Both a 3fe and a 1fz are comparable in reliability if properly base lined.
Thoughts on 1991 Cruiser (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter MarshallDillon
- Start date
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
I respectfully disagree and have had the exact opposite experience. Prudence calls for baselining any vehicle of this age. That shouldn't confuse the fact that the 3FE's longevity and reliability is legend; it's literally one of the most reliable gasoline engines ever produced.
I have my 3FE since stock, and have ownership for about 3 yrs now. and in hindsight, i am glad i got the 3fe and not the 1fz-fe mainly due to HGs failures (yes, do a search on the forum, and it happens frequently), and many other modern features that is less desirable for off roading: cracked leather, power seats malfunction, ABS sensor, PHH woes, etc etc. I love the simplicity of the engine design, easy to work on, low maintenance, arguable stronger bus tranny, and thanks to all the hate on mud, the price of a 91/92 is a real bargain. If reliability is your thing, and it should, the 3FE should be a no brainer. If you want to go fast, get a 96-97 and go turbo....
I have personally know of at least (3) 1fz-fe with blown HGs (local), and this has been only 3 yrs of ownership.
Im not saying the 3fe is unreliable, but it needs to be baselined to be reliable-and thats not a quick task. You have to replace every seal and gasket, all hoses, water pump, fuel pressure regulator, o2 sensor and cat, and reseal all electrical connections. And then its reliable again.
Last edited:
Hmmmm head gasket or upgrade brakes? I know which one I would rather do.
SmokingRocks
hopelessly addicted to Cruisers
93-94 had the best of both worlds IMO. the 1fz + A442F bus transmission + rear disk + full float axle.
Yes the 1fz tends to loose its head gasket BUT only after it's been overheated. So if you keep the fan belts and cooling system in good nick its just as reliable as a 3f. The added power IMO is worth replacing a head gasket every 6-10 years (its really not more than a Saturday job anyway.
FYI I've bought and sold a 94 FZJ80 with 460,000mi on the original head gasket and trans. It drove as well as mine.
Yes the 1fz tends to loose its head gasket BUT only after it's been overheated. So if you keep the fan belts and cooling system in good nick its just as reliable as a 3f. The added power IMO is worth replacing a head gasket every 6-10 years (its really not more than a Saturday job anyway.
FYI I've bought and sold a 94 FZJ80 with 460,000mi on the original head gasket and trans. It drove as well as mine.
I have an FJ80 and I don't think there's any way to objectively say it's better than the FZJ80. The engines are definitely different generations. The 3F-E is an old school overhead valve engine that sounds like a tractor and basically drives like a tractor. In a way it's really sweet and the engine and drivetrain mechanically speaking is top quality. The 1FZ-FE is a much more modern engine with more power. The 3F-E's obscurity, age and lower amount of available parts probably offsets the 1FZ-FE's complexity and potential head gasket issues as far as an advantage one way or another reliability wise.. MPG sounds like it's about the same.
Whether or not the FJ80 is too slow is a matter of opinion, or maybe perspective. I can get around fine in the FJ80 and it will easily do 70+ on the freeway if it's flat. The biggest weakness is hills at highway speed. You might have to downshift it into 3rd to not slow down too much. You can basically forget about accelerating to pass people. Might as well get the slow vehicle triangle. That said even though my other car is relatively fast as cars go, the slowness of the FJ80 doesn't bother me because I drive it differently.
Say what you will about the FJ80 but it sure seems like there are a suspiciously large % of them still driving around. Just a quick check on craigslist about half of the 80 series are FJ80s that run and drive. I think they are worth having and fixing up, and are possibly under-valued. A nice FJ62 is worth a ton of money and objectively speaking it's worse than an FJ80.
I have had to "baseline" my FJ80 and it has taken a lot of work, time, and parts, but this seems to be the case with the FZJ80 too.
Is it worth having an FJ80? Only you can decide...
Whether or not the FJ80 is too slow is a matter of opinion, or maybe perspective. I can get around fine in the FJ80 and it will easily do 70+ on the freeway if it's flat. The biggest weakness is hills at highway speed. You might have to downshift it into 3rd to not slow down too much. You can basically forget about accelerating to pass people. Might as well get the slow vehicle triangle. That said even though my other car is relatively fast as cars go, the slowness of the FJ80 doesn't bother me because I drive it differently.
Say what you will about the FJ80 but it sure seems like there are a suspiciously large % of them still driving around. Just a quick check on craigslist about half of the 80 series are FJ80s that run and drive. I think they are worth having and fixing up, and are possibly under-valued. A nice FJ62 is worth a ton of money and objectively speaking it's worse than an FJ80.
I have had to "baseline" my FJ80 and it has taken a lot of work, time, and parts, but this seems to be the case with the FZJ80 too.
Is it worth having an FJ80? Only you can decide...
Since we're mud-slinging now
...My truck has 330k miles on it and frankly pretty poor maintenance to the best of my knowledge (sorry, LC gods). Never blown a head gasket, despite slapping a home-brew turbo on it, haven't blown a PHH, and my radiator is in one piece, although I doubt that is original. They are in the same ballpark in terms of reliability. I offered up some kind words to the 3fe earlier in this thread, but it's not as though one is a 22re and the other is a Ford CVH.
I am not sure why you feel the need to resort to foul language emoticons to express yourself....... I am sorry if I offended you with my opinion and experience with my rig. everyone is free to have their own opinion. I would not consider stating my experience with my rig as " mud slinging". Again I am sorry if I offended you.
Last edited:
Everything that has been said in this thread, and the many many many threads just like it, is 100% subjective. In either case you're making a purchase of a 22-28 year old vehicle. From this perspective, it is folly to say one is "better" than the other. What you are hearing are emotional responses to emotional issues.
The "adventure" of owning an old school vehicle is a very personal one. Buy the vehicle that speaks to you. There is no right or wrong.
The "adventure" of owning an old school vehicle is a very personal one. Buy the vehicle that speaks to you. There is no right or wrong.
The 3fe is less powerful but nothing wrong with it other than that. But once both motors are base lines as any 20 year old motor should be with full coolant system, hoses, fluids, and so on both are reliable. My 1fz runs a nice steady 188-195 degree all day long once baselined. The 1fz is a great motor and good power at sea level. I feel it has plenty of power as a daily driver on 33" and full armor. At high elevation it is lacking power. Going to Moab loaded up going over I70 is tough with the 1fz. It must really suck in a 3fe. I wouldnot want to give up any of the power i have with the 1fz. But that argument has been beat to death and there are many happy 3fe owners.
I think the 93 and newer trucks have other good improvements such as the rear brakes and other things. But basically buy the cleanest truck you can. Interior parts and body are hard to fix. I would be skeptical of major repairs such as motor or trans rebuilds unless i know the shop that did the repairs. These motors should not need rebuilding if well maintained.
I think the 93 and newer trucks have other good improvements such as the rear brakes and other things. But basically buy the cleanest truck you can. Interior parts and body are hard to fix. I would be skeptical of major repairs such as motor or trans rebuilds unless i know the shop that did the repairs. These motors should not need rebuilding if well maintained.
- Thread starter
- #35
I appreciate the healthy debate and passion of all you owners. There are other LCs for sale in my area - FJ80s, FZJ80s, and 100s. I will look at this FJ80 this morning but also look at some of the others. It seems like many LCs for sale in my area (Portland OR) are about $5K higher that what mud members think is appropriate. Although I have seen some mid to late 90s (I know those include both 80s and 100s) around $10K and that seems pretty good.
Thanks again for everyone's opinion. The fact is that they're all good if taken care of. I want to use it more than work on it so I have to keep that in mind.
Thanks again for everyone's opinion. The fact is that they're all good if taken care of. I want to use it more than work on it so I have to keep that in mind.
I'm not offended and I hope you're not either. I've always found
to be a friendly icon Just saw you calling out some of the common 1fz areas of concern and thought I should mention it's not like they're all going to happen just because it's a 1fz. Like @jonheld said, we're getting a little subjective here and I just wanted to stick up for my preferred platform.- Thread starter
- #37
Ok, in case you were interested, the seller sold the 1991 LC to a buyer who had been looking at it previously. So I didn't look at it after all. For reference, the seller was kind enough to share with me that he got $8500.
Thanks for following up, and that was more than I thought it'd go for. There is one for sale locally to me that is listed for $10.5k. And it's been redone from front to back. Maybe they'll get close to asking. But it's coming up on 6 months on CL.
The 1fz is a iron block with a LONG aluminum head. To the best of my limited knowledge the 3fe is iron block and iron head. When over heated the 1fz will be more prone to warming a head and then blowing a HG. Aluminum and iron expand at different rates when heated. I dont consider this being "less reliable". To me that is like saying "when motor XYZ is run without oil...". Dont run your motor with out oil. DONT OVER HEAT YOUR MOTOR! Even a 3fe will not be happy if you over heat it. That is simple auto stuff 101.
I have been saying for a long time that i think the majority of 1fz HG issues are due to them being over heated. The coolant systems are 20 years old and they should be replaced top to bottom. Once that is done they run 189-195 degrees all day. I think i see 203 from time to time on long mountain passes. The 3fe should also have the coolant system replaced, hoses get weak, thermostats stick and radiators rust up.
But this is all just silly. I prefer the 1FZ. But if i found a great 3fe and i was shopping i would get it. I just think it is silly to say the 1fz is not reliable. It is. Simple.
Get the nicest cruiser you can with the stuff that matters to you on it.
PS i also think the 93-94 are the best, best dash syle, no air bags, simple OBDI, lockers, disk brakes, 1FZ and A442F. but justmy biased opinion.
When I talk truck motors with some of my students, I always get a kick out of their expression when I tell them the 3FE has timing gears like the tractors they use at the fair. 
Needless to say, I've converted a few domestic boys into Toyota fans with my '92
Needless to say, I've converted a few domestic boys into Toyota fans with my '92
