Timing Belt for Dummies writeup

[Slickspawn]

Hello! I’m collecting the parts to do this on my new-to-me 260k 2006 LX470. Hasn’t been done since 110k miles.

I’m going to replace the radiator with a Mishimoto and do upper and lower hoses, oil cooler hoses and heater Ts also.

My 2006 calls for the super long life but I have the Red Long Life in my cabinet from my 99 100 series.

Can, or should, I use the Red LL instead of the Super Long Life? There’s some discussion the Red long life is better for the truck overall.

 

[94SRUNNER]

Hello! I’m collecting the parts to do this on my new-to-me 260k 2006 LX470. Hasn’t been done since 110k miles.

I’m going to replace the radiator with a Mishimoto and do upper and lower hoses, oil cooler hoses and heater Ts also.

My 2006 calls for the super long life but I have the Red Long Life in my cabinet from my 99 100 series.

Can, or should, I use the Red LL instead of the Super Long Life? There’s some discussion the Red long life is better for the truck overall.

I use the standard Toyota Red in my 06' and have for the last 5 years. No issues.

 

[2001LC]

If using any red in coolant system (Toyota LL coolant 100% "Red"), mixed 50/50% with distilled water. Use the Red flush schedule. Which is less of 30K miles or 2 years.

 

[vizslagold]

i'm in the middle of a timing belt job on my '04 lx470 with 136k. i haven't yet pulled the belt from the last timing belt job. i can see the faded timing marks on the belt weren't used during installation.

i suspect i'm being overly cautious here.

before i proceed, does my timing look correct? when i move to the T marks on the cams the crankshaft mark has not yet reached the pin. is this acceptable? for belt removal, am i better advancing the crank mark to the pin and have the cam marks just past the T marks?

when i am at tdc on the crank the cams are just past the tdc marks on the heads.

 

[vizslagold]

if i align the cam marks perfectly, then the crank is approximately -5. is this accepatable variation?

 

[vizslagold]

i'd also like to confirm the fipg 102 or 103 is only applied to the threads of the timing belt tensioner pulley bolt to prevent this oil leak from occurring? i don't need to apply sealant to this surface, bolt shaft, washer, etc?

 

[JunkCrzr89]

fipg 102 or 103 is only applied to the threads of the timing belt tensioner pulley bolt to prevent this oil leak from occurring

Loctite 242, not FIPG, to the threads only.

 

[JunkCrzr89]

if i align the cam marks perfectly, then the crank is approximately -5. is this accepatable variation?
View attachment 3072300
View attachment 3072301

I wouldn’t worry about it. Do it right following the FSM and you won’t have issues.

 

[vizslagold]

I wouldn’t worry about it. Do it right following the FSM and you won’t have issues.

thanks. i've done one timing belt job previously on a 4th gen 4runner, but it's been years and i've forgotten how precise the timing marks aligned.

i'll get some 242 for the threads. would you suggest applying 242 to the water pump mounting bolt threads? or just the timing belt tensioner and idler bearing bolts?

 

[JunkCrzr89]

would you suggest applying 242 to the water pump mounting bolt threads? or just the timing belt tensioner and idler bearing bolts?

Absolutely not. The #1 idler pulley pivot bolt only. Nothing else.

 

[vizslagold]

10-4. thanks again.

 

[2001LC]

I do use Toyota FIPG 102 or 103 OIL on tensioner pulley bolt threads (only). I've never had one leak using it or walk out. We're just sealing thread form the oil that's splashing on backside of pulley bolt, which is open to oil pan area. If you have the FSM recommended sealant, use it. But not a big deal either way, just as long as threads "only" are sealed.

Your picture of engine timing to lower cover. Both the "0" and the the nipple. Looks out of time. But this can be from shift in timing belt lower plastic cover and or weak tensioner and or belt stretch.

I use hard marks to time. Which are the straight line (not "T") above cams, and nipple on oil pump cover.

Note: The timing marks on belt, only line up during install. Once crank turned they do not line up again.


Cam "T" marks line up to lower cover nipple timing mark

I did once have a case where someone replaced a cam seal, and did not use a torque wrench on cam bolt. The knock pin sheared off, and timing was off. as cam moved on cam shaft. With it knock pin was out further than should be. The should be recessed in a bit.
Sheared knock pin

Timing belt job just done. Blown engine or savable? This is interesting guys!

Happy 2020 all. Well, I spent last day of 2019, inspecting a 2005 LC w/~200K, that was towed to me. That had a Timing Belt installed a few days before coming to me Let me know your thoughts: Blown engine from interference or is there hope? Also what do you think happened? Skip story and go...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[vizslagold]

2001LC, thanks for the additional information. i'll take a look at the knock pin later today. what is the torque spec of the cam bolts? can i get an accurate torque reading on the cam bolts with the new belt and hydraulic tensioner installed? i suspect not. but i wouldn't mind checking them for piece of mind, even if the belt effects the torque reading by some percentage. i don't have a cam wrench on hand. i do have a strap wrench. if it's large enough for the cams i can check torque with the timing belt off. i can cut up my old serp belt if necessary.

i don't believe the cam seals have been replaced. nor do i think the water pump was replaced previously. i did not see any oil leaks, but there was signs of water pump gasket failure and a bit of dried coolant. nothing bad. a smidge.

i removed my belt with the cams at the T marks. the asin timing belt kit for my 04 lx indicated this for my vehicle. i suspect the belt can be successfully changed at either set of marks- perhaps it's more of a concern on the vvti 06/07 2uz's? in one 100 series belt job vid i watched, both cams wanted to jump on him at tdc. it was a vvti engine he was working on. -my passenger side cam was a little springy while the driver's side did not move.

i created new timing marks on the old belt before removing it. i lined the old belt up with the new belt and the timing marks match. while matching up the belts, i felt like i was making small adjustments to keep the teeth perfectly matched up. some belt stretch may have been present. i've also been correcting a number of mistakes made by others as i go through all baselining work and repairs on my lx. the timing cover bolts definitely felt over-torqued to me, as was the idler pulley bolt, imho. there was some amount of "crush" on the plastic timing cover mounting tabs (w/ metal "bushings"). so, it's possible the lower timing cover was "clocked" by the previous installer. i have various new oem bolts for the job, including the timing cover nuts and bolts. it will be interesting to see where the timing marks align with the new belt and tensioner. i'll post some pics.

i should note, my 2uz sounded just as smooth as the 2uz in my previous 04 4runner. both with ~136k. at least to my ear, it didn't sound or drive like it was out of time.

i have AISIN AB1207B1 and loctite 243 on hand for the tensioner pulley bolt. which to use? my guess, either will work.
this stuff...

i've cleaned up and resprayed my harmonic balancer (not the belt grroves or crankshaft mating surface). it was looking a little rough. i have a new skp h.b. on hand, but am planning on returning it...i didn't like how many many times it was peck drilled to balance the skp harmonic balancer.

side note: a timing belt job seems like a good time to address steering rack/bushing issues. access is much improved.

​

 

[2001LC]

2001LC, thanks for the additional information. i'll take a look at the knock pin later today. what is the torque spec of the cam bolts? can i get an accurate torque reading on the cam bolts with the new belt and hydraulic tensioner installed? i suspect not. but i wouldn't mind checking them for piece of mind, even if the belt effects the torque reading by some percentage. i don't have a cam wrench on hand. i do have a strap wrench. if it's large enough for the cams i can check torque with the timing belt off. i can cut up my old serp belt if necessary.

i don't believe the cam seals have been replaced. nor do i think the water pump was replaced previously. i did not see any oil leaks, but there was signs of water pump gasket failure and a bit of dried coolant. nothing bad. a smidge.

i removed my belt with the cams at the T marks. the asin timing belt kit for my 04 lx indicated this for my vehicle. i suspect the belt can be successfully changed at either set of marks- perhaps it's more of a concern on the vvti 06/07 2uz's? in one 100 series belt job vid i watched, both cams wanted to jump on him at tdc. it was a vvti engine he was working on. -my passenger side cam was a little springy while the driver's side did not move.

i created new timing marks on the old belt before removing it. i lined the old belt up with the new belt and the timing marks match. while matching up the belts, i felt like i was making small adjustments to keep the teeth perfectly matched up. some belt stretch may have been present. i've also been correcting a number of mistakes made by others as i go through all baselining work and repairs on my lx. the timing cover bolts definitely felt over-torqued to me, as was the idler pulley bolt, imho. there was some amount of "crush" on the plastic timing cover mounting tabs (w/ metal "bushings"). so, it's possible the lower timing cover was "clocked" by the previous installer. i have various new oem bolts for the job, including the timing cover nuts and bolts. it will be interesting to see where the timing marks align with the new belt and tensioner. i'll post some pics.

i should note, my 2uz sounded just as smooth as the 2uz in my previous 04 4runner. both with ~136k. at least to my ear, it didn't sound or drive like it was out of time.

i have AISIN AB1207B1 and loctite 243 on hand for the tensioner pulley bolt. which to use? my guess, either will work.
this stuff...
View attachment 3074933

i've cleaned up and resprayed my harmonic balancer (not the belt grroves or crankshaft mating surface). it was looking a little rough. i have a new skp h.b. on hand, but am planning on returning it...i didn't like how many many times it was peck drilled to balance the skp harmonic balancer.

side note: a timing belt job seems like a good time to address steering rack/bushing issues. access is much improved.

​

I do not replace cam or crank seals, unless leaking/weeping. The only 2 (1 OEM, 1 aftermarket crank seals) I have replaced, were not factory installed. I've yet to see a factory installed crank or cam seal leak, on non VVT 4.7L.

In general cam bolts are torqued with belt off. But you can torque them belt on. Which in either case will not affect torque. Or I should say I can't see how it would.

For torque specs, refer to you FSM (factory service manual). Which I also have on had during timing belt service, for torque specs. If you don't have root around in mud, you'll find some PDF FSM. Any 98-05 FSM will do, assume that is your range of year.

Again, belt marks are helpful in setting timing. But once crank turned, they do not line up again. Which you will or should, turn crank 720 degrees to verify your properly timed, once belt & T-belt tensioner with pin pulled in place.

I find I can set cams dead on their timing mark (straight line, not the T). If I'm careful not to bump, they hold on mark. But it doesn't take much and they will spine from valve spring and cylinder pressure. But no big deal! If you read the link I provided above. It very clear the non VVT does not interfere (piston to valve).

I use Toyota 1282B FIPG for coolant areas, and 102 or 103 for oil. I see the Aisin is rated for both, but not something I can comment on.

I find almost all blocks under water pump gasket have some pitting. Here's ( likely already in this thread, but I'll post for here) my solution:

 

[vizslagold]

2001LC, sorry i missed the link you provided solving the timing issue caused by a sheared cam pin. i learned much from this thread and i'm glad i didn't get a chance to work on my lx yesterday, as i clearly have some additional checks to complete. and although i check torque compulsively, i will be marking torqued bolts in the future. this is very cheap insurance.

"Again, belt marks are helpful in setting timing. But once crank turned, they do not line up again. Which you will or should, turn crank 720 degrees to verify your properly timed, once belt & T-belt tensioner with pin pulled in place."

-this i know, but i don't think i made it clear in my initial post. before removing the old belt i created new marks and checked these against the new belt. they did match, but a timing issue is still possible. from everything i just read it seems that if after the new belt is installed, rotating the crank by hand, if my marks do not align better(perfectly) than what i witnessed with the old belt, there's likely an underlying timing issue that needs tracked down before buttoning up the motor. i replaced plugs recently. to my eyes, with my experience level- lower than yours, lol, they looked normal. no fuel smell. but it seems possible to have a similar timing issue to the one you diagnosed, but with a cam sprocket spun to a lesser degree, i.e. say ten degrees vs 120. i hope not. fingers crossed.

i watched your video on sealing the water pump block surface prior to installing the new gasket. there are no obvious signs of pitting on my block, but i figure it can't hurt to look for imperfections with some sealant and a razor blade. i will do this.

what is the purpose of turning the crank counterclockwise 45 degrees with the new belt installed, as i read it, before setting the new hydraulic tensioner?

 

[2001LC]

what is the purpose of turning the crank counterclockwise 45 degrees with the new belt installed, as i read it, before setting the new hydraulic tensioner?

"turning the crank counterclockwise 45 degrees with the new belt installed". Has to do with interference. We don't concern ourselves with it, as 98-05 4.7L don't interfere (valve to piston).

Here how I install 98-05 4.7L."
1) Install Crank sprocket.
2) Install tensioner pulley. Adding sealant to threads 25ft-lbf.
3) line up cams and crank sprocket to hard marks. (see in pictures above).
4) Install belt, lightly clamps belt onto each sprocket, to hold in place.
5) Install No 2 idler pulley. Torque to 25ft-lbf (thread lock optional)
6) Install tensioner. Torque each bolt to 19ft-lbf, working bolts down evenly.
7) Pull pin (tension shipping retainer pin)
8) Turn crankshaft 720 degrees. To make sure all 3 hard timing marks are dead on.

Note: Remember to install the two very small moldings pieces after installing the water pump. (Mice get in if not installed)

Face crank shaft position sensor plate outward, so it's teeth lines up with crank sensor

 

[vizslagold]

the new water pump, belt, tensioner, pulleys, and anti mouse plate are installed. loctite 243 is on the tensioner and idler pulley bolts. everything torqued. there were no tool marks on my cam sprockets, bolts, or seals. the cam pins look good. the crankshaft seal is bone dry. i did run into a delay caused by the tensioner pulley that was included with the asin timing belt kit i purchased from rockauto ~a year ago. it came with koyo bearings. the idler pulley was good to go, but the tensioner would bind up when tightening the 10mm pivot bolt by hand. i could tighten the bolt with a 10mm socket with one hand such that i could not pivot the pulley with both hands. i'm not sure if the wrong tensioner pulley was included in the kit or if the machining of the casting was out of spec. in any case the casting was getting pressed into the block and binding). i ordered a new nsk tensioner pulley from rockauto and it works like a charm, and there is no binding. the nsk bearing i received matched what i pulled off the lx both in casting design and bearing number.

with the new belt and hydraulic tensioner installed, my timing marks are now aligning perfectly. i've brought the crank around to tdc four times now. i believe what we saw above is a result of a stretched belt as 2001LC suggested earlier.

once i get the crank's sst setup to torque the crank bolt, i will confirm the cam sprocket bolts are torqued to 80 ft lbs (it's 80 or 81 ft lbs for an '04- the specs aren't in front of me).

i have a new fan bracket(bearings were on their way out), serpentine belt tensioner, serp idler pulley, 240a mechman alternator (the old one was hanging on but in rough shape), and ~3/4" shorter HD serpentine belt (gates K060875HD is what i chose for the mechman's smaller pulley) ready to go on. i'll be doing the big four upgrade with 0g wire for the new alternator. i replaced the oem heater tees with metal tees while i had the radiator drained. and there's some new bolts and radiator hoses going on as well. the original fan clutch felt good so i'm not replacing that. it's also easy to get to down the road along with the power steering pump.

here's some pics of the old nsk tensioner pulley that i pulled off the vehicle and the koyo tensioner which was binding up. the new nsk currently on the vehicle is identical to this old nsk. clearly, it was time for a new tensioner bearing. i very much suspect the only item replaced during the first timing belt job was the belt.

the bushings' seams were also clocked from each other in the binding koyo tensioner, not that this caused the binding. the dimensions of the respective bearings are also quite different. i believe the turned face of the koyo below is higher on the right (or not square). working the tensioner back n forth on the pivot bolt resulted in a shine mark in this location. i will also note that the koyo idler bearing in the asin kit and the new nsk tensioner pulley i purchased separately had branded tamper proof tape on their repspective boxes and the bad pulley did not. i haven't handled enough of these kits to know if this is significant.

 

[udubfl]

Just completed TB job on a 99 LX. Did the 50 degree more (pulley bolt) after dead center.

To help with keeping things lined up in case top camshaft pulleys jumped, I just ended up marking the new rested spots (50 degree past dead center) with black marker. When I took off the old timing belt, it really didn’t jump but left side did move a little when putting on the new timing belt. So, glad I made the marks to assist.

Old:

New:

Old:

New:

50degree turn

 

[udubfl]

Also, I had the air box out and used one of its bolt to hang couple large zip ties to hold the alternator and steering pump pulley. Didn’t want to strain any hoses or wires. I’m sure it was fine without it but why not and also kept it little away from all the mess.

 

[murphthelab]

No! We don't actually remove the radiator as FMS shows. I cover the rad fins to protect from damage. That said, there is some over-lap labor. So it's easiest to replaced rad with T-belt job and saves a little labor. But it not just a part's add, like a Fan Bracket would be (no added labor for FB).

As @2001LC mentions above, many/most do not remove the radiator when doing the TB replacement. However, I'm looking at the following pros/cons of removal:

• CONS - More time/effort to remove and install. Better to just cover the fins and make due w/ available room.
• PROS - More space to work post-removal. The radiator is drained anyway. Easier bracket removal and less risk of breakage, etc. I can potentially use high capacity pneumatic tools to break free a few of the big bolts, leveraging the extra work space. Upon removal, I can thoroughly and more easily clean the radiator fins. Post-removal, I can remove the radiator side supports and process the hardware through my sand blaster, followed w/ some metal prep and POR15. Make it all nicey, nicey.

Anything I'm missing? Opinions?