens when you don't slow down accordingly. Worn or inadequate tires make it worse, but NO tire drives the same on ice and packed snow and even wet pavement as it does on dry pavement. It may be that you need to lower your expectations and change your driving style when you're in inclimate conditions....just sayin'

 

[CA Cruisin]

The operative word here is you "assumed".
As a scout for films I drive in all conditions and elevations. Frequently offroad in deep sand and water crossings as well as snow and ice then of course, back to the city grind in So. Cal.
Spent 3 years at high elevation in CO and 5 in NM.
My driving in inclement weather is controlled and experienced over the past 25 years. I do not drive over-speed in rain in So. Cal.
I also know how my car should behave.
Due to my constantly changing driving needs I would not drive anything other than a Land Cruiser. This is my 4th rig.

Thus, having much experience in many LCs over many terrains on many tires, this is why I say the Defenders on my current '99 might be lacking since the vehicle does not hold and perform as I know it can and should. I am happy and surprised to hear others have decent traction driving their set of the same tires, it mildly restores my faith in the brand I have supported since day 1.

Therefore I might reach out to Michelin, as advised by my local tire dealer. The same dealer also shared that Michelin's rubber and quality control has declined in the past 5 years.

 

[80t0ylc]

The operative word here is you "assumed".
As a scout for films I drive in all conditions and elevations. Frequently offroad in deep sand and water crossings as well as snow and ice then of course, back to the city grind in So. Cal.
Spent 3 years at high elevation in CO and 5 in NM.
My driving in inclement weather is controlled and experienced over the past 25 years. I do not drive over-speed in rain in So. Cal.
I also know how my car should behave.
Due to my constantly changing driving needs I would not drive anything other than a Land Cruiser. This is my 4th rig.

Thus, having much experience in many LCs over many terrains on many tires, this is why I say the Defenders on my current '99 might be lacking since the vehicle does not hold and perform as I know it can and should. I am happy and surprised to hear others have decent traction driving their set of the same tires, it mildly restores my faith in the brand I have supported since day 1.

Therefore I might reach out to Michelin, as advised by my local tire dealer. The same dealer also shared that Michelin's rubber and quality control has declined in the past 5 years.

For winter driving, you might be interested in this Michelin tire that is mentioned in this thread on EP. But, thanks for the heads up on Michelin's QC.

 

[albylam]

Ive got LTX and was using them for winter until last year I slipped 100 ft on a patch of ice and spun around like an olypic figure skater. Im trying out some Toyo Observe GSI-5 for this winter. But in michelins defense they were great in snow - just not as ice friendly as i thought it should be.

 

[CA Cruisin]

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