I look at this thread every few days, and I am in awe of how this whole project developed.
I salute you, sir.
Great work.
I salute you, sir.
Great work.
Builds Black Project 80 Engine Build Thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter blkprj80
- Start date
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- Thread starter
- #42
Thanks guys. No, it still isn't running yet. I pulled the injectors and tested them using compressed air at 20 psi and 9V to kick the electric. All of them sprayed, which wasn't at all what I was expecting. So, I'll be putting them all back in and trying it again.
I don't know what was wrong though. The possibilities are:
* Could have been a leaky fuel pressure regulator, but it bench tested okay at around 45 psi it let air through. I do know the vacuum side was loose, and have ordered another, but Landtank said the vacuum only relieved pressure, so that probably isn't it.
* Could be something electrical, but I think I convinced myself that wasn't it by measuring voltage at the connector and also by applying voltage across the injector, which should have opened it up enough to make that cylinder cough, sputter or something. I didn't hear anything change.
* Robbie said he had a problem where he had a valve that didn't quite close, and made him chase his tail for a while. I checked compression in #2 and it was fine.
* I'm pretty sure I had spark on that cylinder. It flashed the timing light. I swapped #1 and #2 plugs but saw no change. The #2 plug wasn't wet with gas, and #1 looked more brown like it had been firing, which it had been.
* WitchHunter did say that they should be used before a couple months, and I was like 5 or 6. Maybe the protectant he uses got gummy and stuck a couple of them. I don't understand why they weren't still plugged up unless by the time I got 'em out they had freed up from the gasoline?
The harness is new, and I can get zero ohms from black/red wire to black/red wire from injector to injector, so I know that part of the circuit is okay. The other wire, when ohmed back to the black/red gets meg-ohms, but that is an open collector transistor driving it, so I don't expect resistance. All wires measure about the same, so there isn't something odd with #2 or #6.
I'm wondering if maybe my fuel pump is barely putting out. I don't see any way to measure fuel pressure easily. I might have to make something with the scrap pressure regulator if I can't come up with something better.
As always, I'm open to any and all suggestions.
I plan to mix up the order of the injectors when I put them back in. That way I can make an educated guess if some still don't work.
I didn't realize OBDII would tell me which cylinders weren't firing. I was using the spray bottle of water and soaking the exhaust manifold. Cylinders that are firing dry off faster. From that, I was sure #2 wasn't firing, and maybe #6. OBDII confirmed my hunch.
I've got parts on order, so my goal is to get all those injectors back in place before my parts arrive. I didn't pull the upper half of the intake, so it isn't quite as easy, but it appears to be do-able. I got 'em out that way! Wish me luck...
I don't know what was wrong though. The possibilities are:
* Could have been a leaky fuel pressure regulator, but it bench tested okay at around 45 psi it let air through. I do know the vacuum side was loose, and have ordered another, but Landtank said the vacuum only relieved pressure, so that probably isn't it.
* Could be something electrical, but I think I convinced myself that wasn't it by measuring voltage at the connector and also by applying voltage across the injector, which should have opened it up enough to make that cylinder cough, sputter or something. I didn't hear anything change.
* Robbie said he had a problem where he had a valve that didn't quite close, and made him chase his tail for a while. I checked compression in #2 and it was fine.
* I'm pretty sure I had spark on that cylinder. It flashed the timing light. I swapped #1 and #2 plugs but saw no change. The #2 plug wasn't wet with gas, and #1 looked more brown like it had been firing, which it had been.
* WitchHunter did say that they should be used before a couple months, and I was like 5 or 6. Maybe the protectant he uses got gummy and stuck a couple of them. I don't understand why they weren't still plugged up unless by the time I got 'em out they had freed up from the gasoline?
The harness is new, and I can get zero ohms from black/red wire to black/red wire from injector to injector, so I know that part of the circuit is okay. The other wire, when ohmed back to the black/red gets meg-ohms, but that is an open collector transistor driving it, so I don't expect resistance. All wires measure about the same, so there isn't something odd with #2 or #6.
I'm wondering if maybe my fuel pump is barely putting out. I don't see any way to measure fuel pressure easily. I might have to make something with the scrap pressure regulator if I can't come up with something better.
As always, I'm open to any and all suggestions.
I plan to mix up the order of the injectors when I put them back in. That way I can make an educated guess if some still don't work.
I didn't realize OBDII would tell me which cylinders weren't firing. I was using the spray bottle of water and soaking the exhaust manifold. Cylinders that are firing dry off faster. From that, I was sure #2 wasn't firing, and maybe #6. OBDII confirmed my hunch.
I've got parts on order, so my goal is to get all those injectors back in place before my parts arrive. I didn't pull the upper half of the intake, so it isn't quite as easy, but it appears to be do-able. I got 'em out that way! Wish me luck...
Good luck, with the attention to detail and quality I have seen in your build thread I believe you will get it sorted out and running.
Yeah swap the injector positions, and see what happens, that way you can rule out injectors if it stays on cylinders 2 and 6.
cruiserbrett
GOLD Star
Have you done a compression check? I know it sounds wierd on a fresh motor, but it will tell you if the valve are functioning as desired(too tight a valve lash or sticking... will result in low compression)
Also, just a hail mary but any chance that you have plug wires 2 and 6 crossed at the cap since theyre in seqential order in the firing order: 1,5,3,6,2,4
Lastly, are the gaps on the plugs good? I dropped a plug down a tube while inserting it, thought nothing of it and installed. turns out I mashed the gap closed and got a misfire.
Also, just a hail mary but any chance that you have plug wires 2 and 6 crossed at the cap since theyre in seqential order in the firing order: 1,5,3,6,2,4
Lastly, are the gaps on the plugs good? I dropped a plug down a tube while inserting it, thought nothing of it and installed. turns out I mashed the gap closed and got a misfire.
cruiserbrett
GOLD Star
Oh, and double check the timing with a light now that you have the run the motor. didnt think it was a big deal but the timing chain tensioner too up some slack on a fresh rebuild as soon as i started cranking a while back and the time was off pretty badly almost immediately.
Did you set it with the jumper clip in place? I made that mistake before...
Did you set it with the jumper clip in place? I made that mistake before...
- Thread starter
- #47
Thanks Brett for the questions, all of them good ones.
I did run a compression check on #2 and found it to be 150, throttle closed, other plugs in, EFI & coil off. I didn't check #6, but I think it is probably okay.
I think I need about 10 more hail mary's, and this was a good thought. Sorry, but I had 'em right. I also verified the only wires that pass through the gap under the wire covers are 4, 5, and 6. So, it's not a mismarked wire or miswire of the distributor.
Gap on #2 plug was good, I checked them all during installation, and I swapped #1 and #2 as a troubleshooting check.
I set the timing right at 3 degrees. I wagged it visually to what it was before I pulled it, and it was about 2 degrees BTDC when I first checked it after starting. Last I checked, it was 3 + a hair. I'll remember to check it after it gets running right though, and thanks for the reminder.
I set the timing with the jumper in, and also remembered to take it back out, which I imagine has happened before as well...
I'm almost ready to set the injectors into the rail and try to lower it into place all at once. I think it will go well. A couple things I didn't realize when I put her together the first time, 1. the bottom of the injectors are an easy slip fit into the "insulators" (big square section o-rings at the bottom end of the injector), and 2. the top end is held together by the o-ring at the top of the injector. FSM says to use gasoline on the o-rings to get them in. I used motor oil per WitchHunter's online FAQ, but this time I'll use gasoline. I think it will help them to slide in place, but the gas will evaporate and the o-rings will hopefully hold the injectors in the rail while I lower the whole enchilada into place and try to start the bolts.
I need to get this back together soon. I've about wore out my mind trying to figure out what to try next if it doesn't run right. At least I'm fairly confident the injectors should not be the problem now that I've bench tested them.
Fun, fun, fun...
I did run a compression check on #2 and found it to be 150, throttle closed, other plugs in, EFI & coil off. I didn't check #6, but I think it is probably okay.
I think I need about 10 more hail mary's, and this was a good thought. Sorry, but I had 'em right. I also verified the only wires that pass through the gap under the wire covers are 4, 5, and 6. So, it's not a mismarked wire or miswire of the distributor.
Gap on #2 plug was good, I checked them all during installation, and I swapped #1 and #2 as a troubleshooting check.
I set the timing right at 3 degrees. I wagged it visually to what it was before I pulled it, and it was about 2 degrees BTDC when I first checked it after starting. Last I checked, it was 3 + a hair. I'll remember to check it after it gets running right though, and thanks for the reminder.
I set the timing with the jumper in, and also remembered to take it back out, which I imagine has happened before as well...
I'm almost ready to set the injectors into the rail and try to lower it into place all at once. I think it will go well. A couple things I didn't realize when I put her together the first time, 1. the bottom of the injectors are an easy slip fit into the "insulators" (big square section o-rings at the bottom end of the injector), and 2. the top end is held together by the o-ring at the top of the injector. FSM says to use gasoline on the o-rings to get them in. I used motor oil per WitchHunter's online FAQ, but this time I'll use gasoline. I think it will help them to slide in place, but the gas will evaporate and the o-rings will hopefully hold the injectors in the rail while I lower the whole enchilada into place and try to start the bolts.
I need to get this back together soon. I've about wore out my mind trying to figure out what to try next if it doesn't run right. At least I'm fairly confident the injectors should not be the problem now that I've bench tested them.
Fun, fun, fun...
cruiserbrett
GOLD Star
Well, since the obvious issues are sorted, its time to look deeper...since the injectors worked with the air and 9v trigger.
So I looked at the factory electrical wiring diagram and per that there is some wiring to check as well since the injectors arent batch fired per say.
By the sounds of it, its worth ohming out the new wiring harness to the ECU connector.
The black/red wire should have 12v present with ignition on, so thats easy to test with a light or meter.
The ground of the injector is supplied by the ECU and per the wiring diagram as you noted is supplied by an individual injector driver(transistor) per bank(unusual in older efi systems since they arent sequential, normally batch fire drives a bank of injectors(3 of the 6) with a single transistor driver)
I would ohm the individual injector control wires all the way to the ECU plug(a pain, but who knows if maybe the harness or connection is bad? Wouldnt be the first time a wire had an internal break in the copper strands... Two in the same new harness would be like the lottery odds, but who knows.
I think you can make a "noid" light pretty easy with an LED and a small ~680ohm resistor to check and see if the ECM is firing the injector. (best done when darker)
So I looked at the factory electrical wiring diagram and per that there is some wiring to check as well since the injectors arent batch fired per say.
By the sounds of it, its worth ohming out the new wiring harness to the ECU connector.
The black/red wire should have 12v present with ignition on, so thats easy to test with a light or meter.
The ground of the injector is supplied by the ECU and per the wiring diagram as you noted is supplied by an individual injector driver(transistor) per bank(unusual in older efi systems since they arent sequential, normally batch fire drives a bank of injectors(3 of the 6) with a single transistor driver)
I would ohm the individual injector control wires all the way to the ECU plug(a pain, but who knows if maybe the harness or connection is bad? Wouldnt be the first time a wire had an internal break in the copper strands... Two in the same new harness would be like the lottery odds, but who knows.
I think you can make a "noid" light pretty easy with an LED and a small ~680ohm resistor to check and see if the ECM is firing the injector. (best done when darker)
- Thread starter
- #49
Thanks Brett. Exactly the type of info I have been needing.
I measured black/red from injector to injector and saw zero ohms. Granted, not under load, but should be good.
I thought about the harness, and I will go down that road once I get the engine put back together with the injectors swapped (1 with 2, 3 with 6, others same as before) and reinstalled.
I probably should have checked further with the electrical, but I thought my "ticking the s*** out of the injector with 9V" while it was running would have caused #2 to cough, spit, fart, or something...
I have checked the inlet sock for #2 and #6 and they look like really fine screens and I don't see how they could be plugged up.
My thoughts were to check the electrical part while she was running by using the ol' #11 exacto knife blade trick on the oscilloscope. I can do #1 and #2 and compare.
(The #11 exacto blade trick is that the thin long point of that blade will make a small hole through the insulation and allow you to touch the copper wire inside to take a voltage measurement)
I think for a noid you might need to load the circuit to make sure the transistor is healthy. I have lots of ideas if needed to test that portion of the circuit. I just hope it doesn't come to it....
I measured black/red from injector to injector and saw zero ohms. Granted, not under load, but should be good.
I thought about the harness, and I will go down that road once I get the engine put back together with the injectors swapped (1 with 2, 3 with 6, others same as before) and reinstalled.
I probably should have checked further with the electrical, but I thought my "ticking the s*** out of the injector with 9V" while it was running would have caused #2 to cough, spit, fart, or something...
I have checked the inlet sock for #2 and #6 and they look like really fine screens and I don't see how they could be plugged up.
My thoughts were to check the electrical part while she was running by using the ol' #11 exacto knife blade trick on the oscilloscope. I can do #1 and #2 and compare.
(The #11 exacto blade trick is that the thin long point of that blade will make a small hole through the insulation and allow you to touch the copper wire inside to take a voltage measurement)
I think for a noid you might need to load the circuit to make sure the transistor is healthy. I have lots of ideas if needed to test that portion of the circuit. I just hope it doesn't come to it....
cruiserbrett
GOLD Star
The 'scope would help for sure, and you could just do it with the engine just cranking without the fuel pump fuse in or the injectors connected. that way you can do each one and not pierce the wire, if you could just ohm the injector (13 ohms or so I would guess) and bridge each injector plug youre testing with a resistor of similar value stuck into the connector, and youd have an easy spot to attach the probes. wattage probably would not matter since the time the injector is open is so short its not like its gonna have to sink the heat from 1 amp continuous.
If you have a dual channel scope it would be great since you can compare two injector signals...
I dont know if I would want to intentionally pierce the insulation since it may introduce a problem spot down the road...
I'd go with a noid light and see what the injector is doing when cranking. Compare to other known working injector feeds. I dont think you need to load the transistor, but who knows?
With the igniton on, you should see 12v at each black/red wire when the light/meter is grounded to the engine or chassis.
after that, its on to ohming the wiring harness and ecu. An easy trick I learned is AFTER the ecu is disconnected, jumper the each injector plug with a paperclip and turn the ignition on. then just test the ECU injector plug pins for the 12V and youll see which wire is bad or has unusually high resistance showing as reduced voltage present or if your using a light, a dimmer bulb.
- Thread starter
- #51
Update 01/06/13.
Still not running, but I've got the injectors back in place and I'm waiting for a new throttle body gasket so I can put the rest back together. And a new fuel pressure regulator as well.
R&R-ing the injectors wasn't too difficult, but it took me a while because I am slow.
Removing and replacing the injectors can be done without removing the upper intake half. It does take a lot of time, but I have plenty of that.
I ended up removing a lot of little things just to make barely enough room to get the injector rail out and back in. Nothing impossible, but torx sockets, wobble sockets, and gear-wrenches were my friends.
Some of the tricks I used:
Raise the back end of the truck way off the floor. This gets the front down and makes it much easier to reach the firewall. Also, the fuel flowed to the regulator end, making it easy to clean up.
Best use of a worm gear clamp I've found
Move all the electrical harness as far over as you can. Unbolt it from the firewall, and disconnect everything you can except what goes through the intake runner between 4&5. I used those velcro straps like you use to bundle up all the cables behind your home stereo to hold the harness over out of the way. There is a gray connector that hangs over the #2 injector about 5" straight above it; you will need to remove this from the tab that it is mounted on; easy work, but the rail won't go through the gap with it there.
To get the EGR off, remove the studs so it can slide forward and off the EGR tube (with the big nut). Remove the EGR assembly first which makes it a lot easier to remove the throttle body.
When I had the injectors out, I bench tested each one with compressed air and 9VDC to open them. Much to my dismay, all 6 of them worked just fricken' fine and dandy dammit. I was expecting 2 and 6 to not work, but no.
I made up a test rig using a piece of 1/4NPT brass pipe. I bored the center out to 7/16, using a 7/16 reamer as the final step for a nice smooth bore. I used a piece of my old harness for an injector connector. I found one with the click tab broken off so I wouldn't have to fight it to unclip it each time. Finding one with a broken tab was easy, as most will understand...
At first, I was able to see a fine spray of what fuel was left, and then only air flow. Still, each and every one of them seemed to work just fine. I even tested #2 and #6 at a low (15psi) pressure at first, just in case they needed more pressure. They flowed fine at that low pressure.
Just to mix things up, I rearranged the injectors for the reinstall. The problem will either stay with the original cylinders or move with the injectors.
Getting the rail and injectors back in place was a challenge. I ended up having to remove the bolt that holds the fuel return line inside the intake. Wobble socket made it easy. I tied string around the bolts to keep them and the spools in place. I then dipped each injector o-ring end into gasoline and slid it into the rail. After the gas sort of dried up a bit, they all wanted to stay in the rail nicely, even when carefully hung upside down. I wiggled and jostled until I had all 6 tips at the big "seal" end aligned and it came into place quite nicely. I then cut my strings and removed the strings and ran the bolts in a ways. After I checked it all out visually, I tightened all three bolts, thanks again gear-wrench!
So now it's mostly hooked back up and I'm waiting for new parts to finish the rest.
I'm thinking I may need to find some way to check my fuel pressure from the fuel pump. I drained the tank as much as I could using the drain plug, and then put in about 6 gallons of fresh hi-octane; this was all before I tried to start it the first time. I may be pulling a fuel pump before this is all over. Is there anything I can check on the fuel pump in the meantime? Is there a specific way it should sound? Is there any way to force it to run without cranking the engine? I don't recall hearing it run, but something must be happening since there was fuel getting to the front.
As always, thanks for any help!
Still not running, but I've got the injectors back in place and I'm waiting for a new throttle body gasket so I can put the rest back together. And a new fuel pressure regulator as well.
R&R-ing the injectors wasn't too difficult, but it took me a while because I am slow.
Removing and replacing the injectors can be done without removing the upper intake half. It does take a lot of time, but I have plenty of that.
I ended up removing a lot of little things just to make barely enough room to get the injector rail out and back in. Nothing impossible, but torx sockets, wobble sockets, and gear-wrenches were my friends.
Some of the tricks I used:
Raise the back end of the truck way off the floor. This gets the front down and makes it much easier to reach the firewall. Also, the fuel flowed to the regulator end, making it easy to clean up.
Best use of a worm gear clamp I've found
Move all the electrical harness as far over as you can. Unbolt it from the firewall, and disconnect everything you can except what goes through the intake runner between 4&5. I used those velcro straps like you use to bundle up all the cables behind your home stereo to hold the harness over out of the way. There is a gray connector that hangs over the #2 injector about 5" straight above it; you will need to remove this from the tab that it is mounted on; easy work, but the rail won't go through the gap with it there.
To get the EGR off, remove the studs so it can slide forward and off the EGR tube (with the big nut). Remove the EGR assembly first which makes it a lot easier to remove the throttle body.
When I had the injectors out, I bench tested each one with compressed air and 9VDC to open them. Much to my dismay, all 6 of them worked just fricken' fine and dandy dammit. I was expecting 2 and 6 to not work, but no.
I made up a test rig using a piece of 1/4NPT brass pipe. I bored the center out to 7/16, using a 7/16 reamer as the final step for a nice smooth bore. I used a piece of my old harness for an injector connector. I found one with the click tab broken off so I wouldn't have to fight it to unclip it each time. Finding one with a broken tab was easy, as most will understand...
At first, I was able to see a fine spray of what fuel was left, and then only air flow. Still, each and every one of them seemed to work just fine. I even tested #2 and #6 at a low (15psi) pressure at first, just in case they needed more pressure. They flowed fine at that low pressure.
Just to mix things up, I rearranged the injectors for the reinstall. The problem will either stay with the original cylinders or move with the injectors.
Getting the rail and injectors back in place was a challenge. I ended up having to remove the bolt that holds the fuel return line inside the intake. Wobble socket made it easy. I tied string around the bolts to keep them and the spools in place. I then dipped each injector o-ring end into gasoline and slid it into the rail. After the gas sort of dried up a bit, they all wanted to stay in the rail nicely, even when carefully hung upside down. I wiggled and jostled until I had all 6 tips at the big "seal" end aligned and it came into place quite nicely. I then cut my strings and removed the strings and ran the bolts in a ways. After I checked it all out visually, I tightened all three bolts, thanks again gear-wrench!
So now it's mostly hooked back up and I'm waiting for new parts to finish the rest.
I'm thinking I may need to find some way to check my fuel pressure from the fuel pump. I drained the tank as much as I could using the drain plug, and then put in about 6 gallons of fresh hi-octane; this was all before I tried to start it the first time. I may be pulling a fuel pump before this is all over. Is there anything I can check on the fuel pump in the meantime? Is there a specific way it should sound? Is there any way to force it to run without cranking the engine? I don't recall hearing it run, but something must be happening since there was fuel getting to the front.
As always, thanks for any help!
Your question is beyond my know how, but figured I'd give you a bump with the hope that someone else can help.
Last edited:
I've worked on FI systems and installed a couple of megasquirt units. I've run into very similar issues. The final solution was found by using a scope, you cab get a 4 channel USB scope using windows 7/xp.
$29 at http://www.dataq.com/products/startkit/di145.html
I would check the trigger signal going to ecm for the crank position, the catch the signal from each injector (or one that is working vs N2 cylinder). Injection firing is not sequencial and are typically fired in "batches". Swapping injector plugs will either cause to stay with the same injector or migrate.
Also, how does the ODB knows the injector has not been fired? It is using the injector coil feedback? If so, it would again point out to a wiring issue.
Btw, the one major problem I resolved was because of a positive damaged to the wire that was
Shaved.
$29 at http://www.dataq.com/products/startkit/di145.html
I would check the trigger signal going to ecm for the crank position, the catch the signal from each injector (or one that is working vs N2 cylinder). Injection firing is not sequencial and are typically fired in "batches". Swapping injector plugs will either cause to stay with the same injector or migrate.
Also, how does the ODB knows the injector has not been fired? It is using the injector coil feedback? If so, it would again point out to a wiring issue.
Btw, the one major problem I resolved was because of a positive damaged to the wire that was
Shaved.
And I hate the auto spell function on my tablet!!!
If i can be so brazen but how much did the replacement hoses set you back. Im going to be rebuilding my engine shortly and would like to know
- Thread starter
- #56
I don't recall how much the hoses themselves cost. If it was rubber I replaced it. Well, all except the fuel pressure and return lines since they still seemed decent. I also didn't change out the transmission soft lines since they are synthetic and still nice and flexible. There are websites that have diagrams and list prices. The vendors on here will give you 25% off list.
Havo,
Thanks for almost scaring the s*** out of me about the OBD2 sensing the misfire. I did a google search and found that it actually senses the deceleration of the crankshaft when a cylinder doesn't fire. Now THAT's pretty slick I think! After I read your comment, I was wondering also. Still could be a bad wire though, although I would expect a new harness to be tested. Could be a couple pins backed out, but things ohm out fairly well.
I have a 2 channel scope that will work well enough for what I need.
You said it was batch fired. I'm pretty sure SFI means Sequential Fuel Injection, and that's what is on this engine.
Havo,
Thanks for almost scaring the s*** out of me about the OBD2 sensing the misfire. I did a google search and found that it actually senses the deceleration of the crankshaft when a cylinder doesn't fire. Now THAT's pretty slick I think! After I read your comment, I was wondering also. Still could be a bad wire though, although I would expect a new harness to be tested. Could be a couple pins backed out, but things ohm out fairly well.
I have a 2 channel scope that will work well enough for what I need.
You said it was batch fired. I'm pretty sure SFI means Sequential Fuel Injection, and that's what is on this engine.
- Thread starter
- #57
Welllllll, s***... I just started her up and found that the problem followed the injectors.
I now have a misfire code on 1 and 3 (was 2 and 6 before I swapped them). Sure enough, I had swapped 1 & 2 and 3 & 6.
So, the problem appears to be injectors, even though I thought I had successfully bench tested them with 20 psi air and 9V.
Dammit, dammit, dammit...
A couple questions though:
Could it be a bad or weak fuel pump? I don't know the history, and I thought I heard the pump run a few seconds after I cranked the engine for a couple seconds. I am fairly certain I didn't hear it run at first key on - should it??
Could it be low fuel in the tank? I had drained all I could from the drain plug and added about 5 or 6 gallons of fresh 91 octane. It reads barely above E on the gauge. I would think 5 gallons would be enough to get her going, but maybe not? I had a honda accord that would give me fits at below a quarter tank. That was a bad fuel pickup I think, I never bothered to fix it.
I disconnected and plugged the (brand new) fuel pressure regulator to see if that increase in pressure would help the injectors - no luck.
It is damn cold here and I didn't want to open up the shop to run the engine. I got some 3" aluminum vent hose and one of those "rotate to fit" elbows. I straightened the elbow and slid it over the exhaust pipe and then rotated it until it bound onto the pipe. The other end went out through the garage door.
I raised the garage door and blocked it with a 4x4 and a 2x6 to keep the air from coming in down low. As you know, the top of the door tilts in when you raise it, so I removed the wheel brackets and used a piece of wood to wedge it closed at the top. It seemed to work quite well, and my CO detector hasn't started screaming yet so I think it's working.
Here's a couple pics:
Anyone have any ideas as to why my injectors don't seem to be firing? I'm pretty sure it's the injectors now since the problem followed them.
I did send Gordon at WitchHunter an email several weeks ago, but he didn't reply. Maybe he missed it during the holiday season?
Helllp?????
Thanks!
I now have a misfire code on 1 and 3 (was 2 and 6 before I swapped them). Sure enough, I had swapped 1 & 2 and 3 & 6.
So, the problem appears to be injectors, even though I thought I had successfully bench tested them with 20 psi air and 9V.
Dammit, dammit, dammit...
A couple questions though:
Could it be a bad or weak fuel pump? I don't know the history, and I thought I heard the pump run a few seconds after I cranked the engine for a couple seconds. I am fairly certain I didn't hear it run at first key on - should it??
Could it be low fuel in the tank? I had drained all I could from the drain plug and added about 5 or 6 gallons of fresh 91 octane. It reads barely above E on the gauge. I would think 5 gallons would be enough to get her going, but maybe not? I had a honda accord that would give me fits at below a quarter tank. That was a bad fuel pickup I think, I never bothered to fix it.
I disconnected and plugged the (brand new) fuel pressure regulator to see if that increase in pressure would help the injectors - no luck.
It is damn cold here and I didn't want to open up the shop to run the engine. I got some 3" aluminum vent hose and one of those "rotate to fit" elbows. I straightened the elbow and slid it over the exhaust pipe and then rotated it until it bound onto the pipe. The other end went out through the garage door.
I raised the garage door and blocked it with a 4x4 and a 2x6 to keep the air from coming in down low. As you know, the top of the door tilts in when you raise it, so I removed the wheel brackets and used a piece of wood to wedge it closed at the top. It seemed to work quite well, and my CO detector hasn't started screaming yet so I think it's working.
Here's a couple pics:
Anyone have any ideas as to why my injectors don't seem to be firing? I'm pretty sure it's the injectors now since the problem followed them.
I did send Gordon at WitchHunter an email several weeks ago, but he didn't reply. Maybe he missed it during the holiday season?
Helllp?????
Thanks!
- Thread starter
- #58
IT RUNS!!!
Today is the day! She purrs like a kitten with 6 good injectors. Gordon's customer service is top notch!
Thanks Gordon!
I sent the injectors to Gordon again, and he said there were two that didn't flow right. He did say it was uncommon for these, but it does happen.
I was so happy to hear it fire up on all 6! A big difference from when the injectors were not working right.
I shifted the tranny through the gears and put in another 2 quarts to bring it up to the cool line. I ended up adding a total of 9 quarts from a full drain. That's including the torque converter - almost a quart.
I was happy to see the "D" light when I changed the gears. How long until that goes away?
I haven't cycled the thermostat yet. Maybe tomorrow. For now, she gets to cool back down. I got it up to 176, but the t-stat didn't open even after quite a few minutes. The heater core seems to be flowing as the lines were hot.
I am so glad the problem was relatively simple. Yeah, injectors are a PITA to swap out, but nothing like going after an oil pump o-ring for example.
So, YAHOOOOO!!! She's running on all 6 now!!!!
(sorry for all the emoticons, but that's about I feel right now!!!)
Oh Yeah!!!!
sticky injectors, IH8 'em!
I can't wait to drive this baby under her own power...
Tomorrow is going to be a blast!! We's a goin' for a ride! (even if it is only around the yard due to tags and insurance reasons...)
Today is the day! She purrs like a kitten with 6 good injectors. Gordon's customer service is top notch!
Thanks Gordon!I sent the injectors to Gordon again, and he said there were two that didn't flow right. He did say it was uncommon for these, but it does happen.
I was so happy to hear it fire up on all 6! A big difference from when the injectors were not working right.
I shifted the tranny through the gears and put in another 2 quarts to bring it up to the cool line. I ended up adding a total of 9 quarts from a full drain. That's including the torque converter - almost a quart.
I was happy to see the "D" light when I changed the gears. How long until that goes away?
I haven't cycled the thermostat yet. Maybe tomorrow. For now, she gets to cool back down. I got it up to 176, but the t-stat didn't open even after quite a few minutes. The heater core seems to be flowing as the lines were hot.
I am so glad the problem was relatively simple. Yeah, injectors are a PITA to swap out, but nothing like going after an oil pump o-ring for example.
So, YAHOOOOO!!! She's running on all 6 now!!!!
(sorry for all the emoticons, but that's about I feel right now!!!)
Oh Yeah!!!! sticky injectors, IH8 'em! I can't wait to drive this baby under her own power...
Tomorrow is going to be a blast!!
We's a goin' for a ride! (even if it is only around the yard due to tags and insurance reasons...)
Fan-freaking-tastic!!!
cruiserbrett
GOLD Star
Sweet! Glad it wasnt a bigger issue(ECU)!!!
