Towing with a 200-series Toyota Land Cruiser

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FergieAndJesus said:
Ho

How do you like the OME MT64s so far, towing and not towing? Which springs did you add to the rears? How much did you lift the front and back?
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Great suspension kit in all situations. Great road handling with or without weight on the back. I have the taller progressive springs in the rear, and the front coils set on the first perch to achieve a somewhat factory rake. This gets me level when towing fully loaded, and avoided the need for airbags to keep all the off-road flex. The anti-rattle pin inside the B&W also really keeps the truck 'locked' in with the trailer and tows much smoother.
That being said, I think you could save a few bucks and go with the Bilstein for similar performance.
 
Thank you for your reply.

A couple of broad questions to the towing watchers. New trailer coming next week, 3k dry, probably loaded will land 3750-4k depending on how much water I drive with. I'm planning on 650ish between the tongue weight and what's inside the back.

I will be towing with a 2021 LC with 56k miles and stock suspension. I want to upgrade the suspension, but not sure I can get that done before first trip. New suspension will be setup for daily driving, so I plan to augment with either airbags or the blue Sumosprings. These will be what I will put on for the first trip regardless of getting a new suspension installed in time.

I've read most of the airbag posts, it's seems like they're fairly durable, better with the airbagman sleeves, but not sure I can get those shipped in time unless there is a US source. I have three weeks from yesterday, so Sumosprings or the Firestone bags w/out sleeve are the most likely mow solutions.

I do not do any extreme off-roading with the LC and if I go with the Sumosprings, I'll add spacers to lift them when I do get a mild lift so that I can dial in the gap to keep the engagement right.

What say you ? Bags or Sumosprings?
 
FergieAndJesus said:
Thank you for your reply.

A couple of broad questions to the towing watchers. New trailer coming next week, 3k dry, probably loaded will land 3750-4k depending on how much water I drive with. I'm planning on 650ish between the tongue weight and what's inside the back.

I will be towing with a 2021 LC with 56k miles and stock suspension. I want to upgrade the suspension, but not sure I can get that done before first trip. New suspension will be setup for daily driving, so I plan to augment with either airbags or the blue Sumosprings. These will be what I will put on for the first trip regardless of getting a new suspension installed in time.

I've read most of the airbag posts, it's seems like they're fairly durable, better with the airbagman sleeves, but not sure I can get those shipped in time unless there is a US source. I have three weeks from yesterday, so Sumosprings or the Firestone bags w/out sleeve are the most likely mow solutions.

I do not do any extreme off-roading with the LC and if I go with the Sumosprings, I'll add spacers to lift them when I do get a mild lift so that I can dial in the gap to keep the engagement right.

What say you ? Bags or Sumosprings?
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I went with the Firestone bags and have had no problems in 5 years. TRU Automotive installed them for me since I am a one banana mechanic and probably would have needed a new engine if I had done it myself. I think it took them about 2 hours to do it. Also, I run the stock suspension and my trailer is about 5K lbs.
 
FergieAndJesus said:
Thank you for your reply.

A couple of broad questions to the towing watchers. New trailer coming next week, 3k dry, probably loaded will land 3750-4k depending on how much water I drive with. I'm planning on 650ish between the tongue weight and what's inside the back.

I will be towing with a 2021 LC with 56k miles and stock suspension. I want to upgrade the suspension, but not sure I can get that done before first trip. New suspension will be setup for daily driving, so I plan to augment with either airbags or the blue Sumosprings. These will be what I will put on for the first trip regardless of getting a new suspension installed in time.

I've read most of the airbag posts, it's seems like they're fairly durable, better with the airbagman sleeves, but not sure I can get those shipped in time unless there is a US source. I have three weeks from yesterday, so Sumosprings or the Firestone bags w/out sleeve are the most likely mow solutions.

I do not do any extreme off-roading with the LC and if I go with the Sumosprings, I'll add spacers to lift them when I do get a mild lift so that I can dial in the gap to keep the engagement right.

What say you ? Bags or Sumosprings?
Click to expand...

Never heard of sleeves

I ran the firestones in my 100 series and flogged the hell out of it with 1000s of harsh Offroad miles.

Firestone bags had zero issues whatsoever and did what they were supposed to do
 
I have the airbagman version (= Firestone + Kevlar Sleeve) allowing me to level even higher tong weights using them at 30 to 35 psi no sweat. Very pleased with them.

Having said that, standalone Firestone’s for lighter trailers should be perfectly fine especially if time is not on your side 👍🏻
 
FergieAndJesus said:
Thank you for your reply.

A couple of broad questions to the towing watchers. New trailer coming next week, 3k dry, probably loaded will land 3750-4k depending on how much water I drive with. I'm planning on 650ish between the tongue weight and what's inside the back.

I will be towing with a 2021 LC with 56k miles and stock suspension. I want to upgrade the suspension, but not sure I can get that done before first trip. New suspension will be setup for daily driving, so I plan to augment with either airbags or the blue Sumosprings. These will be what I will put on for the first trip regardless of getting a new suspension installed in time.

I've read most of the airbag posts, it's seems like they're fairly durable, better with the airbagman sleeves, but not sure I can get those shipped in time unless there is a US source. I have three weeks from yesterday, so Sumosprings or the Firestone bags w/out sleeve are the most likely mow solutions.

I do not do any extreme off-roading with the LC and if I go with the Sumosprings, I'll add spacers to lift them when I do get a mild lift so that I can dial in the gap to keep the engagement right.

What say you ? Bags or Sumosprings?
Click to expand...

Considering the load is moderate, airbags shouldn't be necessary. If this is a travel trailer, I'd recommend a different approach. Perhaps consider a lightweight weight distribution hitch. This levels the vehicle and will do the job better in several ways: 1. transfer load to the trailer axle 2. transfers load to the tow vehicle front axle 3. provide anti-sway resistance 4. reduce porpoising
 
@TeCKis300 I've used a traditional WD hitch before with a 3k lb trailer and didn't really like it. It could've been mismatched, it came with a trailer I bought used. I have looked at the Anderson WD hitches, they seem a bit gentler? and tuned for lighter trailers, not the 7-10k lb trailers. Also ease of backup, handles dips and potholes better, etc., allegedly. I'm trying to avoid the big bars, etc. and all that force and tension through a WD hitch clamped onto an aluminum frame.

Anyone familiar and experienced with Anderson WD hitches on here?
 
FergieAndJesus said:
@TeCKis300 I've used a traditional WD hitch before with a 3k lb trailer and didn't really like it. It could've been mismatched, it came with a trailer I bought used. I have looked at the Anderson WD hitches, they seem a bit gentler? and tuned for lighter trailers, not the 7-10k lb trailers. Also ease of backup, handles dips and potholes better, etc., allegedly. I'm trying to avoid the big bars, etc. and all that force and tension through a WD hitch clamped onto an aluminum frame.

Anyone familiar and experienced with Anderson WD hitches on here?
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Fair points and yes, you're on right path in regards to finding a balanced solution.

I've towed a lighter Airstream 23D (4750 dry, 6000 GVWR) with an Anderson before. I would highly recommend it as a solution for your setup. Lightweight, clean, and easy to use.

I tow a much heavier trailer now and a big bar setup to transfer more weight is what's necessary.

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FergieAndJesus said:
Thank you for your reply.

A couple of broad questions to the towing watchers. New trailer coming next week, 3k dry, probably loaded will land 3750-4k depending on how much water I drive with. I'm planning on 650ish between the tongue weight and what's inside the back.

I will be towing with a 2021 LC with 56k miles and stock suspension. I want to upgrade the suspension, but not sure I can get that done before first trip. New suspension will be setup for daily driving, so I plan to augment with either airbags or the blue Sumosprings. These will be what I will put on for the first trip regardless of getting a new suspension installed in time.

I've read most of the airbag posts, it's seems like they're fairly durable, better with the airbagman sleeves, but not sure I can get those shipped in time unless there is a US source. I have three weeks from yesterday, so Sumosprings or the Firestone bags w/out sleeve are the most likely mow solutions.

I do not do any extreme off-roading with the LC and if I go with the Sumosprings, I'll add spacers to lift them when I do get a mild lift so that I can dial in the gap to keep the engagement right.

What say you ? Bags or Sumosprings?
Click to expand...
I run airbagman bags and they’ve been trouble free. First set I had with springs that were too light for my use case so I had them running 65 PSI when towing and I beat the crap out of those things on and off road. I did lower the PSI to 30 when towing off road. Eventually I upped my springs to a more appropriate size and that’s when I had to get a new pair of bags, getting the original bags out of the original springs was literally impossible because the will mold to the shape often springs.

I’d do bags over sumosprings just because they are dynamic and you can have a regular ride when you’re not towing. However, with bags you’ll need a way to inflate them.

Load up and find a CAT scale, you may want to up your spring rates. I found that estimating the weight vs actually weighing usually yields different results.
 
TeCKis300 said:
Fair points and yes, you're on right path in regards to finding a balanced solution.

I've towed a lighter Airstream 23D (4750 dry, 6000 GVWR) with an Anderson before. I would highly recommend it as a solution for your setup. Lightweight, clean, and easy to use.

I tow a much heavier trailer now and a big bar setup to transfer more weight is what's necessary.

View attachment 4139534
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cool setup @TeCKis300
 
FergieAndJesus said:
@TeCKis300 I've used a traditional WD hitch before with a 3k lb trailer and didn't really like it. It could've been mismatched, it came with a trailer I bought used. I have looked at the Anderson WD hitches, they seem a bit gentler? and tuned for lighter trailers, not the 7-10k lb trailers. Also ease of backup, handles dips and potholes better, etc., allegedly. I'm trying to avoid the big bars, etc. and all that force and tension through a WD hitch clamped onto an aluminum frame.

Anyone familiar and experienced with Anderson WD hitches on here?
Click to expand...

I've got an Anderson on my 2108FBS Winnebago (figure ~5500lb, although I haven't weighed it). It's the only WD hitch I've ever used, and I'm very happy with it. Works great and I drive just like I would tow a trailer without a WD hitch at all, in the sense that there's nothing special/unusual about dips/potholes/turning/backing up/etc. No noises, easy to hook up and disconnect, does not limit me in any way.
 
The only complaints I’ve heard about the Anderson WDH are that the attachment is specialized and the amount of weight it transfers is somewhat limited. I don’t have any experience with them though

I have had excellent luck with the BlueOx and would recommend that with the lighter WD bars. I had a friction-sway ProSeries hitch before but the BlueOx does a much much better job preventing sway and can transfer more weight off the rear. I think I paid about it $500 for mine
 
I had a LC and a 3700(ish) trailer and I found the WDH to be more of a pain than a help. The extra weight of the hitch was offset by the WD gain. I had the “bare” Firestone bags with no sleeve and they were fine after a couple of hundred thousand miles. As far as the sleeves go, there is an old saying about fishing gear, some of it is made to catch fishermen and some is made to catch fish. I would question the ability of Kevlar to protect the bags. My very limited experience with Kevlar is that wasn’t flexible or particularly “smooth”.
 
The info and informed opinions here are invaluable to me, thank you. @GordJ that was my experience as well with the WD I had, ultimately found I didn't need it and it must be close to 100lbs. New trailer adds 1000 lbs, so thought I would revisit it. I think I'm less worried about transferring much of the weight than I am interested in the additional stability/anti-sway.

I think I'm going to skip WD for now, I can pick one up if my experience changes with this trailer.

I appreciate all of the info on the airbags. I'm kind of surprised nobody has used the Sumosprings like airbags, they're progressive, super easy install and with the right gap, they only engage at the point you want them to. I like the idea, but so much more experience here with bags, I may just pivot to those.
 
FergieAndJesus said:
The info and informed opinions here are invaluable to me, thank you. @GordJ that was my experience as well with the WD I had, ultimately found I didn't need it and it must be close to 100lbs. New trailer adds 1000 lbs, so thought I would revisit it. I think I'm less worried about transferring much of the weight than I am interested in the additional stability/anti-sway.

I think I'm going to skip WD for now, I can pick one up if my experience changes with this trailer.

I appreciate all of the info on the airbags. I'm kind of surprised nobody has used the Sumosprings like airbags, they're progressive, super easy install and with the right gap, they only engage at the point you want them to. I like the idea, but so much more experience here with bags, I may just pivot to those.
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That's a sound plan and it could work well on its own. Recommend to keep the ball as close and tight to the rear bumper as possible to minimize leverage of the tongue loads regardless of what you do.

I ran airbags at a time, but found they do not like extreme off-roading, articulation, and high speed Baja style running. If you don't use your rig that way, may work well.

Skip the Sumosprings - it's not a good solution that has proven out time and time again on many heavy rigs (even outside the 200-series). Riding on giant rubber bushings may seem like a good idea, but it's a terrible way to ruin a finely tuned suspension.
 
GordJ said:
x2 on the short shank hitch. And remember that the LX needs a longer hitch pin. It is a real PITA when you go to install your brand new insert and can't figure why it doesn't lock.
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The Master Lock 1465DAT hitch pin works great on the LX, I'm really happy with it.

Easy to use, good fit, and stays solid in place.
 
For this application at lower pressures regular Firestones will work fine. The airbagman Kevlar sleeves are very well done though and allow higher pressures without the Firestones bulging out and damaging thenselves. Good luck with the choice!
 
FergieAndJesus said:
Thank you for your reply.

A couple of broad questions to the towing watchers. New trailer coming next week, 3k dry, probably loaded will land 3750-4k depending on how much water I drive with. I'm planning on 650ish between the tongue weight and what's inside the back.

I will be towing with a 2021 LC with 56k miles and stock suspension. I want to upgrade the suspension, but not sure I can get that done before first trip. New suspension will be setup for daily driving, so I plan to augment with either airbags or the blue Sumosprings. These will be what I will put on for the first trip regardless of getting a new suspension installed in time.

I've read most of the airbag posts, it's seems like they're fairly durable, better with the airbagman sleeves, but not sure I can get those shipped in time unless there is a US source. I have three weeks from yesterday, so Sumosprings or the Firestone bags w/out sleeve are the most likely mow solutions.

I do not do any extreme off-roading with the LC and if I go with the Sumosprings, I'll add spacers to lift them when I do get a mild lift so that I can dial in the gap to keep the engagement right.

What say you ? Bags or Sumosprings?
Click to expand...
Your trailer is the same as mine for weight. The effect of water on tongue weight depends on where the water tank is. I installed airbags to help the otherwise stock rear suspension and I run them at a low pressure after experimenting a lot. I really like the Andersen WDH for my setup and it works fine with my aluminum frame trailer. I also run it at a light setting, using it more for sway control than weight distribution. It’s relatively light and very user friendly for my aging self. In about 30k miles of towing, it has proved invaluable for comfort and control, really transforming the towing experience on rough roads, windy conditions, and in heavy truck traffic. I would never tow without it. The only maintenance is replacing the friction cone about every 10k miles. It’s easy to do and Andersen gives you those free for life.
 
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