80 Series brake hydro booster conversion installed (1 Viewer)

baldilocks

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Ok, I’m sold with that explanation. Thank you.

I just ordered the Wits End @NLXTACY ABS Sensor delete kit.

I’ll start piecing this thing together. I’ll probably Have to call your supplier & ask questions on the best parts to cobble together. I’d prefer to not install parts upside & inside out. But if that booster you got is superior to others, not a big deal. I’m guessing once installed it’s done.

I still prefer an OEM MC I think. It doesn’t need to be Toyota, but I prefer Toyota factory parts. But it may not be compatible, unless someone were to make a conversion bracket kit.
I would encourage you, or anyone, to do a lot of your own research. Maybe you will make discoveries that I missed during your journey to stopping your 80 in half the distance.

You will find that running the booster upside down is very common especially in the classic muscle car and hotrod community. Installing this way simply looks cleaner when using the GM booster. Once the air is bled from the PS steering fluid circuit, the booster operates normally.

Unless a MC with larger bore is used, pedal travel will remain the same unless it’s air that’s trapped in your abs circuitry that is causing longer than normal pedal travel. I don’t care for a long pedal travel. I have been in situations off road where my rig is nosed up toward the sky, my body is smashing back into the seat and I can’t or can barely reach far enough to apply the brakes effectively. The only way to combat this is to move the seat forward when the wheeling begins and feel cramped all day. A shorter pedal travel is my answer to this problem.
 
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jjdeneen918

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I would encourage you, or anyone, to do a lot of your own research. Maybe you will make discoveries that I missed during your journey to stopping your 80 in half the distance.

You will find that running the booster upside down is very common especially in the classic muscle car and hotrod community. Installing this way simply looks cleaner when using the GM booster. Once the air is bled from the PS steering fluid circuit, the booster operates normally.

Unless a MC with larger bore is used, pedal travel will remain the same unless it’s air that’s trapped in your abs circuitry that is causing longer than normal pedal travel. I don’t care for a long pedal travel. I have been in situations off road where my rig is nosed up toward the sky, my body is smashing back into the seat and I can’t or can barely reach far enough to apply the brakes effectively. The only way to combat this is to move the seat forward when the wheeling begins and feel cramped all day. A shorter pedal travel is my answer to this problem.

So it looks like the company you used makes a firewall-to-hydrobooster bracket to install the item to our Land cruisers. Correct?

Is the linkage to attach hydro booster to pedal assembly custom to our specific too? Is it a direct bolt-on that wouldn’t be possible if sourcing junk yard boosters?

The hoses that you select, what do they entail? Do they replace the 2 stock hoses, high & low pressure? Do they piggyback with the stock hoses?

If you had some pictures for reference/clarification, that would be amazing.

I wasn’t able to find answers to these questions looking over the internet.

-Jeff
 

baldilocks

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Yes, yes and yes and all the pics I have were already posted.

Not be an ass, but, all your questions were answered in my original post and, for sure, somewhere in the rest of thread.

You will need to replace your pressure hoses with the two that come in the kit due to completely different routing - pump to booster to steering gear box.

The boost is a straight bolt in affair that anyone who has common sense could do except that I had to rotate the bracket 180* in order to mount the booster upside down. You could specify this when you place the order to save yourself the time and trouble.

The linkage is just like the stock one and was super easy to attach.

The kit came me as ready to install as I would want it to be leaving me options for mounting and hose routing.

There was twice the necessary amount of hose provided and the field installable AN fittings were another easy thing to do once I cut the pressure hoses to the desired length.

This is not a difficult project for someone who has some machine maintenance as repair experience.

If your are serious about ordering this kit, I suggest reading this thread very thoroughly and then have fun learning and doing a semi custom sort of install.
 

jjdeneen918

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I’ll have to read this thread again. Sorry for duplicating questions.

I asked based off looking at the website. It didn’t really state what the hoses entailed. I wasn’t sure if you kept the original hoses & added new, or if it was a complete swap of new parts/hoses.

Installing booster upside down is no big deal, if that’s how it is defined to work for our rigs. I was just curious as the website didn’t mention having to do that.

I appreciate your time, this is on my to-do list.
 

baldilocks

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I’ll have to read this thread again. Sorry for duplicating questions.

I asked based off looking at the website. It didn’t really state what the hoses entailed. I wasn’t sure if you kept the original hoses & added new, or if it was a complete swap of new parts/hoses.

Installing booster upside down is no big deal, if that’s how it is defined to work for our rigs. I was just curious as the website didn’t mention having to do that.

I appreciate your time, this is on my to-do list.
Call Matt Sweeting at Power Brake Service (Speed Manufacturing) with a written list of questions so as to minimize the number of calls you need to make because he is a one man operation and doesn’t have a lot of time to dedicate to phone calls. I can’t say there is any one best time to call but when you do speak with him, his knowledge base will be obvious.
 

baldilocks

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Updating to report continued, problem free, braking performance consistent with day one of the modification.

Had my rig in some rocks out at Browns Camp and all I can say is that having absolute control over the sharp drops is very nice.
 

baldilocks

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E42D9899-690B-49FB-A6C7-36D929C781AF.jpeg

The ups guy just dropped off my new tie rod and super duper ARP knuckle studs from Front Range. These stud take 120lbft of torque. That’s a good thing.

Has anyone ever replaced knuckle studs with the knuckle in place? It looks very tight.
 

landtank

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the new style studs with yhe torx head is pretty easy. Not much thread exposed with the arm in place for double nutting and the dust shield makes it tight to work on the outside 2. I'd tear it down.
 
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@baldilocks or anyone else that might have some insight. Any ideas how our stock pump would handle hydroboost + hydro assist? Would it result in even more sluggish steering and/or diminished braking power if the pump is being overworked? Did some reading on Pirate and feedback appears mixed. Some guys said they noticed no difference, others weren't happy with the results but obviously none of these guys were talking about an 80 series.

I like the idea of hydroboost but don't want to lose or impact the ram assist. I reached out to Bramac in OZ who builds upgraded vac boosters for the FJ80 but they don't have cores available and aren't sure if/when they'll build more.
 

baldilocks

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@jcardona1 With out hydro assist the brakes and steering play well together. Funny you should present this question right now because I’m in the process of installing my Redhead upgraded and ported steering gear, PSC reservoir with two return ports and the Redneck Ram cylinder kit as soon as it arrives.

Braking power should never take a hit because the fluid is routed to the booster first and it reserves all rights to fluid power first. According to west Texas off-road, some people say the steering speed at low engine rpm is ok and others opt to do the pump mod and drill out the pressure port and modify the bypass valve for more pressure. Our pumps bypass at 1,500 which should be sufficient. Also, per WTOR instructions in their FAQ’s, which are actually for a Saginaw pump, never drill the passageway of the pump beyond 5/32”. Our pressure port is a fat 5/32” already.

If I run into super sluggish steering with foot on the brake pedal while steering, which happens mostly in town, I probably send my booster off to VanCo in SoCal so they can work their magic inside the booster to help it flow more freely. The pump mod I’ll probably do last. Who knows at this point???

We all have a different opinion about what’s acceptable and what’s not. I drive my rig on the road much more than off road so I don’t want sluggish steering at idle or just off idle. But, we can get used to it if it isn’t too bad. They also say steering can feel dead and be twitchy at highway speeds. Just something else to adjust to. I’ll be posting all this to my thread eventually.
 
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@jcardona1 With out hydro assist the brakes and steering play well together. Funny you should present this question right now because I’m in the process of installing my Redhead upgraded and ported steering gear, PSC reservoir with two return ports and the Redneck Ram cylinder kit as soon as it arrives.

Braking power should never take a hit because the fluid is routed to the booster first and it reserves all rights to fluid power first. According to west Texas off-road, some people say the steering speed at low engine rpm is ok and others opt to do the pump mod and drill out the pressure port and modify the bypass valve for more pressure. Our pumps bypass at 1,500 which should be sufficient. Also, per WTOR instructions in their FAQ’s, which are actually for a Saginaw pump, never drill the passageway of the pump beyond 5/32”. Our pressure port is a fat 5/32” already.

If I run into super sluggish steering with foot on the brake pedal while steering, which happens mostly in town, I probably send my booster off to VanCo in SoCal so they can work their magic inside the booster to help it flow more freely. The pump mod I’ll probably do last. Who knows at this point???

We all have a different opinion about what’s acceptable and what’s not. I drive my rig on the road much more than off road so I don’t want sluggish steering at idle or just off idle. But, we can get used to it if it isn’t too bad. They also say steering can feel dead and be twitchy at highway speeds. Just something else to adjust to. I’ll be posting all this to my thread eventually.

Thanks for the feedback. I'll be watching your progress closely. I'm working on a brake overhaul trying to solve the infamous mushy pedal which will eventually lead me to the booster. At $600 for the OEM option, I'd rather spend a few more bucks and end up with a better solution. My braking has really started to suck even with a brand new Aisin MC.

After I did ram assist I found low RPM steering way too sluggish. Trying to parallel park once was a nightmare so I drilled out the port which helped a bit. Don't recall how large I drilled, but it was whatever was recommended here on MUD. It's a shame we have no high output pump options for our trucks.
 

baldilocks

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Thanks for the feedback. I'll be watching your progress closely. I'm working on a brake overhaul trying to solve the infamous mushy pedal which will eventually lead me to the booster. At $600 for the OEM option, I'd rather spend a few more bucks and end up with a better solution. My braking has really started to suck even with a brand new Aisin MC.

After I did ram assist I found low RPM steering way too sluggish. Trying to parallel park once was a nightmare so I drilled out the port which helped a bit. Don't recall how large I drilled, but it was whatever was recommended here on MUD. It's a shame we have no high output pump options for our trucks.
A few days ago I was digging through internet and found a thread on Mud from a long time ago where Slee adapted a PSC pump to the passenger side of the engine using a York bracket. They said It worked well even though the pumps proximity to reservoir was not favorable.

At what rpm does your steering wake up and work at an acceptable rate?
 

on the rocks

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@baldilocks is there some reason Matt routed the pump to the brakes first in the kit and not as shown in this diagram on their site and include the electric motor ? This seems like a good solution for the sluggish steering if you choose to go the ram assist or even without.
The MR2 also had an electric hydro assist motor at one point that seems like it would also work along with the 80 pump.
Even with the routing he set up for you maybe running after the brake system and before the steering would be a good solution.
Paring that Wilwood MC/ PV with my calipers is very tempting but not having issues with the ABS or LSPV yet but may be heading that direction at some point after seeing this.
 

baldilocks

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@baldilocks is there some reason Matt routed the pump to the brakes first in the kit and not as shown in this diagram on their site and include the electric motor ? This seems like a good solution for the sluggish steering if you choose to go the ram assist or even without.
The MR2 also had an electric hydro assist motor at one point that seems like it would also work along with the 80 pump.
Even with the routing he set up for you maybe running after the brake system and before the steering would be a good solution.
Paring that Wilwood MC/ PV with my calipers is very tempting but not having issues with the ABS or LSPV yet but may be heading that direction at some point after seeing this.
It makes sense to give priority to the hydro booster. I don’t have a lot of design experience but I do know that my diesel powered pickup is plumbed the same with fluid going to the booster first.

I put hydro boost on a different rig years ago and was advised to route fluid to the booster and then to the steering box on that build too.

As for an electric pump, it seems like just one more thing to complicate a rig that gets abused off road but perhaps worth looking into.
 

on the rocks

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Ran across this today. Don't remember what you said your booster cost but they look similar. The part that caught my eye was they claim almost twice the stopping distance...
May return the T100 MC and not sure I even need it and maybe start stacking parts to go this route(with your booster) at some point. Loving my Wilwood calipers and think I may have a rear match if I can sort out the mounting and this would take it to the next level. 37" and over without a doubt should look into a better braking system, especially if towing or any windshield time.
 

Feldrian

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@baldilocks great thread - Thanks for really detailed info. I've been conflicted about adding hydroboost - I love the idea and have had positive experiences in the past, but I'm really hesitant to mess with the factory system due to liability concerns. Although with 37s under the truck I'm probably already screwed if I get beaten up by lawyers.

The abs unit can develop internal corrosion or simply stop working. The plumbing system is so long and complicated that bleeding the system is a near impossibility for a shade tree mechanic without the ability to activate the abs pump during the bleeding process. I can now bleed by gravity alone and the likelyhood of my rig crashing into a bus load precious cargo is many times less than before.

ABS is only there to hopefully assist the driver, who has already screwed up, to make the best of a crappy situation. If people drove sanely and defensively abs wouldn’t be needed. I can honestly say that abs has never done me any favors over the course of 36 years driving.
Totally agree that you're probably less likely to have a braking related accident with hydroboost. Also fully aware that facts never matter to lawyers and they'll take any opportunity they can get to squeeze money out of drivers and their insurance companies.
 

baldilocks

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@baldilocks great thread - Thanks for really detailed info. I've been conflicted about adding hydroboost - I love the idea and have had positive experiences in the past, but I'm really hesitant to mess with the factory system due to liability concerns. Although with 37s under the truck I'm probably already screwed if I get beaten up by lawyers.


Totally agree that you're probably less likely to have a braking related accident with hydroboost. Also fully aware that facts never matter to lawyers and they'll take any opportunity they can get to squeeze money out of drivers and their insurance companies.
Life is inherently risky. This is my official disclaimer.
 
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Interesting. Some folks in my BMW groups are converting from hydroboost to vacuum assist. I've always liked the hydroboost in my old BMW's, but find the vacuum assisted brakes in my other cars, including my 80 to be just fine.
 

baldilocks

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Interesting. Some folks in my BMW groups are converting from hydroboost to vacuum assist. I've always liked the hydroboost in my old BMW's, but find the vacuum assisted brakes in my other cars, including my 80 to be just fine.
Please don’t sully my thread with unrelated sentences about European cars. Thank you
 

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