Adding transmission dipstick

[michaelshin]

I am new to the forum but a long time reader.
After totaling my 2003 LC, I found a decent 2004 LC with 85K on.
I was going over to perform routine maintenance only to find that the transmission dip stick. I now know that they switched to their new world fluid.
My wife's 2009 Highlander uses WC as well but it has a tranny dipstick strangely.

I was thinking if anyone considered adding a dipstick to the fill hole?
I know the aisin model designation has changed but do you think its a possibility.

I would not use it to check oil level, but would make filling much easier.

Thanks

 

[12guns]

Your 04' had the 5 speed tranny, as you probably already know. Since it's missing the dipstick, that means it has the "sealed" transmission which Toyota claims has a "lifetime" fluid. The V8 4runners have the same tranny, some are doing drain adn fills at 100k miles for peace of mind. Unless you are towing alot, don't worry about it. From my experience w/ the 5 speed sealed tranny in my 05' 4runner, they are pretty much bullet proof anyway. Much better than my 4 speed in my 2000 LC!
Hope that helps.

 

[TeCKis300]

The dipstick is not a big deal IMO. Almost all manual trannies don’t have a dipstick and have fluid change service intervals. Just service via the traditional drain and fill plugs. Just as you would a differential, or transfer case, etc. Use some clear hose to gravity fill or a manual fluid transfer pump that can be had under $10.

I don’t mean to undermine your desire, but it may be misplaced. Fluid exchanges without a dipstick is a standard affair really. It may take more time, effort, and expense total to install a dipstick than to do the 2 or so fluid changes you’re likely to see in your cars lifetime.

 

[agaisin]

Agree with TeCKis300. Also you need to understand that WS ATF is different than other types of ATF (and therefore incompatible). Aside from the different viscosity, my understanding is it's hygroscopic (absorbs water) and that's one of the reasons it's sealed. From TSB TC008-07 "Containers storing Toyota ATF-WS should always be sealed — If exposed to the atmosphere, ATF-WS may absorb moisture and potentially cause shift concerns if used in operation."

Point being that if you add a dipstick you may be exposing the ATF-WS to the atmosphere in a way that it was not designed to be... I'm no engineer, just heeding the warnings of those that designed the transmission. I don't think the purpose of dipstick removal is just to make it a PITA to check fluid level and refill and to discourage DIYrs to drain/refill and I don't even think it's just b/c they didn't think you'd ever need to drain/refill the fluid b/c it's "Lifetime". I think it's probably b/c it had to be sealed to prevent exposure to moisture in the air. I could be reading too much into the excerpt above but that's my take fwiw.

If you're interested in reading more about ATF-WS, see TSB TC008-07 and TC009-03.

 

[bjowett]

I've seen enough WS lifetime filled units burn up to know that the fluid is not invincible. Lack of a dip stick prevents easy examination of condition

 

[agaisin]

I've seen enough WS lifetime filled units burn up to know that the fluid is not invincible. Lack of a dip stick prevents easy examination of condition

not saying they're invinsible at all just suggesting that adding a dipstick (which was not included by design) might hurt not help. of course it's convenient but is there a good reason it was removed?
if one is concerned about condition why not just drain and refill every 30k or even with every oil change and inspect condition then. isn't that frequent enough?

 

[agaisin]

I've seen enough WS lifetime filled units burn up to know that the fluid is not invincible. Lack of a dip stick prevents easy examination of condition

on landcruisers or other toyota's with ws atf? under normal driving conditions and at what mileages were they burned up?
our lc's/lx's have transmission coolers so tht should help increase longevity.

 

[michaelshin]

I guess I am still used to my dead 2003 LC, dame you deer!
I only thought of the dipstick for casual exam of the fluid.
My wife's 2009 Highlander also calls for WS fluid but has a dipstick. I was not expecting it.

My replacement 2004 LC with 85k makes a clunk if I step on the gas pedal ever more than tapping from the gear box area. Actually I feel the clunk through the gas pedal more than anything.

I was driving by a toyo dealer and picked up three cases of the WS fluid for $7 each .

I want to do a fairly complete do over of the vehicle including the usual timing belt, pullies, water pump, coolant, belt, new rotors, pads, pack the bearings....on and on.

I got a long laundry list, but any free weekend will be spent under the new LC. Not a bad thing.

 

[agaisin]

I guess I am still used to my dead 2003 LC, dame you deer!
I only thought of the dipstick for casual exam of the fluid.
My wife's 2009 Highlander also calls for WS fluid but has a dipstick. I was not expecting it.

My replacement 2004 LC with 85k makes a clunk if I step on the gas pedal ever more than tapping from the gear box area. Actually I feel the clunk through the gas pedal more than anything.

1) what happened to your 2003 LC - how did it die?

2) this is the first I've heard of a WS-ATF that has a dipstick, but after seeing your post and looking a bit more I see others pointing out some models have WS-ATF and a dipstick. So - either their removal of the dipstick was unnecessary and unrelated to moisture exposure, or the WS-ATF models with dipstick have a special dipstick that does a better job of keeping out air? Don't know how to explain this, just going off the sources I had referenced. If there's no harm to the tranny/fluid in swapping in a dipstick I'd do it too!!

3) Check out the Official clunk/thunk driveshaft thread - https://forum.ih8mud.com/100-series-cruisers/401590-official-clunk-thunk-driveshaft-thread.html
It's possible you just need to lube your shaft properly to eliminate the clunk you describe.

 

[bjowett]

Mostly various Toyota Trucks, some with coolers, some w/o. I've drained and filled many WS vehicles from all walks of life, those driven easy that have coolers tended to have better fluid. I agree with pan drain and fill every so often... cheap insurance. The transmission is not sealed, it has a breather on top... the dip stick removal, IMO, is to prevent easy inspection.

 

[michaelshin]

Well wife's highlander also has oil cooler for the tranny, so there it is.
I am wondering if the "WS" fill bolt thread would accept a dipstick assembly from 2003 model?
I've never really looked at how a dipstick attaches to our tranny, but I imagine that it still screws onto the tranny block somehow. But since WS fill instruction specifies not to insert anything into the hole more than 30mm long, so no actual dipstick end should enter the tranny for checking the fluid
Evel, but there to add fluid through.

I hit a n elk weighing in at 700 pounds at night doing about 60 mph. Neither of us faired well. Repair was going to be more than car value, but it was totalled. That's how I lost my 2003 LC.

 

[agaisin]

I am wondering if the "WS" fill bolt thread would accept a dipstick assembly from 2003 model?
I've never really looked at how a dipstick attaches to our tranny, but I imagine that it still screws onto the tranny block somehow. But since WS fill instruction specifies not to insert anything into the hole more than 30mm long, so no actual dipstick end should enter the tranny for checking the fluid
Evel, but there to add fluid through.

here's a thread on the topic of putting an 03 drain pan and dipstick into 04+:
https://forum.ih8mud.com/100-series-cruisers/384461-drain-fill-tranny-oil-05-a.html

the thread has some claiming that 03 has a750f but with dipstick and therefore parts would be easily swappable. seems like the main proponent(s) in that thread gave up the idea after they got more comfortable with the fill procedure.

Sent from my iPhone using IH8MUD

 

[michaelshin]

Thank you for the thread.