Calling all 03-07 LX470 owners, VGRS survey, please read! (1 Viewer)

[2001LC]

All 03-07 LX470, have VRGS installed at the factory, for the USA market.
I'm looking/probing for some anecdotal information:

1st:
Any strange steering issue?
One in which steering suddenly has mind of it's own. Steering suddenly pulls to one side by itself, then releases and repeats. The feel may be very sever veering vehicle direction, or just barely noticeable. Or may just feel a looseness between steering wheel and wheels, on occasion. Anyone with 03-07 LX470, experience this or any other steering issues.

2nd:
Has your steering rack & pinion been replaced. If so with which rack & pinion?
We've multiple Rack & Pinion (R&P) selections:
OEM LX VGRS R&P, which has a black stripe painted on passage side (RH side). Pricey!
OEM LC (non VGRS) R&P, which has a green stripe painted on passage side (RH side). Saves a few Dollars.
OEM re-manufactured, which likely is paint black all over, so indefinite paint stripe covered up. Budged friendly.
After-Market R&P, not likely VGRS. Low cost alternative.

3rd:
Does your steering feel harder than normal to turn, at lower speeds?

Please listing your configuration, which will be very helpful and will be asked if not.
i.e. Pure stock or built and with what toys.

Also please note if your VGRS snap ring recall service has or has not been done.

Addtionally:

If anyone has any info like diagrams, technically data, etc. On the NON VGRS and VGRS rack & pinions, please post here and or links too the info.

Looking to determine, if any difference in gearing and or pressure of these two Rack & Pinions?

 

[3_puppies]

2005 LX recall done years ago, OK'd by Lexus to have local Toyota dealer do the work as nearest Lexus dealer is 5 hours away
no issues that I know of with the steering, still original, rig has 170,000 miles, it sits some as we only use it for longer rides/trips
only thing I remember is the VGRS light on after swapping or disconnecting the battery, I had to look it up in the owners manual to see what it was about, turns out it is normal and went off shortly after start up.

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Added some to your title so peeps can know before they click.

 

[saucebox]

This is all historical at this point, but in order...

1) General looseness, felt it more at speed—best I can describe it was 1960s steering, before "power" was added to power steering (but not quite that dramatic). I always attributed it to 2) replacing the OEM VGRS rack with the bottom of the barrel, lifetime warranty R&P. I think it cost me less than $200. And 3) No, it never did. Tighter low speed turns were always fine.

And she was a heavy pig with IFS (still is, but that's besides the point), 6800+ lbs. ARB front with winch, full steel rear bumper, full set of steel skids from Slee, dual batteries, full drawers, refrigerator, etc. Heavy wheels, heavy tires.

 

[2001LC]

2005 LX recall done years ago, OK'd by Lexus to have local Toyota dealer do the work as nearest Lexus dealer is 5 hours away
no issues that I know of with the steering, still original, rig has 170,000 miles, it sits some as we only use it for longer rides/trips
only thing I remember is the VGRS light on after swapping or disconnecting the battery, I had to look it up in the owners manual to see what it was about, turns out it is normal and went off shortly after start up.

Thanks for taking the time. To layout all seems as it should be, with all stock factory VGRS components.

I hope we can get many of the 03-07 LX owners in mud and shops that work on, to report here.

The two key points I'm most interested in:

• Any strange steering issues, where steering suddenly has a mind of it's own
• Which rack & pinion is installed.

All OEM Rack & Pinion are color coded with a paint stripe on RH side top. Blue, Green or Black:
Blue paint stripe are the 98-02 LC or LX.

Green paint stripe are the LC (non VGRS) R&P 03-07.

Black paint stripe is LX (VGRS) 03-07.

Here's a green LC R&P (non VGRS) in a 03-07 series 100 USA market (LHD).

Concern is:
Do we create to much stress on the VGRS actuator, when non VGRS rack installed. I am not saying we do, just fishing to see if others reports any issues.


Why the concern:
Which I'm just starting to look at. The first symptom I'm seeing, once a non VGRS R&P installed. Is hard steering at low speeds. First brought to my attention was this last summer. It was in a heavy built 03LX with an LC R&P (green paint). I was asked; if it felt hard to steer at low speed. I stated: Yes! "But. With your build, I can't say if steering hard or just the build (weight & big off road tires) I'm feeling". I was told, his buddies in similar built LX, did not feel hard to steer. That his steering only became hard after R&P installed. Which he thought was OEM (VGRS). Which I informed him, it was not a VGRS R&P, but it was OEM Toyota. Only Lexus has the OEM VGRS R&P, for sell in the USA.

Now I was on the look-out for hard steering, in LX without VGRS R&P. I found it!
The very next 06 LX470 in my shop, a pure stock. I noted it had hard steering at low speed. It also had an LC R&P installed, not the VGRS Lexus calls for. Not very noticeably hard, but harder than ones with VGRS R&P all factory parts. The 03-07 LX470, is normally very easy to turn steering wheel, at low speed. I assume the feel is considered luxury. But unless you've an LC/LX to compare with, it's not very noticeable.

Why now I'm I asking all 03-07LX to report in:
I've now run into a 03 LX470 with a non VGRS rack & pinion, having issues. It's hard steering was first reported, 2 years ago when LC (non VGRS) Rack & pinion installed. So now we very dangerous steering issue, we need to diagnose what and the why. We may find we just need to calibrate the system. But seems unlikely, calibration issue took 2 years to surface. We may find the R&P makes no difference, other the saves $ and makes steering just a tad harder in low speed. But we may find we're creating a dangerous situation, that takes years to surface. If dangerous, we need to know ASAP. As many have opted to use a less costly alternative R&P, rather than the costly Lexus VGRS Rack & Pinion.

He's link to 03LX we've issue with, which has LC R&P. Note: it is not yet diagnosed, only test drove. Test drive clearly indicated a VGRS induced steering issues.

Diagnosing Violent-Jerking Steering Issue (VGRS)

I will preface this by stating that this is not an issue of loose wheel bearings trigging ABS system to grab a tire. This one has @2001LC and I somewhat stumped. I've also gone through most of the VGRS related threads and found good info to inform investigation but no conclusion yet. Paul has...

forum.ih8mud.com

Snap ring important, but different issue:
But we may as well, talk about snap ring recall also. As it is so very import to have the service done and done properly by Lexus.
Lexus only does this service. It's a recall at no cost to owner. They'll even give loaner car at no cost.

I've own 3 LX470 currently, which recall service has been done on all.
2 seems perfectly fine, without any feel or visible signs anything ever done. Those 2 (07 LX470), Lexus history shows recall done before I owned. Steering seems normal and they have factory VGRS R&P still in them.

The 3rd (03 LX470); VGRS light works, during key on test mode. But the VGRS light doesn't come on when battery disconnected/reconnected. Not yet diagnosed why, but will when I get time! Only noted as not working, after recall done.

Here is a picture of a snap ring actually out of place. It's this condition, the recall is meant to avoid.

Added some to your title so peeps can know before they click.

Thank You TM. That was a good idea to add "survey".


I'm seeing more and more VGRS system (03-07 LX470), with Non VGRS rack & pinions installed. Very important we get some feedback. To give us a sense, if it's a good lower cost alternative or a very dangerous and costly mistake.

 

[2001LC]

Delete dup posting

 

[medtro]

Previous owner installed Cardone rack in 2004 LX470. I didn't notice any problem.

 

[jLB]

06 LX470. Factory VGRS rack. Recall done. Polyurethane rack bushings.

When the polyurethane rack bushings were added, the (low speed) steering effort seemed to increase slightly, (but nowhere near our other non-VGRS 100 series) and the steering became more responsive to minor input.

No experience with VGRS having a mind of its own.

Have had rare situations where wheel temporarily is not centered, usually following a hard turn, from a stop, with lots of throttle (think entering a 70+ MPH highway, from a driveway, during rush hour). Has happened ~5-6 times, in 16 years of ownership.

Have had an occasional momentary steering effort increase, at parking lot speeds, in a specific downtown parking garage, going up rather steep ramps.

 

[2001LC]

06 LX470. Factory VGRS rack. Recall done. Polyurethane rack bushings.

When the polyurethane rack bushings were added, the (low speed) steering effort seemed to increase slightly, (but nowhere near our other non-VGRS 100 series) and the steering became more responsive to minor input.

No experience with VGRS having a mind of its own.

Have had rare situations where wheel temporarily is not centered, usually following a hard turn, from a stop, with lots of throttle (think entering a 70+ MPH highway, from a driveway, during rush hour). Has happened ~5-6 times, in 16 years of ownership.

Have had an occasional momentary steering effort increase, at parking lot speeds, in a specific downtown parking garage, going up rather steep ramps.

Poly Bushings, likely just made the feel more noticeable to you.

The "rare situations" are interesting:
A noticeable change entering HWY and the feel changing during low speed turns, may be cause for concern. Certainly if frequency increases.

 

[Slickspawn]

I haven’t felt anything irregular. Replaced rack at 270k with new Lexus VGRS rack. 2006 LX. Snap ring appears to be in correct position.

Intermediate shaft #2 has some play in the U Joints.

I have some light pop/knock noise at low speeds when turning. Hoping it’s the #2 shaft as that’s the only thing not replaced related to steering system.

 

[jLB]

The "rare situations" are interesting:
A noticeable change entering HWY and the feel changing during low speed turns, may be cause for concern. Certainly if frequency increases.

I suspect that I could reproduce the 1st observed issue at will, but it has only “naturally occurred” a handful of times, the first when the vehicle was ~1 year old, and at the next turn, VGRS centers itself. I’m not terribly concerned about this one, but if frequency or situation changes I might get more concerned. This is a wheel centering issue, with no change in feel.

The 2nd observation has me more concerned, I topped off the reservoir after the first occurrence, and flushed on the second. So far it’s only happened in the one specific parking garage, if it ever happens elsewhere, I’ll be digging deeper into the steering system.

 

[jLB]

Poly Bushings, likely just made the feel more noticeable to you.

My assumption is that with the worn rubber bushings, the initial wheel movement just shifted the rack on its mounts, which made the steering seem lighter (kind of like a 2-stage trigger on a rifle), the rack movement would also explain why the steering had a dead spot in the center, and seemed slower, prior to the bushing replacement.

 

[oakleaf]

Here’s my data, hope this helps.

’05 with 80,000.
Body+bumpers+suspension all stock, AHC intact, except:
- Full storage drawers+fridge system installed in rear
- Rear Springs replaced w/ KTRS-79
- Roof rack=Eezi-Awn K9 Crossbars with ARB awning and light rifle case, no major roof weight added

1) I have NOT experienced strange steering issues or the steering symptoms described.


2) R&P replaced, at 68,000, by pervious owner. New R&P type is not in my records, but it has BLACK STRIPE and cost $2.5k at dealer so assume VGRS.

3) Steering at low speed is good. I make a slow and very tight (full-steering rotation) turn to enter my parking space at home. Actually somewhat impressed with the small radius… always smooth and with little effort.

4) Snap Ring Replacement recall performed at 24,000 miles.

 

[MongooseGA]

2005 LX with 315k. Rack was replaced with an OEM Toyota (NOT Lexus) about 40k miles ago(?)

Steering had a dead spot prior to replacement, no issues whatsoever with steering since. Even running 34/35s on the street for years and everything has been fine.

Not sure about the recall.

 

[OregonLC]

Watching this as I need to buy one for The Mule.

I think we need to be careful here of determining the cause / effect nexus. That there were later problems and that a Toyota rack was used may or may not be correlated. The rack is a simple mechanical device that only is driven by its input shaft and pump pressure. That a slightly different gear ratio would cause a later VGRS failure seems unlikely. Since the rack is completely downstream of the VGRS the only way it (the rack) could contribute would be via added force causing VGRS component wear. If this were the case one would expect it to also be correlated with large tires and heavy trail use.

 

[my2003LX470]

All 03-07 LX470, have VRGS installed at the factory, for the USA market.
I'm looking/probing for some anecdotal information:

1st:
Any strange steering issue?
One in which steering suddenly has mind of it's own. Steering suddenly pulls to one side by itself, then releases and repeats. The feel may be very sever veering vehicle direction, or just barely noticeable. Or may just feel a looseness between steering wheel and wheels, on occasion. Anyone with 03-07 LX470, experience this or any other steering issues.

2nd:
Has your steering rack & pinion been replaced. If so with which rack & pinion?
We've multiple Rack & Pinion (R&P) selections:
OEM LX VGRS R&P, which has a black stripe painted on passage side (RH side). Pricey!
OEM LC (non VGRS) R&P, which has a green stripe painted on passage side (RH side). Saves a few Dollars.
OEM re-manufactured, which likely is paint black all over, so indefinite paint stripe covered up. Budged friendly.
After-Market R&P, not likely VGRS. Low cost alternative.

3rd:
Does your steering feel harder than normal to turn, at lower speeds?

Please listing your configuration, which will be very helpful and will be asked if not.
i.e. Pure stock or built and with what toys.

Also please note if your VGRS snap ring recall service has or has not been done.

I have a 2003 LX470. I have replaced the rack and pin. Ha to bring back because steering wheel was off (alignment was good). Mechanic finally was able to get steering straight by disconnecting the battery, because he said it kept trying to self "correct" when battery was attached. Was able to drive for about a week with straight wheel. Now VGRS light is on most of the time and steering wheel is all over the place. Cannot seem to find a mechanic that knows this system.

So, yes. Strange steering issues. Rack and pin replaced, but I don't know which one. Steering seems a bit tighter and it may hum at times. I have learned to deal. I have a pure stock LX. I need to see about the recall. IDK if that was done.

Please let me know how to explain this to a mechanic. Thanks!

 

[jLB]

I have a 2003 LX470. I have replaced the rack and pin. Ha to bring back because steering wheel was off (alignment was good). Mechanic finally was able to get steering straight by disconnecting the battery, because he said it kept trying to self "correct" when battery was attached. Was able to drive for about a week with straight wheel. Now VGRS light is on most of the time and steering wheel is all over the place. Cannot seem to find a mechanic that knows this system.

So, yes. Strange steering issues. Rack and pin replaced, but I don't know which one. Steering seems a bit tighter and it may hum at times. I have learned to deal. I have a pure stock LX. I need to see about the recall. IDK if that was done.

Please let me know how to explain this to a mechanic. Thanks!

On a VGRS equipped vehicle, you re-center the steering wheel “electronically”, not “mechanically”.

Using TechStream:

2006 LX470 crooked steering wheel.

Hello everyone. I did the alignment twice on my LX470 and the steering wheel straighten up after alignment but after a week of driving, the steering wheel goes back to the old poisition and doesn't line up anymore. I had replaced the battery on LX470 3 months ago. I am wondering if battery...

forum.ih8mud.com

If your VGRS light is illuminated, you may have bigger issues.

 

[2001LC]

I haven’t felt anything irregular. Replaced rack at 270k with new Lexus VGRS rack. 2006 LX. Snap ring appears to be in correct position.

Intermediate shaft #2 has some play in the U Joints.

I have some light pop/knock noise at low speeds when turning. Hoping it’s the #2 shaft as that’s the only thing not replaced related to steering system.

pop! Very likely the u-joint of intermediate shaft. Not difficult to replace.

I suspect that I could reproduce the 1st observed issue at will, but it has only “naturally occurred” a handful of times, the first when the vehicle was ~1 year old, and at the next turn, VGRS centers itself. I’m not terribly concerned about this one, but if frequency or situation changes I might get more concerned. This is a wheel centering issue, with no change in feel.

The 2nd observation has me more concerned, I topped off the reservoir after the first occurrence, and flushed on the second. So far it’s only happened in the one specific parking garage, if it ever happens elsewhere, I’ll be digging deeper into the steering system.

Could just be, you're going into turns right way!

2005 LX with 315k. Rack was replaced with an OEM Toyota (NOT Lexus) about 40k miles ago(?)

Steering had a dead spot prior to replacement, no issues whatsoever with steering since. Even running 34/35s on the street for years and everything has been fine.

Not sure about the recall.

"dead spot" was likely, shot rack mounting bushings.

You can call any Lexus Dealership. They'll run you VIN # to see if snap ring recall has been done.

Watching this as I need to buy one for The Mule.

I think we need to be careful here of determining the cause / effect nexus. That there were later problems and that a Toyota rack was used may or may not be correlated. The rack is a simple mechanical device that only is driven by its input shaft and pump pressure. That a slightly different gear ratio would cause a later VGRS failure seems unlikely. Since the rack is completely downstream of the VGRS the only way it (the rack) could contribute would be via added force causing VGRS component wear. If this were the case one would expect it to also be correlated with large tires and heavy trail use.

It has been the assumption, we can use the less costly LC R&P in place of the costly VGRS R&P. Yes, cause & effect can be miss interpreted and often is.

This survey is to see if we "may" be seeing a pattern. If so, we'd then need to start dissecting components to find points of failure and prove if a correlation to R&P choice. I never considered, notice or look for hard slow speed turns w/non VGRS LC R&P substituted, until brought to my attention.

We've one as I mention above in post #5, a thread going on now. Where the day after an LC rack installed, owner clearly noticed harder slow speed steering. 2 years later, his VGRS steering had a dangerous failure. We've yet to diagnosis failure point, much less why. Other than it clearly is VGRS issues, and disconnect the CPU/Power from actuator made no difference.

So for sake of argument. Lets assume his VGRS actuator has failed. And that increased input needed at steering wheel in slow speed. Has to do with difference in LC rack gearing. Which to be clear: I do not know gears are different, only suspect they are. That over time, the extra force needed, cause premature failure of actuator. Owner is then/now faced with a decision. To replace VGRS actuator, and risk early failure again of a very costly part (list about $4K). Replace Actuator and install correct R&P (VGRS). Or convert to LC steering. All very cost ventures. Making wrong choice may increase long term cost, more importantly may lead to saftey issue.

So this is an issue I now feel all VGRS owners need looking at closely. Is saving $500 dollars, worth the risk, or is there even any risk.????

I've only begun to look at this issue.


Sudden brake failure: Took me about 2 year to find the cause and effect of failure. Which started with anecdotal evidence. I can now inspect for and predict premature failures. Even point to how to prevent.

VVT CAT (both) failures. Took me about 2 years to find correct cause, and 1 more years test mod is a cure. Again started with anecdotal information and reports in mud.

I have a 2003 LX470. I have replaced the rack and pin. Ha to bring back because steering wheel was off (alignment was good). Mechanic finally was able to get steering straight by disconnecting the battery, because he said it kept trying to self "correct" when battery was attached. Was able to drive for about a week with straight wheel. Now VGRS light is on most of the time and steering wheel is all over the place. Cannot seem to find a mechanic that knows this system.

So, yes. Strange steering issues. Rack and pin replaced, but I don't know which one. Steering seems a bit tighter and it may hum at times. I have learned to deal. I have a pure stock LX. I need to see about the recall. IDK if that was done.

Please let me know how to explain this to a mechanic. Thanks!

This may just need re-calibration. Until done and done correctly, VGRS light stays on and steering wheel has issue centering. Takes me about an hour to correct! I found this one out, after local Dealership screwed up a VGRS snap ring recall service.

 

[medtro]

Any strange steering issue?
One in which steering suddenly has mind of it's own. Steering suddenly pulls to one side by itself, then releases and repeats. The feel may be very sever veering vehicle direction, or just barely noticeable. Or may just feel a looseness between steering wheel and wheels, on occasion. Anyone with 03-07 LX470, experience this or any other steering issues.

If the non-VGRS rack is suspected to not play well with VGRS system, can you unplug something to disable VGRS? Do you still get strange steering issue with VGRS disabled?

 

[2001LC]

If the non-VGRS rack is suspected to not play well with VGRS system, can you unplug something to disable VGRS? Do you still get strange steering issue with VGRS disabled?

In the one that came to me, with what I think is failure of the VGRS actuator (yet to be confirmed). I unplugged the actuator on a second test drive. Which made no difference, in the steering issue (violent-jerking to right) it is having.


From what I've read: "The actuator includes a brushless DC electric motor and a reduction gear mechanism that controls the speed of the steering rack" . This motor is locked, until power is added to it. So if disconnected my understanding is; It should lock to have normal HWY control, just like the LC steering. But steering at low speed would be hard, possibly harder than and LC IDK!

Here's a promotion press released from 2002 @abuck99 found:

VGRS: LEXUS LX 470 VARIABLE RATIO STEERING A WORLD FIRST​

An advanced variable ratio steering system has debuted on the upgraded Lexus LX 470 luxury all-terrain wagon.

The ground-breaking Variable Gear Ratio Steering system (VGRS) uses an electric motor to adjust the steering ratio according to vehicle speed and steering input from the driver.

The system maintains the high-speed stability of a conventional steering system while providing more direct steering at parking speeds.

It is a standard feature.

VGRS changes the gear ratio – not just the amount of power assistance – to an optimal level for all conditions.

When the steering wheel is centred at highway cruising speeds, the stroke ratio is about the same as that of normal power steering, ensuring excellent directional stability.

VGRS provides faster response at low to medium speeds so that the LX 470 responds with more agility and is easier to handle around city streets and on winding roads.

At extremely low speeds, the VGRS changes to its smallest ratio so that fewer turns lock to lock are required to manoeuvre the LX 470 for parking. The system is said by test drivers to provide faster response at low speeds and easier parking without a loss of feel.

Conventional steering systems are primarily set for highway speeds to prevent the vehicle from making over-sensitive movements in response to the driver’s input, but this consequently requires more steering effort at low speeds.

Power steering can reduce the amount of effort required – with a loss of feel for the driver.

VGRS provides the best of both worlds.

The LX 470’s electronic control unit (ECU) determines the appropriate steering angle and sends a signal to the VGRS actuator mounted halfway down the steering shaft, between the steering wheel and the steering rack.

The actuator includes a brushless DC electric motor and a reduction gear mechanism that controls the speed of the steering rack.

VGRS has been developed to work in conjunction with the LX 470 anti-lock brake system (ABS).

In an emergency skid situation, the ABS control unit sends a signal to the VGRS system, which can provide the driver with faster steering response.

This process happens so quickly that steering correction can be applied faster than with a conventional steering system.

The VGRS ECU is equipped with a diagnosis function and a failsafe function.

LX 470’s Adaptive Variable Suspension (AVS) has also been revised to improve on-road cornering stability and handling responsiveness and off-road ride.

…ends3802