TREs (inner and outer), steering rack and ball joints

[alexchoksm]

Has anyone replaced their TREs (inner and outer), steering rack (the whole rack or just the bush) or ball joints?

Would be interested to know but couldn't find any write-ups after doing a search. My tyres have some 3 to 9 o'clock play ..just a small movement..and my steering has a rattle (clunk like feeling) when I go over gravel or washboard roads. Trying to narrow it down and wonder if it's any of the items above. I tried to check my TRE but couldn't disconnect it from the arm, even after whacking it multiple times with BFH.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

When you say you have in and out play, have you jacked up from the lower control arm, put a hand around the inner and outer tie rods, and had someone else try and move the tire in and out? That would just be to make sure you isolated it's the ball joints with play, and not something else.

For the outer tie rod, I very much recommend using a 3 claw puller and penetrating lube vs banging on it. That way you can build much more sustained pressure than with a single blow. Inner tie rods are very easy as you would rent a inner tie rod tool, it's basically just a screw in male side on the tie rod to female end in the rack itself.

I recommend buying a Haynes manual for the tundra/sequioa for $25. The front ends are basically the same and it gives you very easy step by step with pictures of how to do it.

For cost, I personally have not had good longevity results with tie rods outside of Toyota OEM, the inners are $400 for both, but a complete new rack is $600 that comes with the inner tie rods also. Outters are only purchased seperatly.

How many miles are on the truck and how hard do you off-road it?

 

[alexchoksm]

Hi, thanks for your reply. The truck has almost 100k m on it, but less than 3k of that is from me (haven't taken it off-road yet...). It doesn't look like it has seen much off-road from the PO though. The rattle/ clunk on the steering isn't that bad..only a mild shimmy but I'm trying to fix whatever I can.

Tried what you suggested, but there's no play 12 to 6, only 9 to 3.. I can't see any obvious movements on the TREs though.. I would use a puller but I'm afraid of messing up the rubber cover. I might just buy one and try if I can't think of any other way.

How many times have you changed your TREs and racks and would you mind sharing why you did them? Ball joints too? Going through the 200 forum it doesn't seem like many people have done them....I was thinking maybe it's just me and these things don't fail ..which was why I posted this thread. There's plenty info on the 100 forum though... I had similar problems with my previous LX470 which was solved when I replaced the rack but the whole process was $$$, and it left me with a broken spiral cable which I had to replace..more $$$$.

Hoping I could just replace the TREs or the bush on this one... but if OEM is the way to go and it's $400..might as well get the whole rack.
Here we have the 555 which costs less...but not sure how long they will last.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

Since you said you felt no play, I doubt the ball joints are bad. You'll know if they are bad by that test. Also, the 200/tundra has very robust tie rod ball joints. I think that is why it will be hard to find an article on it.

Oh, and since outer OEM tie rods are about $40 per, using a puller is my easy way, but just write off that you will most likely damage the boot.

For your other question, I have replaced quite a few steering racks and tie rods, not so much because of my truck but because I'm a certified mechanic and used to be a Toyota mechanic also. The old 100 series stuff isn't like the new 200/tundra stuff to keep it very simple. I bought my 200 with about the same miles as you, had an bit of a wander and shake, it was a bad tire with radial runout, good for me as the street tires were already planned to go away.

You could always go get a second opinion, I obviously can't get my hands on the truck, but I don't think you have a steering linkage issue. I'll call some of my friends who are still in the business if they have seen common issues on tundras. They don't work in areas that see many 200s

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Yup, dozens of times on the Canguro 200. The rack makes it ~2 races, TRE's get replaced every race. Procedure is straightforward, MUCH easier than the 100 Series.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

Yup, dozens of times on the Canguro 200. The rack makes it ~2 races, TRE's get replaced every race. Procedure is straightforward, MUCH easier than the 100 Series.

Haha, gotta love race conditions. Awesome stuff though, I love reading about Canguro racing.

 

[Forrest Murphy]

Do you have to pull the engine to replace the rack?

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

No, you can fanangle it out of there with the motor in place.

 

[arich]

I'm approaching 90k.
The steering shaft and it's universal joints have a little play in them. Not that noticeable. They are not serviceable , only replaceable.
With a needle on my grease gun I squeeze a little grease into the joints.

Forrest and I hate clunks!!!

 

[NLScooby]

Forrest and I hate clunks!!!

Count me in there as well. I can't stand 'em! Like nails on a chalkboard to me....

 

[alexchoksm]

Since you said you felt no play, I doubt the ball joints are bad. You'll know if they are bad by that test. Also, the 200/tundra has very robust tie rod ball joints. I think that is why it will be hard to find an article on it.

Oh, and since outer OEM tie rods are about $40 per, using a puller is my easy way, but just write off that you will most likely damage the boot.

For your other question, I have replaced quite a few steering racks and tie rods, not so much because of my truck but because I'm a certified mechanic and used to be a Toyota mechanic also. The old 100 series stuff isn't like the new 200/tundra stuff to keep it very simple. I bought my 200 with about the same miles as you, had an bit of a wander and shake, it was a bad tire with radial runout, good for me as the street tires were already planned to go away.

You could always go get a second opinion, I obviously can't get my hands on the truck, but I don't think you have a steering linkage issue. I'll call some of my friends who are still in the business if they have seen common issues on tundras. They don't work in areas that see many 200s

Thanks for your advice...so I went and confirmed that the TREs were bad, one of the boots were ripped and they were moving without any resistance when free from the steering arm. No play on the rack-ends (inner TREs) but also absolutely no tension whatsoever...if I let go, it would just droop down.

So I bought a set each of both the inner and outer TREs..pics below. I have no idea if they are genuine parts, there's Toyota stickers on them but they didn't look exactly the same as the ones I replaced. Another thing was the prices...USD63 for a pair of TREs (not far off from the $40 you mentioned) but the inners were only $98 for a pair. Anyway I thought, what the heck...it's difficult to get parts from where I live in Malaysia ...especially genuine ones, you never know if what you're getting is the real deal.

Finally got around to replacing them today at the alignment shop.. the mechanic was at first reluctant to change anything, said everything was good. When I insisted and he got the outers off, he said they were shot. Then he said the inners were good despite it flopping all over the place..and I had to insist again that he change them. I'd bought the parts anyway.

Anyway, after everything was done and aligned...woah the difference was . No more play going over gravel or washboard roads..everything just felt firmer and the car tracks great! Glad I came upon this forum. Thanks again.

P.S. Now I can't help thinking whether my ball joints are shot too....

 

[arich]

Yup, dozens of times on the Canguro 200. The rack makes it ~2 races, TRE's get replaced every race. Procedure is straightforward, MUCH easier than the 100 Series.

Kurt
Any idea of the lifespan of a rack on a typical 200?? Or the Tie rods.
We're obviously not doing.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Kurt
Any idea of the lifespan of a rack on a typical 200?? Or the Tie rods.
We're obviously not doing.

Great question. With the 100 Series we are seeing them get sloppy anywhere from 150k (pretty normal use, mixed off-road) to 250k and still tight on clean stockers with stock tires. I'd expect the same out of the 200. I'll grab some pics of the side by sides of the 100 vs. 200 parts, as with most things with the 200 things got a little beefier.

 

[ranma21]

Thanks for your advice...so I went and confirmed that the TREs were bad, one of the boots were ripped and they were moving without any resistance when free from the steering arm. No play on the rack-ends (inner TREs) but also absolutely no tension whatsoever...if I let go, it would just droop down.

So I bought a set each of both the inner and outer TREs..pics below. I have no idea if they are genuine parts, there's Toyota stickers on them but they didn't look exactly the same as the ones I replaced. Another thing was the prices...USD63 for a pair of TRE (not far off from the $40 you mentioned) but the inners were only $98 for a pair. Anyway I thought, what the heck...it's difficult to get parts from where I live in Malaysia ...especially genuine ones, you never know if what you're getting is the real deal.

Finally got around to replacing them today at the alignment shop.. the mechanic was at first reluctant to change anything, said everything was good. When I insisted and he got the outers off, he said they were shot. Then he said the inners were good despite it flopping all over the place..and I had to insist again that he change them. I'd bought the parts anyway.

Anyway, after everything was done and aligned...woah the difference was . No more play going over gravel or washboard roads..everything just felt firmer and the car tracks great! Glad I came upon this forum. Thanks again.

P.S. Now I can't help thinking whether my ball joints are shot too....

View attachment 1407291

View attachment 1407292

Hey Man, good to see another Malaysian on the board. I am from KL, Wing Hin carry Genuine Toyota/Lexus parts and is the Toyota distributor in Malaysia. Look them up if you want to get genuine Toyota parts for sure. The inner tie rod ends is USD$290 each retail in the US. So if you are paying USD98 for a set, either someone is giving it away or indeed they are counterfeit ends. If it is genuine Toyota parts, it should looks the same.

Glad you sort it out.

 

[alexchoksm]

Hey Man, good to see another Malaysian on the board. I am from KL, Wing Hin carry Genuine Toyota/Lexus parts and is the Toyota distributor in Malaysia. Look them up if you want to get genuine Toyota parts for sure. The inner tie rod ends is USD$290 each retail in the US. So if you are paying USD98 for a set, either someone is giving it away or indeed they are counterfeit ends. If it is genuine Toyota parts, it should looks the same.

Glad you sort it out.

Hey great to know there are Malaysians around here! So are you still based here or?

Yes I did buy a steering rack from from Wing Hin years ago for my LX470...but I'm from Sabah so it's a bit of a hassle. Anyway if the inner TREs go bad in 6 mths time I'm going to make sure I order from them.

 

[encrypttie]

No, you can fanangle it out of there with the motor in place.

Hey @Taco2Cruiser, my dealership told me I need to replace the steering rack since it's seeping. I also need to replace the inner tie rod ends.The whole thing is gonna cost ~$3500 if I let them do the job, so I thought I'll replace the rack myself. I can't find any information on how to replace the rack without taking the engine out except for this post:Removing steering rack which does not give any specific details.

Looks like you've got a lot of experience in this. I have two questions:
(1) do I really need to replace the rack? even though it's just seeping as opposed to leaking
(2) Is there a trick to get the steering rack out without unmounting the engine? Or does it easily come off after removing the, oil filter bracket and the sway bar? Also the post mentions removing the tie rod ends, do you know if I should remove the inner ones to get the rack out?

Thanks for your help in advance.

 

[Taco2Cruiser]

Hey @Taco2Cruiser, my dealership told me I need to replace the steering rack since it's seeping. I also need to replace the inner tie rod ends.The whole thing is gonna cost ~$3500 if I let them do the job, so I thought I'll replace the rack myself. I can't find any information on how to replace the rack without taking the engine out except for this post:Removing steering rack which does not give any specific details.

Looks like you've got a lot of experience in this. I have two questions:
(1) do I really need to replace the rack? even though it's just seeping as opposed to leaking
(2) Is there a trick to get the steering rack out without unmounting the engine? Or does it easily come off after removing the, oil filter bracket and the sway bar? Also the post mentions removing the tie rod ends, do you know if I should remove the inner ones to get the rack out?

Thanks for your help in advance.

Ugh... $3500, that’s a hard one to swallow.

So, a seep is not the worse thing in the world, so you could push it a bit. Now me personally, I just can’t handle even the tiniest bit of oil not where it should be. But I won’t exaggerate and say that the truck will explode if you put it off. The most important thing to do with a known leak is check the fluid level. Even keeping fluid in a motor that burns a quart of oil every 500 miles will still make it last pretty long, all things considered.

Yes, you can totally get the rack out without taking the motor out.

I was able to get a few out, but I had to remove the inner tie rods from the rack. Now on those rack replacements I already had the front diffs out.

Past that, having a robust array of tools to get to the hard lines is must. Or you can make tools as needed with a cut off wheel and a welder like usually do.

when putting the new rack in, they come with the inner rods on them (at least the ones that I got) and with having the motor in there, I had to take the inners off, install the rack, then put the inners back in the rack.

 

[encrypttie]

Ugh... $3500, that’s a hard one to swallow.

So, a seep is not the worse thing in the world, so you could push it a bit. Now me personally, I just can’t handle even the tiniest bit of oil not where it should be. But I won’t exaggerate and say that the truck will explode if you put it off. The most important thing to do with a known leak is check the fluid level. Even keeping fluid in a motor that burns a quart of oil every 500 miles will still make it last pretty long, all things considered.

Yes, you can totally get the rack out without taking the motor out.

I was able to get a few out, but I had to remove the inner tie rods from the rack. Now on those rack replacements I already had the front diffs out.

Past that, having a robust array of tools to get to the hard lines is must. Or you can make tools as needed with a cut off wheel and a welder like usually do.

when putting the new rack in, they come with the inner rods on them (at least the ones that I got) and with having the motor in there, I had to take the inners off, install the rack, then put the inners back in the rack.

Thanks for the prompt response. TBH I can't stand seeps, leaks, etc. either. But the thought of paying $3,500 or taking the engine out is scarier to me especially since I live in an apartment and don't have my own garage... I've kept an eye on the power steering fluid level, it's not moved in the last ~3000 miles. Still, I'd rather change the whole rack especially given the price compared to just buying the inner tie rod ends.

I'll give it a shot and hopefully can get it out... Thanks again...

 

[encrypttie]

Past that, having a robust array of tools to get to the hard lines is must. Or you can make tools as needed with a cut off wheel and a welder like usually do.

One more question, what do you mean by getting to the hard lines? do I need to remove them?

 

[Tommy Kha]

I'm having the same seeping driver side rack boot problem and slight ticking noises when I turn and go over a curb with my 2008 LX570 at 135K miles. Interesting thing is, the fluid in the reservoir has not dipped and my cv boots are fine.

I'm thinking why not give blue devil power steering leak a try since I eventually need to replace the rack anyways.

Also, I haven't located the ticking/clicking noise whenever I slightly turn the steering wheel. It's not consistent either, I hear it more often when the car sits for a few hours. Anyone got any ideas on this?