How are 35" on a 80 for a expo rig?

[Box Rocket]

I think we need to mention 255/85's for the expedition rig.

Think of it like this, the Eiffel Tower has four large and very wide legs--the amount of pressure each base has on the ground is about as much as a man sitting in a chair, or 190lbs. The distribution of weight across the base is very wide. The same principles apply to tires, larger tires are typically wider and the distribution of weight becomes more evident in slippery conditions. I know, I know, skinnies are ugly and don't have the same appeal as say a Nitto or Cooper.

Skinnies are probably the least talked about; but, they are one of the most if not the best tire for a Land Cruiser, period. The amount of pressure per square inch becomes a factor in snow, ice, sleet and rain. You mentioned 90% would be on the road...you need to think of how a larger tire performs in these adverse conditions on a flat road. I'm sure 35's and 37's do great here too, but the the skinny is king.

Zona

This is a never ending debate. Narrow tires can be effective in certain conditions for sure. I ran some 33x10.50s (close equivalent to the 255) on my Tacoma for a couple years, before changing to 33x12.50. In my personal experience, the only advantage I had with the narrower tires was less rolling resistence that resulted in a very slight increase in fuel economy. On paper there are perceived benefits to a narrower tire. But from my personal experience in the locations I travel I had better traction, better stability with the wider tire. Snowy conditions are one area that are hotly debated between wide tires and skinny tires. Again, from my experience I traveled much farther in deep snow with wider tires than I could with the narrower ones.

Conditions can vary enough from location to location that could make a narrow tire a preferable choice. For me it was not. That isn't to say they are a bad choice. When I had the skinnies I didn't really have complaints, but when I switched to a wider tire the improvements were noticeable in every condition except for highway driving fuel economy. The skinnies seemed to wander a bit more on the highway however. That could be a result of the steering feel being lighter because of less rolling resistance (smaller contact patch), but in general I felt the wider tire tracked straighter.

Again, just one person's experience.

 

[DanMedeiros]

I't would be great to get everyone's advice on my 80. I am not a rock crawler and but do use my truck several days a week off the pavement. I'm mostly interested in doing long trips to go surfing/skiing/rock climbing. I love that my 80 feels great on the highway but can crush just about anything reasonable at Hollister Hills offroad park here in CA. A goal I have is to do the wagon run on the rubicon.

I currently have 285/75/16s. My current suspension is pretty old and perhaps overloaded. I have the standard height OME kit that has about 120,000 miles on it. I am currently loaded up with an ARB bumper, winch, drawer kit, sliders, skid plate, 4x4 lab bumper, and a 150LB roof tent. With all this weight I've been advised to add heavier springs. If I go that route I'll end up with a 2inch lift

So my question is given what I do with my truck should I spring for 35s? Would it make a difference if I wanted to try stuff like the rubicon? Does it screw up you gas mileage and road handling even more?

 

[Box Rocket]

I't would be great to get everyone's advice on my 80. I am not a rock crawler and but do use my truck several days a week off the pavement. I'm mostly interested in doing long trips to go surfing/skiing/rock climbing. I love that my 80 feels great on the highway but can crush just about anything reasonable at Hollister Hills offroad park here in CA. A goal I have is to do the wagon run on the rubicon.

I currently have 285/75/16s. My current suspension is pretty old and perhaps overloaded. I have the standard height OME kit that has about 120,000 miles on it. I am currently loaded up with an ARB bumper, winch, drawer kit, sliders, skid plate, 4x4 lab bumper, and a 150LB roof tent. With all this weight I've been advised to add heavier springs. If I go that route I'll end up with a 2inch lift

So my question is given what I do with my truck should I spring for 35s? Would it make a difference if I wanted to try stuff like the rubicon? Does it screw up you gas mileage and road handling even more?

You're going to definitely want to upgrade the suspension and you'll want 35's at a minimum for the Rubicon. People have done it with less but you'll be constantly dragging the bottom of the truck and getting stuck.

 

[DanMedeiros]

You're going to definitely want to upgrade the suspension and you'll want 35's at a minimum for the Rubicon. People have done it with less but you'll be constantly dragging the bottom of the truck and getting stuck.

Thanks for the advice. What are the downsides in your experience to 35s (besides cost).

 

[Box Rocket]

Thanks for the advice. What are the downsides in your experience to 35s (besides cost).

Slight loss of power unless you regear. Otherwise, not many downsides.

 

[cruiserdan]

Eats more fuel, more expensive to replace, harder to balance and heavier to lift (that last part affects old guys like me the most ).

That being said I run 315/75/16 Mickey Thompson Baja MTZs on my 80.

 

[Box Rocket]

Eats more fuel, more expensive to replace, harder to balance and heavier to lift (that last part affects old guys like me the most ).

That being said I run 315/75/16 Mickey Thompson Baja MTZs on my 80.

Valid points when comparing to a smaller tire.

 

[DanMedeiros]

Thanks everyone. One more question! Is it wise to upgrade to cromoly axles when upsizing to 35s? I am about to have my knuckles rebuilt and was considering this in prep for 35s.

 

[Dragos80]

I struggle getting my 33 spare tire up on the bumper, my back hurts.
How do you guys lift your 37's without any back pain?

 

[Box Rocket]

Thanks everyone. One more question! Is it wise to upgrade to cromoly axles when upsizing to 35s? I am about to have my knuckles rebuilt and was considering this in prep for 35s.

If you have the cash to replace the axles with chromo ones then by all means go for it. Not going to hurt, that's for sure. That being said, I have been running stock axles with 35's for 16 years with no breaks (knock on wood).

 

[Box Rocket]

I struggle getting my 33 spare tire up on the bumper, my back hurts.
How do you guys lift your 37's without any back pain?

lift with the legs.

 

[Nay]

Thanks everyone. One more question! Is it wise to upgrade to cromoly axles when upsizing to 35s? I am about to have my knuckles rebuilt and was considering this in prep for 35s.

Depends on your relationship with the skinny pedal. I run 37's on stock axles and I generally average 13-15 mpg re-geared to 5.29's. That gear tire combo is an 18% gearing ratio reduction compared to stock (lower gearing) according to my Yellow Box, and it does cap "comfortable" top end speed at around 75 mph @ 2,700-2,800 RPM.

Of course, if your 80 is happy cruising at higher RPM all good, but I kinda figure a natural limiter is a good thing because evasive maneuvers at some point on a lifted rig are best negotiated at lower speeds. There's nothing wrong with chromoly axles, although in the front especially I'd rather break something on the axle side than the R&P. For the rear, an axle getting twisted in the locking collar is a potential issue if you have the factory lockers, although most rear axle issues on axles of this size are usually proceeded by some form of extra throttle that is maybe just shy of "hold my beer". To the extent bigger tires enable slower crawling, as long as one sticks to crawling and is willing to admit defeat when it's time to drop the hammer, then probably all good. YMMV.

As for downsides to bigger tires, to me it's really downsides to taller lifts in regards to geometry and the cost of gearing, which will be an improvement over stock gearing and 33's. Most people are probably re-centering the axles with adjustable panhards, you might end up with some driveshaft angle alignment work, etc. However, once dialed, those are not recurring items. And since that work and cost is effectively identical for 35's and 37's, my personal view is that feeling limited to 35's is usually based on excessive up travel in the suspension travel design, and that's usually based on OME around here.

One other thought is that larger tires continue to make big strides. The 37" BFG AT ko2 I run (I swore I would never run another BFG AT) are ridiculously civilized on pavement. I have 24K on them and they are quiet and completely balanced, and have not seen a second visit to a balancing machine. They feel like a 33 to me, all things being relative (I used to run 37" trxus).

Now I did pay Discount Tire Direct $10 extra a tire for a special listen-for-problems session since I was buying rims at the same time, and maybe I got the four best tires they had because of that, but from a road use perspective it is just silly that these are 37s. I don't even have any balance weights on the outside of the rims.

Having said all of that, the best advice is don't run the Rubicon and then you don't have to do any of it .

 

[DanMedeiros]

Depends on your relationship with the skinny pedal. I run 37's on stock axles and I generally average 13-15 mpg re-geared to 5.29's. That gear tire combo is an 18% gearing ratio reduction compared to stock (lower gearing) according to my Yellow Box, and it does cap "comfortable" top end speed at around 75 mph @ 2,700-2,800 RPM.

Of course, if your 80 is happy cruising at higher RPM all good, but I kinda figure a natural limiter is a good thing because evasive maneuvers at some point on a lifted rig are best negotiated at lower speeds. There's nothing wrong with chromoly axles, although in the front especially I'd rather break something on the axle side than the R&P. For the rear, an axle getting twisted in the locking collar is a potential issue if you have the factory lockers, although most rear axle issues on axles of this size are usually proceeded by some form of extra throttle that is maybe just shy of "hold my beer". To the extent bigger tires enable slower crawling, as long as one sticks to crawling and is willing to admit defeat when it's time to drop the hammer, then probably all good. YMMV.

As for downsides to bigger tires, to me it's really downsides to taller lifts in regards to geometry and the cost of gearing, which will be an improvement over stock gearing and 33's. Most people are probably re-centering the axles with adjustable panhards, you might end up with some driveshaft angle alignment work, etc. However, once dialed, those are not recurring items. And since that work and cost is effectively identical for 35's and 37's, my personal view is that feeling limited to 35's is usually based on excessive up travel in the suspension travel design, and that's usually based on OME around here.

One other thought is that larger tires continue to make big strides. The 37" BFG AT ko2 I run (I swore I would never run another BFG AT) are ridiculously civilized on pavement. I have 24K on them and they are quiet and completely balanced, and have not seen a second visit to a balancing machine. They feel like a 33 to me, all things being relative (I used to run 37" trxus).

Now I did pay Discount Tire Direct $10 extra a tire for a special listen-for-problems session since I was buying rims at the same time, and maybe I got the four best tires they had because of that, but from a road use perspective it is just silly that these are 37s. I don't even have any balance weights on the outside of the rims.

Having said all of that, the best advice is don't run the Rubicon and then you don't have to do any of it .

Is it likely that I need to do all that adjustment if I just get a 2 inch lift?

 

[jvazquez53]

I have 315x75x16. I had 35.12.50x15 which were about the same height. Liked both. The reason for the change was that I made a brake upgrade...

 

[warezdog]

Running GG 315's well over a year now on OME 850/863 as a DD. When I rebuilt the front axle I got lucky and found a pair of lightly used Bobby Longfield birfs so to extend their life I also installed a PT kit so they wouldn't wear prematurely. If you're doing chromoly birfs for a DD you're going to put wear on them and they won't last as long as a factory birf.

To go 35's didn't cost much considering my stock springs and shocks needed to be replaced anyhow. Other than that all I've done is extended the sway bars and bump stops and added some OME castor correction bushings. What I have yet to do is do the extended brake line mod although I haven't flexed it enough to rip anything out yet.

It will ride along at 80 on the highway just fine if you're wallet can afford single digit MPG but personally I feel better running it at under 70 just because any evasive maneuvering at 80 can get sketchy in a +3.5 ton rig plus my wallet is happier. Always drive it in power mode for the lower shifting points and during winter at first sign of snow fall I'll run with the front hubs locked and push the center diff button when I feel the need to.

I had considered going 33's but glad I skipped and went bigger, General Grabbers have been a great tire for me so far, what I don't like about them is they don't clean out well in mud and love to pick up and spit out gravel the size of a nickel. Overall they perform well in snow and rain plus you can stud them. All in mounted and balanced from walley world was just under $1200 for 5 after rebate. Got them to PM a Sears ad at just over $200/tire and then used their cheap mount and balance with road hazard and lifetime rotation.

I'll buy them again unless I decide to do the recentered 37" HMMWV with GY MTR's, only time and my wallet will decide if that happens!

 

[BillyGoatMTB]

No I didn't. I've been driving an 80 on 35's since 2000 and the entire time has been with stock gears. Until now! I've had a set of 4.88s for more than a year and have been getting them installed this week. I should be driving it tomorrow with the new gears.

Read the whole thread and your post stood out to me.

I'm close to completing my rig build. finally getting to suspension and tires. After tremendous amount of reading and thought I don't think I'll be happy with anything other than 315's. I saw you ran 315's with stock gears for 16 years? How did your regear go?

I assume stock gears were fine and totally DD or you would have regeared sooner?

Thanks

 

[dsmud4u]

if you are set on doing 35" tires..skip it and do 37s.....you won't regret the decision........if you are not so sure, stick with the 33" tires.

35's is a size that is the swiss army of tires....little bit of this and little bit of that!

37's give you the balls to try different things!

I concur. With in two months I was wishing I had gone with 37”s. Would of helped a bit more on a recent snow wheeling trip.

 

[Box Rocket]

Read the whole thread and your post stood out to me.

I'm close to completing my rig build. finally getting to suspension and tires. After tremendous amount of reading and thought I don't think I'll be happy with anything other than 315's. I saw you ran 315's with stock gears for 16 years? How did your regear go?

I assume stock gears were fine and totally DD or you would have regeared sooner?

Thanks

Regear went well. I've had Nitro 4.88's for the past couple years now. I'll point out that everyone has a slightly different level of what is acceptable driveability. When I ran the 315's with stock gears, I found it totally acceptable as a daily driver and wheeler for many years. Is it ideal, no, but perfectly acceptable IMO if you aren't in a position to pay for a regear and want to jump up to 315's. With stock gearing you'll have lower rpms and will lose some speed climbing long highway hills, or downshift to maintain speed. If you're towing you'll scrub speed faster.

Don't misunderstand me. I completely believe it is a good decision to regear with an appropriate ratio for your tire size. But I wouldn't put off a tire purchase (especially 315's) because you haven't changed gears yet. Just put gears on your list and get to it when you can.

 

[BillyGoatMTB]

Regear went well. I've had Nitro 4.88's for the past couple years now. I'll point out that everyone has a slightly different level of what is acceptable driveability. When I ran the 315's with stock gears, I found it totally acceptable as a daily driver and wheeler for many years. Is it ideal, no, but perfectly acceptable IMO if you aren't in a position to pay for a regear and want to jump up to 315's. With stock gearing you'll have lower rpms and will lose some speed climbing long highway hills, or downshift to maintain speed. If you're towing you'll scrub speed faster.

Don't misunderstand me. I completely believe it is a good decision to regear with an appropriate ratio for your tire size. But I wouldn't put off a tire purchase (especially 315's) because you haven't changed gears yet. Just put gears on your list and get to it when you can.

This is perfect thank you

I've done a massive amount of work to this rig in the three months that I've had it too much to list. I've become fond of and have a new appreciation for buying a vehicle where the previous owner had done no maintenance versus the wrong butchered maintenance or upgrades.

This vehicle's been in the no maintenance category and it's been getting a lot of love.

I plan to eventually re gear and add front and rear e lockers So based in all my reading and this brief conversation I feel confident running 315s with stock gears for a while

Thanks

 

[LandCruiserPhil]

315 and stock gears are fine if you are OK with driving your 80. Many do not feel comfortable running their 1FZJ above 4000. My 80 loves 4000 and above the cool WT proves it's happy there. I travel all over the SW and pull any hill at 65.
That said IMO stock gears and 37 are a stretch. You suffer the most offroad with this set up in or lack of low range gearing.

Turning over 200K at ~4400rpm in July pulling a 7% grade and lovin it.