which truck to put 13BT into

[rutbeer]

Anyone know for sure if a 2lt pickup diesel alt will swap with a 13bt? It looks like a dead ringer, but I hate to gamble with parts that are special order.
Also, took the starter apart. Common sense would tell me that the plunger is NOT the 24v part, it has to be the field on the solenoid. The motor part is easy.....The only way I see to get the soleniod field out is to desolder a lead or two. Anyone know for sure?

 

[rutbeer]

2LT parts

I picked up some reman 2LT parts off of a 1986 toyota pickup diesel.
Close but not quite a perfect match. The starter lower body is quite a bit different, but the upper half is almost identical. The post on one side is moved around a bit and the drain hole is handled differently, but that's about it. The lower base must be swapped out.

 

[rutbeer]

2LT alternator

This is darn near perfect. The only two real differences are the adjuster ear and the pulley itself. It appears that I will need to order a slightly longer belt so that the alternator can swing wider than the original configuration. Not a problem. The pully looks like it can easily be swapped over, although the larger pulley will make it turn slower....and less amps produced at idle. Oh well.

 

[rutbeer]

alt installed

It's not really installed here, but you can see where the adjuster ear bottoms out against the power steering pump. As I said, a longer belt will be needed.

One thing I'm pretty positive about though, you could swap the internals of the 2LT into the 13BT 24V alt. I bet you could order the rotor and the regulator, but the starter/alt rebuild guy was unable to find the Denso part numbers to do so.

 

[Tapage]

did you have the amps rate .. ?

 

[rutbeer]

60 amps, but I'm not running an electric winch, so I don't really care about the amps.

 

[MoCoNative]

Quick Question, been considering 70 series axles and lockers under my 40. Apears swap is fairly easy. What is the width gain, and is it worth it. I would like some added subtle width gain on my 40, and then I want to do a small lift 2 inch max, probably new springs to do it. but I want to keep it fairly stock and roadworthy. Much like you have done. Is it worth it?

I'm dealing with a bone stock 73 FJ-40, would probably consider a tranny change also with this, maybe 5 speed and new split case. Then flanges would be the same, and e brake would be solved with newer axles.

 

[rutbeer]

Width gain is minimal, something like an inch or so. Dont' do the swap for the stability, do it for the strength gain and kick butt lockers. Cable lockers RULE. You will have to move the perches, especially the rear. The front can be used as is, but it will bend your springs out a bit. If I was to do it over again, I would move the perches on the front a quarter inch each, but it's really not a big deal. Rear is required though....
Drivability is fine...can't tell the difference. I drilled the flanges on the 70 series pigs, but if you are going split case, like I will, you won't have to do that. I only did so that I could continue to run until I'm done with all the swapping.

 

[MoCoNative]

Thanks for th einfo rutbeer, Lockers are kind of what I was looking at too. Would be way cool to have them, simple yet effective.

Where did you get your drivtrain parts, G&S???

Oh, great looking rig, I like it when guys spend the time to do it right, and keep it pure Toyota, amazing how much you can swap around.

 

[Jan-78FJ40]

It's not really installed here, but you can see where the adjuster ear bottoms out against the power steering pump. As I said, a longer belt will be needed.

One thing I'm pretty positive about though, you could swap the internals of the 2LT into the 13BT 24V alt. I bet you could order the rotor and the regulator, but the starter/alt rebuild guy was unable to find the Denso part numbers to do so.

that is great information!

J

 

[rutbeer]

Starter swap

The starter swap was easy. Just disassemble the nosecone and swap over to the 13bt aluminum housing. Perfect match!

 

[rutbeer]

alt swap

The alt was NOT so straightforward. I thought the 13bt would be the later fine spline vacuum pump, but it's not. You can see here that my orange block doesn't match. The good news, is the blue block 13bt does. Perfect match. I just have to use the later model one. Interesting.

 

[rutbeer]

Starter did not work as planned, and I don't really understand it. The 12v starter, although new, would barely turn the B over, definitely not fast enough to start. The 24v fires it right up....I warmed the motor up, then swapped the 12v back in. No go, even from warm. Since the 12v starter motor came from a 4cyl diesel, and I'm putting it in a 4cyl diesel, I have to think my compression is either MUCH higher than the 12v B's and 2LT's, or I have bummed remanufactured starter. I always thought direct injected turbo compression specs were lower than indirect NA though?
I haven't made up my mind yet, but I may be taking the starter back and getting another or just go with a marine series/parallel switch and be done with it.

 

[Radd Cruisers]

Should work, I have installed several even on a higher compression 1HZ, starts great.

Did you switch out the 12volt magnetic switch?

 

[rutbeer]

No, I actually used the entire remanufactured 12V diesel starter....except the aluminum nose housing. If you look in the picture above, you can see where I pulled the two aluminum lower housings and just swapped that so the angle would be right.
Yeah, I don't get it. The motor was struggling so hard to turn the engine over. It would even turn then pause, then keep turning....like there was a dead spot in the electric motor.
The solenoid is fine, but it seems like the starter was only getting half power or something, but it still got warm from use.
BTW, the 12v starter motor has a small bolt spot welded onto the gold plated section. Any idea what that's for? It's not heavy enough for a ground lead...

 

[Greg_B]

A 12V manufactured starter we supply to customers turns over the 13BT in my BJ60 quite well.

You do have a solinoid activating a straight feed right from the battery to the starter...correct?

gb

 

[rutbeer]

Long jumper cable (new) to the battery lead on the block, then the other jumper to the battery lead coming off the starter solenoid at the correct location. I suppose.....that the cables are not good enough condition for 12v, but fine for 24v. There is no way to connect the jumper directly to the starter solenoid because it's way too tight there.
Just the same though, since everyone has said I should be fine, I might just take the starter back and get another. It has a lifetime warranty, and it's possible it's "dead", even though unlikely.

 

[Radd Cruisers]

Ground.


BTW, the 12v starter motor has a small bolt spot welded onto the gold plated section. Any idea what that's for? It's not heavy enough for a ground lead...[/QUOTE]

 

[70sguy]

Did you say you were using a set of jumper cables? Try using a proper set of cables with proper battery terminal clamps.

Sheldon

 

[rutbeer]

Yeah, that sounds like a good idea. I'll try that when the bellhousing(s) are back on. Thanks

I pulled the trannies off both motors and inspected the clutch condition, flywheel, pilot bearing, and "slop" in the trannies.
This is now the big question that I'm really having a hard time with....which MOTOR to use. Here are the details.

Red block 13BT:
160,000km verified and runs good.
Motor is clean, as in the aluminum cleans up, the cad plating is intact, minimal seepage around block.
Tranny feels good, transfer output flange feels good...lots of seepage at the t/case.
Turbo feels great
Intake heater screens show some "caking" but pretty clean overall.

Blue block 13BT:
55,000km suspect higher, but paperwork showed 55,000
This motor has nearly no seepage around the block, tranny, or transfer.
Plastic fan looks almost "new".
Heavy corrosion from salt....aluminum needs heavy cleaning, and cad plating is nearly gone.
Tranny feels good, t/case has a little slop in the output flange. Not bad, but definitely more than the red block tcase
Turbo feels great
Intake heater screens some "caking", but less than other motor.
Clutch looks great, but throw out bearing has more wear than Red block.

Okay, so I have NOT done a compression test....I don't have the special tool for this motor. I suspect that they will test nearly identical based on running and overall low km and good shape. Outside of that, it's very hard to tell which one is actually a better motor to install. I know the blue one is "newer" but cosmetically, it does not look it, and I can't really tell that there are much of any differences between the two motors. I can see a few little things, but overall, they don't jump out as being clearly different.

Is there an advantage to using one over the other in the USA for parts availability?