Did up a video on how to advance/retard timing on a 14BT VE style injection pump if anyone's interested:
14BT Injection Pump Timing Video
- Thread starter crave reFleXion
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Looks all good @crave reFleXion , I never bother with a dial indicator any more as the actual number doesn't concern me but a lot of people like knowing so your video is a great source of info. Jeez you have bugger all room in there for access to the pump for all the adjustments, makes mine like a walk in the park with the space in my 80 series engine bay and HD motor. Once your happy with the static timing setting you should look at the auto advance timing piston, I've found that makes much more of an impact to fuel economy and performance as it effects how the timing advances/retards in relation to RPM and engine load.
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Funny you mention that, when I had the pump rebuilt, the auto advance timing piston wasn't working well... Much disassembly to get access to it?
No it's quite easy. There's just a cap you remove which then gives you access to the spring and shims which is how you adjust the piston travel. Depending on your timing piston you may also have an adjustor on the cap itself which makes it even easier
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Are you adjusting it in relationship to the star wheel/aneroid pin in the compensator?
No, this has nothing to do with the compensator.
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Alright @KiwiDingo - I've started going down the rabbit hole... Thanks for that 
So, where did you end up setting your static timing to get the most out of adjusting the automatic timing advance piston? (I do realise that's a stupid question to ask without knowing what other work had been done to the pump/injectors etc... but generally) Any good write ups to speed up the learning curve? How much of a difference are we talking about here compared with adjustments to static timing?
So, where did you end up setting your static timing to get the most out of adjusting the automatic timing advance piston? (I do realise that's a stupid question to ask without knowing what other work had been done to the pump/injectors etc... but generally) Any good write ups to speed up the learning curve? How much of a difference are we talking about here compared with adjustments to static timing?Hahaha most welcome!Alright @KiwiDingo - I've started going down the rabbit hole... Thanks for that
The static timing only sets the base value. The auto advance timing piston has a set amount of travel it can move which is the min and max travel position. The timing value that this min/max position has changes when static timing changes, increase static timing and the min/max timing value of the timing piston also increases by the same amount. This min/max travel is fixed and can't be adjusted but what you can do is change the way the piston travels and response with engine rpm/load/case pressure. This is where the adjustments are made to the timing piston spring via shims or the preload adjustor the change the way the piston moves in relation to the case pressure.
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Awesome explanation! Appreciate it
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So I grabbed some shims from Josh at JH Hilux (bloody good bloke), which came out of high altitude compensators when he removes them (different thicknesses). However, I also came across the following page from the UK: Dynamic Timing Advance Spacer Kit | Steg's Supplies - https://stegs4x4.co.uk/product/dynamic-timing-advance-spacer-kit/ which looks interesting. What do you reckon @KiwiDingo? Should I have a go with just the shims or grab one of those kits from the UK? I was also thinking that I could actually bring my static timing back lower for better spool and less smoke in the hope that adjusting the automatic advance piston's travel would make up for the top end? Does that sound right to you?
Cheers Mate.
P.s. My GMT Munro arrived today!
Cheers Mate.
P.s. My GMT Munro arrived today!
Yep, bloody good bloke Josh and he knows his sh1t!
I love that spacer from Steg's, I'm running that exact part.
This is exactly why I got this spacer. I wanted to lower the timing early on to improve torque/spool but still have the same timing range in the top end for my 4200rpm peak power. It works great.
Thanks for the video. Really appreciate it. I've sourced a timing gage and will be attempting this process this week. Hope to recruit a second set of eyes, shouldn't be as painful as getting a helper to pump the brakes while bleeding I hope. I also got the SST for getting to that bitch of a bolt next to the block. Can't see any of the bolts, can just feel them.
Couple questions/clarification:
Dan
And did the advance timing to 1.33(4?) give you some better performance? Lower EGTs/less smoke? Are you still at this same setting?
Couple questions/clarification:
- CCW and CW based on looking at the crank?
- Also, the bolts you loosen to move the pump, you don't need to remove, just loosen them, correct?
- You can install the gage and check timing without removing injection lines? But to move the pump all four lines need to come off, or at least the nuts loosened off the pump?
Dan
And did the advance timing to 1.33(4?) give you some better performance? Lower EGTs/less smoke? Are you still at this same setting?
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Hey mate, I've changed the timing again since this... I installed the static timing advance spacer from Nick Steggel in the UK (I HIGHLY recommend his product, it is incredible for maintaining the top end and getting the engine to stretch it's legs). I am currently at 1.19, but I'm thinking of bumping it up to 1.29... basically, more retarded=better spool up, less smoke, higher EGTs and less power, while advanced=slower spool up, more soot, lower EGTs and more power (and peak cylinder pressures). It's all a juggling act really... I've found having a new turbo, injectors and pump help a lot. Intercooler is definitely a worthwhile mod... I've thought about meth injection, but not there yet.
You can definitely check the timing without touching any of the injector lines or injection pump bolts... Just establish top dead centre, remove the centre head bolt (careful with the copper washer), screw in the SST timing tool and dial gauge and then follow the process in the video I posted. Be very careful with TDC, because if you are out by a bees dick there it changes the reading considerably in the dial gauge.
To move the pump, just loosen all the bolts and loosen the injector lines, no need to take anything completely off.
Thanks Kit. I have to remove my external coolant heater hose I think to get the tool in there, so may have to drain some coolant, or at least clamp off the lines to get the tool installed. I also have a brake-booster in the way over there as mine is left-hand drive.
Have you messed with the boost compensator star wheel at all? It looks like you have to pull the intake off, or at least the grid heater to get to the allen-head bolts on the top of the diaphragm.
And, one more question, Counter Clockwise and Clockwise in you video, that is based on looking at the crank from the front?
Have you messed with the boost compensator star wheel at all? It looks like you have to pull the intake off, or at least the grid heater to get to the allen-head bolts on the top of the diaphragm.
And, one more question, Counter Clockwise and Clockwise in you video, that is based on looking at the crank from the front?
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Yeah, it's one of the worst engines for tuning the boost compensator (aneroid pin or star wheel). I can get the top of the compensator off without removing the intake manifold and rotate the aneroid pin, but to actually remove the pin and reinsert, you really need to remove them intake manifold unfortunately.
So once you establish top dead centre, you rotate the engine backwards in a sense. So orienting yourself facing the front of the engine, it should be turned anti-clockwise.
Okay. I just checked mine and it looks to be .94. Had to remove my coolant heater hoses, fuel line hose and loosen the fuel inlet tubing to get the gage installed.
Next order of business is to see if I can get the pump loosened up to advance it a bit.
Had to make a wrench the SST I borrowed was way too long to fit in there. Also had to remove my battery, cable and loosen power steering reservoir of it's bracket...oh and the throttle cable needed to move.
Next order of business is to see if I can get the pump loosened up to advance it a bit.
Had to make a wrench the SST I borrowed was way too long to fit in there. Also had to remove my battery, cable and loosen power steering reservoir of it's bracket...oh and the throttle cable needed to move.
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Bugger... I've had mine back as far as .9 as well. You will notice a significant improvement in performance advancing it. Do you know if the pump has been off at any stage? All I can say is the first time is the hardest...
