- Thread starter
- #21
Thank you! I agree, but, not knowing what a fuseable link is at the parts counter?! Scares me, if they hired that thing for parts, I don't even want to see who or what turns the wrenches!
What size fuses should I replace my fuseable links with
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Thank you! I agree, but, not knowing what a fuseable link is at the parts counter?! Scares me, if they hired that thing for parts, I don't even want to see who or what turns the wrenches!
- Thread starter
- #22
There are different types of fuses - there's actually some science involved versus just a 'nail'
A fusible link is designed to take a high current 'spike' or short term draw without blowing, since it won't overheat enough to open which means that the wire harness etc would not have got hot enough to melt/fail. So, if that short term high current demand was a fault, then the fuse protecting that device would blow to prevent a melt down in the failed device without compromising the wiring and fusible link.
The fusible link + fuse is a hierarchy of protection.
Fusible links can be replaced with specialised fuses, designed to open 'slowly' versus a fast-blow fuse. But that requires having a good knowledge of the circuit/circuits being protected by that fusible link.
The fusible link (in theory) should only open when a catastrophic failure (short) occurs in the wiring harness. Any 'device' failure would be handled by the associated fuse.
(There is no fusible link on the starter motor).
cheers,
george.
Ok, now we're getting somewhere near my original question. (I should of been more clear.... my fault) Anyways.... fuses---- regular "quick poppers" like in a million vehicles, then there are "slow poppers" or delay trip, or whatever you may call them. Basically they are the same as a FL, in the sense that they won't pop as soon as they see a spike, they are built to allow items to cycle on/off without popping.
Then----- there are 3 FL's if I'm not mistaken 1 goes to the starter, then the other 2 go into your fuse boxes. Actually, the starter FL is the smallest of the 3. What I'm trying to figure out is...... what is the amp breakdown of each link? Somewhere I heard 80 amps, not sure if that's gospel or hot air? Is it broken down 20 amps to starter, 30 amps to each box? Other than "tallying up" all the amps on each circuit, is there anything written on this?
My goal here is to eliminate another of the "weak links" altogether. Yea, only $13, but they might as well be a million if I'm somewhere, they die, and I already used up my spare set! That's why I'd ~like~ to replace them with either slow popping fuses, or circuit breakers, or any other suggested idea! Initial cost doesn't bother me too much, now that I'm retired I've been working a lot more in the Spec Ops Raider Training program (go figure.... no rest for the wicked!) and when we "got to go", w can't be dicking around.... people die that way.
Again..... if I'm chasing ghosts then I apologize. But, I could of swore I heard a friend of a friends grandmothers 2nd cousin say something, on this site, about doing this same thing. Thank you gentleman (and ladies)!
The "Power Source (current flow chart)" section of the electrical wiring diagram will have answers.
Beyond that, as mentioned already the size of each fusible link is shown in the EWD. With that you can easily check the amp load Toyota designed each one for.
There is no fusible link to the main starter lead. The start solenoid signal wire does use FL AM1.
- Thread starter
- #24
I figured someone would correct me on the starter lead..... I couldn't remember what FL it's tied into.
I think you are missing the point of people saying leave them in place. They are a second line of defense and if you keep popping them you have bigger problems that need to be sorted out first.
- Thread starter
- #26
No, I've seen how quickly wires burn! I'm not missing anything (wife says a couple screws in my head). I fully understand what they do, and I won't operate w/o some kind of protection. Now.... what I'm trying to do.... is Improve on Mr T's system. I realize how many engineers sat around eating fried rice, and drinking Habu Sakai, but that was 25+ years ago, there has to be a better answer. I read 5-10 posts a WEEK on here where the OP's need to replace FL's.
Thanks for the concern, but yea, I fully understand how bad it sucks to have to "bail out" of a burning car! Other than a very distinct smell, it's pretty cool to watch wires "burn back" in a vehicle! Of course, the owner didn't think the same thing! Escpecially with 4 drunk buddies laughing their butts off!
Your head is where mine is having already been in your hypothetical worst case (most remote place in the lower 48, off season and stranded having burnt up my spare fl). We trail repaired it by splicing together a fused link with the remaining fl and a fuse from my trailer brake and it worked (for weeks after even). It was then the question you have popped into my head
In those threads people are typically replacing 20+ yr old FLs. Is your goal to have your solution last longer than that? If not I don't understand the point of going through the work and expense. If it is simply to have a more readily available replacement option, but be designed to the same slow-burn design, can't you just run out of slow-burn fuses? Would you continue on your trip without fixing something if you just kept popping fuse after fuse?
In my case i used up my spare on the assumption that they were just 20 years old. I put the spare in and ran for another 5 miles before it happened again. I figured out the root cause this time but was out a spare. Would have been nice too have easier to replace alternatives to use up vs a part that no one carries more than one spare of
Just buy them from @NLXTACY and call it good. I bought 2 from him, one for replacement and one for someone else that will inevitably need one.
I'd much rather support a MUD member than the stealership.
I'd much rather support a MUD member than the stealership.
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I'm not sure I get the jist of this. Factory FL replacements are available at this time, and a boonie get-out-to-civilization (... and I'm using this term rather loosely when it comes to the US these days...) fix for when no spare is available isn't that much out of this world.
And it's the same with regular fuses: just replacing a fuse with a new one in case of a failure might not go very far without determining the cause of the failure - FLs aren't much different in that regard.
If anyone feels the need to re-engineer ths FLs - fine, go ahead, perhaps you would care to provide the proper numbers that serve as the basis for the newfangled gizmo. Hell, this has worked for bumpers without worrying But any numbers etc. - so, let's go ahead...
Other than that, keep in mind that the best backup solution for unexpected breakdowns is simply a having a second truck.
And it's the same with regular fuses: just replacing a fuse with a new one in case of a failure might not go very far without determining the cause of the failure - FLs aren't much different in that regard.
If anyone feels the need to re-engineer ths FLs - fine, go ahead, perhaps you would care to provide the proper numbers that serve as the basis for the newfangled gizmo. Hell, this has worked for bumpers without worrying But any numbers etc. - so, let's go ahead...
Other than that, keep in mind that the best backup solution for unexpected breakdowns is simply a having a second truck.
You don't have to buy it, but until you've had to kick something together with what you've got to get to the nearest person 50 miles away I don't know if you can knock the idea. The Hodge podge solution knocked 2 days off my trip and lost me some great terrain (because the kicked together fix was unreliable). If it was just a fuse I wouldn't have had to change my plans on account of confidence in the trail repair. It's just taking pm to a different direction. My fix got me home but had I done the proposed mod I could have also saved the trip
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The fact that you ran it for a month afterwards sort of dq's you from complaining, does it not?
Why?
I think I love you
I'll remember that when I drive my rig to you for an OBA system.
Are you on your way yet?
It's funny you say that. I had a random guy who found me on Google. Drove his motorcycle for two hours in LA traffic to my place and bought everything I had for OBA. He's on his way to Alaska and needed the full set up. If he brought the truck we likely would have been wrenching
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IF you have to rig something when out bush, then the following will give some idea of the current capacity of the fusible links.
Fusing Currents versus American Wire Gauge for copper, aluminum, iron, and tin (Cu, Al, Fe, Sn), wire melting currents
The EWD has some of the info you need to choose the wire diameter that would provide similar 'protection'. e.g. the 2.0L fusible link tells you that the wire is nominal 2 square millimeters, which is close to 1.6mm diameter. You can see from the URL that 1.6mm diameter of copper wire (un-insulated) will melt/fuse at around 160A in free air.
Note that the factory fusible links have silicone insulation to help 'contain' the melted wire and prevent damage to surrounding equipment etc.
Fuses that have a similar 'slow-blow' capability of a fusible link are the MIDI fuses. You can read up about them -> 32V MIDI Bolt-Down Fuses - Bolt-Down Fuses - Littelfuse
I've used the MIDI fuses on my oz patrol to replace the original fusible links since they are long obsolete AND I've reconfigured my patrol from 24V to 12V operation. The later required re-calculating loads in the fusible link paths (e.g. double the current from 12V alternator versus the original 24V), upgrading wiring as needed AND sizing the MIDI fuse appropriately.
On the 80, it's way easier to purchase what is still readily available. If *I* was to use a MIDI fuse in place of a fusible link I'd pick a fuse that is around 1/2 the melt/fusing rating. e.g. for the 2.0L link that has a approximate 160A melt point, I'd use an 80A MIDI fuse (maybe 100A at the most). This isn't what I recommend, just a thought experiment.
cheers,
george.
Fusing Currents versus American Wire Gauge for copper, aluminum, iron, and tin (Cu, Al, Fe, Sn), wire melting currents
The EWD has some of the info you need to choose the wire diameter that would provide similar 'protection'. e.g. the 2.0L fusible link tells you that the wire is nominal 2 square millimeters, which is close to 1.6mm diameter. You can see from the URL that 1.6mm diameter of copper wire (un-insulated) will melt/fuse at around 160A in free air.
Note that the factory fusible links have silicone insulation to help 'contain' the melted wire and prevent damage to surrounding equipment etc.
Fuses that have a similar 'slow-blow' capability of a fusible link are the MIDI fuses. You can read up about them -> 32V MIDI Bolt-Down Fuses - Bolt-Down Fuses - Littelfuse
I've used the MIDI fuses on my oz patrol to replace the original fusible links since they are long obsolete AND I've reconfigured my patrol from 24V to 12V operation. The later required re-calculating loads in the fusible link paths (e.g. double the current from 12V alternator versus the original 24V), upgrading wiring as needed AND sizing the MIDI fuse appropriately.
On the 80, it's way easier to purchase what is still readily available. If *I* was to use a MIDI fuse in place of a fusible link I'd pick a fuse that is around 1/2 the melt/fusing rating. e.g. for the 2.0L link that has a approximate 160A melt point, I'd use an 80A MIDI fuse (maybe 100A at the most). This isn't what I recommend, just a thought experiment.
cheers,
george.
- Thread starter
- #40
Knock your shorts off!...