Brakes, Brakes and More Brakes

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Civil1

Civil1

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Sep 29, 2003
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Location
Oregon, USA
I know this topic has been discussed here before and I have searched and found some good information, however I have some questions.

Vehicle: 1984 FJ60 stock 31x10.5 tires

I have 1994 4Runner calipers from wrecking yard
I have 1990 PU 1” Master Cylinder from wrecking yard

Should I rebuild the calipers and master cylinder or by remanufactured?
If remanufactured what company?

I plan on changing all the brake hoses to stainless steel, SOR sells a kit for the 60 however I think the hoses that go from the axel to the caliper will be the wrong length if I bypass the dust shield.

What is the correct length of hose to use when bypassing the dust shield?
I know the NAPA numbers but don’t know what the length is.
Napa # 38881 (longer)
Napa #38878 (shorter)

Where is the best place to order stainless steel brake lines?

What are the fittings called and what size are they in case I find a local shop that can make them for me?

The hoses that go from the frame to the axle would be OK in SOR’s kit but within the next year I plan on lifting it about 2.5”.

Would it be OK to go ahead and install the longer hoses from the frame to the axle?
I don’t want to have to buy new hoses again in a year if I don’t have to.

I plan on doing this upgrade over the spring break, (no I don’t get spring break but the wifey does and I can use her car over the break while the truck is down) so I need to get the parts ordered and everything together before then.

Thanks All

Greg
 
Why did you put the cannabilizied componits on the rig? Sounds like a one of a kind deal now that only trial and error will help?

And, Why not just wait to change the hoses when you do the lift? does not sound like there's any reason but the "want" to change them to SS. I'd drive it save $ do it all at once.

but I'm a old mofo that still has to lie and hide $ from my wife...
 
Not really cannibalized, it is a popular upgrade to the stock 60 series brakes. The 4runner calipers have 4 equally sized pistons per caliper. The stock had one large and one small. The later model 90-95 I think master cylinders have a 1" bore for the larger pisons in the calipers. Overall better braking, the 4runner calipers were designed with larger tires in mind.

As for the brake lines, mine have deteriorated (sp) and need to be replaced anyway and no need to buy them twice.
 
Not quite clear from your post...

Are the calipers and master installed yet? If so, and if they work fine, no need to do anything. If they're not installed, a rebuild kit isn't too expensive, and might be a good idea.

SS lines can come from a variety of sources. No idea if quality differs. I have a full set from MAF - front and rear axle + the lines to the front calipers. Been on for 3 yrs, no problems so far. Nice improvement in firmness of brakes - like 'em.
 
lovetoski said:
Not quite clear from your post...

Are the calipers and master installed yet? If so, and if they work fine, no need to do anything. If they're not installed, a rebuild kit isn't too expensive, and might be a good idea.

SS lines can come from a variety of sources. No idea if quality differs. I have a full set from MAF - front and rear axle + the lines to the front calipers. Been on for 3 yrs, no problems so far. Nice improvement in firmness of brakes - like 'em.
Click to expand...


Sorry, if my post was unclear

No the calipers and MC have not been installed yet, just pulled them from a wrecking yard. I'm just trying to gather all the parts so that I can get this upgrade done in one shot.

I've looked at the MAF SS lines, the frame to axle hose would probably work but I am not sure about the direct line from the axle to the caliper. I think there kit replaces the stock hose to the dust shield.

Did you bypass your dust shield and run a hose from the axle to the caliper directly. If so what hose from MAF did you use?
 
Civil1 said:
Did you bypass your dust shield and run a hose from the axle to the caliper directly. If so what hose from MAF did you use?
Click to expand...

I have a MAF SS hose from axle to dust shield. Still have the hard line from dust shield to caliper. There is a NAPA hose that goes from axle to caliper - part number is on one of the posts on the 4runner brake upgrade. I think you're trying to end up with a SS hose from axle to caliper - right? Maybe you'll need to have one made custom?
 
Civil1 said:
No the calipers and MC have not been installed yet, just pulled them from a wrecking yard. I'm just trying to gather all the parts so that I can get this upgrade done in one shot.
Click to expand...

I'd take the wrecking yard parts apart before deciding the next step. Rebuild kits are cheap, and can work fine if the main parts are in good shape, and you re-assemble carefully. If the main parts are pitted/scored/etc then don't waste time on the rebuild.
 
Thanks for the input lovetoski,

Yeah, what I want to end up with is a stainless line from the axle to the caliper but I don't know what length I should be looking for. MAF and SOR do not list the length of the line just a part number.

As far as the calipers and MC, they are in decent shape but I guess I need to take them apart and see what the insides look like.
 
I strongly oppose rebuilt master cylinders. If it works, use it. if it does not work, the rebuild will last you 5000 miles, and then go to hell again. Same if you buy rebuilt. a NEW aftermarket cylinder will be more useful than a rebuilt Toyota one.
imo
j
 
I just finished installing NAPA rebuilt 4runner brakes and a new 1 1/16 inch t-100 master cylinder on my 62. The master cylinder bolted right up, i need to find a way to reconnect the brake fluid level sensor so the light in the dash will go off but otherwise that was a unbolt/replace type of deal. The calipers (i got mine for a 93 4runner) fit in place just fine, the dust shield needs some very minor trimming to fit but it minimal (5 minutes with a cutoff wheel). I have rockcrawler wheels so i needed to grind the calipers to clear the circular cutouts in the wheel, i used a big grinder and it clears nicely, i really only had to cut into the big reinforcing ribs on it, not into the body itself. I put stainless lines from MAF on while i was at it. I havent tested them fully yet, as im trying to take it easy on them to break em in first, but the brakes feel really nice and linear now, i can tell that if i really hit em hard i would lock the front up with my 34s on, thats a good feeling to know i can really haul it down if i need to. I had to go get another caliper, the first one i got leaked like a sieve out the parting line of the calipers, somebody must have left a seal out.
 
I have my 2 cents on all you questions but I wil stick to the one I didn't see answered yet. I am still using the stock length lines since installing th 2.5 inch Dakar lift. No problem with the length of the lines with such a mild lift. I guess if I was going higher it would become a necessity.
 
Ok,
First thank you all for your input.

So here is what I've got so far

I'm going to exchange my wrecker yard caliper and MC for new/rebuilt depending on price difference. Would like to stick with OEM parts but $$.

cruzerfetish is using his stock frame-axle hoses with his 2.5 Dakar with no problems. So I can figure out whick SS hoses to get.

Still one question eludes me and that would be the length of the hose I need to bypass the dustshield and go straight from the axle to the caliper. I know the NAPA part numbers, but I want to get the SS lines from MAF or SOR or somewhere else if I can find them cheaper.
 
Well I just got off the phone with the local NAPA and Toyota Parts and this is what I was told:

NAPA

Rebuilt Calipers Beck Arnley (sp) flavor - $109.00 + core
Rebuilt Calipers United flavor - $91.49 + core
Rebuilt Calipers TrueStop flavor - $77.56 + core

Rebuilt MC TrueStop flavor - $53.89 + core
Rebuilt MC Safey??? flavor - 72.65 + core

Now for the sticker shock

Toyota OEM

New Calipers - $391.85 ea. :doh:
New MC - $239.30

Caliper Rebuild Kit - $26.71 x 2 does not include pistons
MC Rebuild Kit - $72.65

So it looks like I will either rebuild them or get ones from NAPA.

Does anyone have a preference on the rebuilt ones.
 
The only thing about the NAPA Master Cylinders are they do not come with the reservoir, and NAPA is not capable of ordering them (no part number). The price for the 1991 4Runner reservoir from Toyota is about $90.00. Personally If I were to order a new MC, I'd get the one from Marlin Crawler being it includes the reservoir also: http://www.marlincrawler.com/htm/brakes.htm it is $129.
 
Civil1 said:
Well I just got off the phone with the local NAPA and Toyota Parts and this is what I was told:

Toyota OEM

New Calipers - $391.85 ea. :doh:
New MC - $239.30
Click to expand...

Sounds like you need to find a better source for your OEM parts:rolleyes:

The new 4Runner calipers I picked up from my local Toyota dealership were about $119.00/ea. IIRC.

Try CDan on this board if your local Toyota guys can't help you out...

-dogboy- '87 FJ60
 
sorry Civil1,
just saw that you are in Oregon. In that case, try getting a hold of BJ in the Parts Dept. at Beaverton Toyota and see if he can help you out.

If not, try http://www.marlincrawler.com/htm/brakes.htm. Far sight better than the price you were quoted for calipers.

-dogboy- '87 FJ60
 
dogboy2 said:
Sounds like you need to find a better source for your OEM parts:rolleyes:

The new 4Runner calipers I picked up from my local Toyota dealership were about $119.00/ea. IIRC.

Try CDan on this board if your local Toyota guys can't help you out...

-dogboy- '87 FJ60
Click to expand...

I believe your right, my local dealership has always been a little higher in price than some of the dealerships in Portland but jeez that is a ridiculous price on those calipers.

I'll give CDan a call and see what he can do.
 
dogboy2 said:
sorry Civil1,
just saw that you are in Oregon. In that case, try getting a hold of BJ in the Parts Dept. at Beaverton Toyota and see if he can help you out.

If not, try http://www.marlincrawler.com/htm/brakes.htm. Far sight better than the price you were quoted for calipers.

-dogboy- '87 FJ60
Click to expand...

Just noticed your in Portland, I'm down in the armpit Salem. And Capitol Toyota has been more expensive than some of the prices I have got from dealerships in Portland but never enough to warrant the drive up there.

I'll give BJ a call at Beaverton Toyota and see what's up.
 
check out the SS brake lines from MAF.... they work great with an OME/Dakar lift and are an easy upgrade when you have all of the other brake parts off and have to bleed the system anyway.

-dogboy- '87 FJ60
 
Civil1,

whatever you do, DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT go anywhere near Broadway Toyota. Nothing but horrible experiences on several different fronts -- a true STEALERSHIP if there ever was one.

Russ Beaverton Toyota = GOOD
Broadway Toyota = BAD, VERY BAD

-dogboy- '87 FJ60
 
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