Looking for help with a V8 Fj60 conversion (1 Viewer)

[Gumby]

I'm not a big fan of the hydraulic release bearings on the Jeeps. I've seen a lot fail and require the trans to be pulled to change.

I doubt the slave will mount to that bootiefabbed thing.

 

[Poser]

I am with the gumby here....I do not like the hydraulic throw out for the same reasons....


Yes it is an option, but not one that I would investigate.....I am sure that you will be able to get something in there that works properly...


Much of the clutch issues that come with not having enough travel in the throw out and on and on, are from not having the correct components in play from the original install, ie, throw out bearing, clutch pressure plate, etc. and looking at the pictures of this, I would think that we could have another example right here...


Good luck!


-Steve

 

[HI^C]

LOL ON HEEPS hydraulic throwout bearing, done a few of those on friends rigs, finally the next one they are switching to the newer bellhousing that take a external slave. I beleive this much more then just a plain poorly designed hydraulic throwout.

I for the first time looked into using a hydraulic throwout on a current project, we ended up with a
howe
Stock Chevy Hydraulic Throw-out Bearing like this one
http://www.performancebodies.com/2002 catalog/clutches/clutch.html#8288 though did not pay that much, just example.

It works with a 3/4" bore master, the one we did was a stock toyota mini master with a 5/8 bore it was adjusted tight and works prefect. This one worked to do to the tight fit of exhaust, clocked doubler setup which allowed no room on passenger side at all, and a near flat bottom for clearence. I was actually going to use a cruiser master as it was listed as a 3/4 bore.

Now i throw it out there just as a option.

 

[Mace]

I don't know if anyone mentioned it, but a 40 has the slave and fork on the left (drivers) and a 60 has it on the right. My 60 is now on the left because my exhaust with the 6.2 comes down the right.

BTW, the older 40's have the slave on the left. My 79 has it on the right and my 72 has it on the left

 

[V8FJ60]

HI^C,

Thanks again for the info. I'm just looking at the hydraulic throwout bearing as a possible option for now. It seems that the bearings have a specific bolt-pattern. Did you use your hydraulic throwout with a toyota transmission, or a chevy transmission. Do you think it will bolt-up to the front of the stock 4-speed tranny?

 

[Poser]

What does you pressure plate look like?

Can you post up a pic?

 

[V8FJ60]

Well, the best look at it we can get is through the gaping hole that the boot for the normal clutch linkage should go through. I guess you could call it the "secondary inspection hole" . I posted a picture of what we can see on our web site http://www.longwellweb.com/.

 

[Poser]

Went to your site...


I am not inclined to believe that this is strictly a slave cylinder and master cylinder issue. If you do not have the correct throw out bearing with the correct pressure plate, the travel required to actuate the clutch will be more than what is available from any hydraulic combination of parts.



Without seeing exactly what you have for parts everywhere, I am afraid that I will not be of any help to you with this mess.


Good luck!


-Steve

 

[V8FJ60]

Poser,

Understood and agreed. Thanks for taking the time to look at our mess. You wouldn't happen to have a list of "correct clutch parts" would you (at least as far as pressure plates and throw out bearings go)? Are you referring to pressure plates and throw out bearings sold by AA, or perhaps stock parts (like a LC pressure plate with a chevy throw out bearing).

Thank you.

 

[cruiserrg]

When I did my V8 in my 40 I used advanced adapters stuff: Information below taken from their catalog http://www.advanceadapters.com/catalog/065.html

Centerforce 11" low profile pressure plate: P/N CF1654735 (can get right from CF)
Centerforce 11" clutch disc: P/N 383735 (can get right from CF)
Release Bearing for 4 speed transmission: P/N 716314
Stock GM clutch fork: P/N 716176 (I got one from a junk yard)
Chevy Bellhousing to LC slave cylinder bracket: P/N 716287 (could make your own)

Now I had a 3 speed 40 series trans so I listed a 4 speed throwout bearing above. The clutch disc listed is 10 spline and works on Toy 3sp and 4sp, sm 420s and 465s. I used a stock LC master Cyl and Slave.

You should be able to reuse the bellhousing and adapter you have, just make sure the pivot ball fits the GM fork (which it should).

Hope this helps

 

[V8FJ60]

did you have a stock chevy bell housing with an adapter plate to the trans?

 

[cruiserrg]

did you have a stock chevy bell housing with an adapter plate to the trans?

Yes a stock old cast iron GM Bellhousing. And an adapter that was actually a booty-fabbed (by PO) plate which was made from another cast GM bellhousing (thinknesses are about the same).

 

[Gumby]

I had mine up in the air today. I can get another inch of movement out of the pressure plate with a prybar over what the Toyota slave is giving me, (about 1-1/2 inches). The t/o is pushed tight against the pplate w/ no free play. I don't like that much either.

The master is the new type two bolt. I have the old type three bolt, but I can't find the stinkin' slave that goes with it. I had it in my hand last week.

My questions are:
Is there a throw difference between the three bolt and the two bolt LC masters?

What is the throw of a LC master? It's been a long time.

Is there a combination of the old and the new that will give me more throw? I'd like to keep the two bolt master as it fits nicely. But if I can't shift with it in there, off it goes.

Why can't Downey make a product that does not require modification to use? My slave is tight up against the fork. The boot barely has room to be all the way collapsed.

 

[V8FJ60]

Gumby,

Can you say what sort of set up you are running that seems to require more throw than the stock slave will put out? Pressure plate, adapter, Throwout bearing, fork, etc. ? I would like to be sure not to get into the same boat.

THanks,
Christine

 

[Poser]

Why can't Downey make a product that does not require modification to use?

They do.


You do not have their clutch/pressure plate in there. You would not have this issue if you did...

Been there, done that with a '78 that has a V8 in it that I just built and Orion and installed an H41...


If you have a Downey flywheel housing, you must use their pressure plate, along with a three speed throw out bearing retainer, modified to work with the four speed fork. ( you will understand this when everything is in front of you )



Call Downey and talk with Jim the owner, he will be glad to help you with this.


Good luck!


-Steve

 

[Poser]

http://www.downeyoff-road.com/EngineComponents/index.htm


Look here, there is a reference to it in the four-speed adapter info...


-Steve

 

[Gumby]

They do.


You do not have their clutch/pressure plate in there. You would not have this issue if you did...

Been there, done that with a '78 that has a V8 in it that I just built and Orion and installed an H41...


If you have a Downey flywheel housing, you must use their pressure plate, along with a three speed throw out bearing retainer, modified to work with the four speed fork. ( you will understand this when everything is in front of you )



Call Downey and talk with Jim the owner, he will be glad to help you with this.


Good luck!


-Steve

Thanks. I have yet to work on one of their products that fit right the first time. After a EFI kit, I said never will I be burned again.

i checked out the website. no mention of a pressure plate. I will call Jim tomorrow. Hopefully, it will work out. I would like to get a cable locker from them. I'm just not wild about the one I have heard about needed modification to work properly. maybe they have fixed it.

The strange thing is this set up worked fine in my 40. Maybe I swapped p-plates somewhere. I had two on the shelf.

 

[Gumby]

Called Downey. Talked to a drone. Doesn't know anything about conversions. Gives me to another guy. Re-explain everything.

"what kind of clutch do you have"

"Centerforce"

"You need a conversion clutch"

"OK, great. How much?"

"$275"

"that's all I need?"

"yup"

"what about the throw out bearing?"

"Oh, you need one of those too"

"how much?"

"47.00. We have that in stock and can get it right out"

"anything else?"

"nope"

"what about the release fork?"

"nope"

"I'll call back"

Now my problem with all this is that the pressure plate and disc are not mentioned anywhere on the site. The t/o bearing and clutch fork are but offer conflicting information. The first drone would have sold me the adapter in a heartbeat not knowing about the clutch. The second drone would have sent me the clutch without all the parts I needed. The disc, plate and t/o bearing are THREE times what a chevy kit costs and will double my entire project. And the second guy tells me the difference is that the conversion clutch does not have as much holding force so it releases earlier. I hope it has equal holding force, but a quicker release point, but that's not what he said.

I would feel so much better if I just trusted them to start with.

This whole thread oughtta be in tech. Anyone care if I move it?

 

[woody]

vaguely reminds me of the fiasco I had with my first plate conversion from Classic Cruisers....had to call and ASK how to mount the slave, only to be told I needed yet another adapter they never mentioned the first time....I've since learned to ask more questions, tho it doesn't always help....

 

[V8FJ60]

$275 for a clutch !?! What? Does it have embedded microchips?

You mention Downey, so can I assume you are running a Downey Pressure plate with a centerforce clutch and a GM flywheel? Actually, by "conversion clutch" does he mean it has different material on each side?

Rumor has it I'm running a GM clutch, a GM flywheel, and a remanufactured Victor ??? Pressure plate (probably of the GM aftermarket variety) I think a new pressure plate and clutch might be in our future, and I'm not sure what to buy.