"The Big Three" Electrical Upgrade (1 Viewer)

[Pucker5]

On a stock rig the power wires shouldn’t melt. Could be a short or lose connection, etc. ensure factory wire location points are tightened securely and not compromised. The benefit of the big3/big4 is that you are ensuring max current delivery of alternator potential whatever size it needs as well as new clean chassis grounds and body grounds

Basic math is to take the amp real rms power Divide by 14.4 and multiple by efficiency rating of the amp. 1000/14.4x.75 = 52 amps. So that will be peak consumption from that specific amp. Multiple amps...repeat process and add amperage draw totals. That will represent high side of current needed. For daily listening you won’t likely consume 52 amps probably closer to half.

Tip: Brazilian full bridge amps are far more efficient, smaller physical footprint and put out more power on less amperage. They are also Fairly inexpensive per watt.

 

[gregnash]

Tip: Brazilian full bridge amps are far more efficient, smaller physical footprint and put out more power on less amperage. They are also Fairly inexpensive per watt.

Explain this dark magic you speak of?!

 

[lesgarten]

I've been running a 1000W RMS (500W sub and 500W front stage) audio system in my 99 for years. I have a group 31 AGM and factory 100A alternator. I have a 2AWG power wire.

I've never had a noticeable charging problem I could relate to the audio equipment. I've killed an alternator since installing the system, but I attributed that more to offroad water crossings (my wife drove a few last year with water over the hood). I've not noticed dimming headlights either, but I rarely drive at night these days.

A few things to consider:

1. Class D amps (almost all audio amps today) only pull power to feed the current audio signal. That means max RMS current will only be drawn at high volumes on a loud song. If it's a 1000W system, most its time, even at max volume, might only be consuming 250W because most songs are not at max volume the entire time.

2. The battery should handle momentary power draws with ease. The alternator doesn't need to output more than the amps require - it just needs to keep up with replenishing the battery during lower consumption moments.

3. I have always charged my group 31 with a CTEK wall charger every so often (every 3-6 months maybe). I don't rely on the alternator to maintain the battery by itself. That battery has been abused for nearly 6 years and it's still going strong.

I've never done the big three upgrade due to electrical problems, but I have replaced cables to address bad terminations. To test for the need for upgrading the wire, I would test voltage drop during load. You want very little drop (say less than 100mV, perhaps?), but poor wire could drop 1V or more. If you don't have voltage drop across the wire, there's no reason to do the big three upgrade, IMO. Sometimes testing it properly is as much work as just upgrading blindly.

Getting ready to do a system that has 3 amps. 600w, 1000w, and 1400w.

The amps are MMATS 6150 x2 and a MMATS 1400.2

I have a 31m Diehard battery and stock alternator.

I plan to upgrade the battery to fender, head to firewall, and alternator to battery wires.

Run a 2/0 wire to the amps

Do I need an alternator upgrade as well? I was thinking I did.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Getting ready to do a system that has 3 amps. 600w, 1000w, and 1400w.

The amps are MMATS 6150 x2 and a MMATS 1400.2

I have a 31m Diehard battery and stock alternator.

I plan to upgrade the battery to fender, head to firewall, and alternator to battery wires.

Run a 2/0 wire to the amps

Do I need an alternator upgrade as well? I was thinking I did.

Are you actually running those amps at those levels, though? I think those ratings are valid for 1 ohm on the subs. If you're really running those amps at min resistance (max power), and near max volume then yeah, you're probably going to need an upgraded alt. At min resistance, that's a combined 3000W RMS (215 amps), but with 4 ohm components and 4 ohm sub, and that's more like 1850W RMS (130 amps) and the factory alt might be fine. Just depends what that system is actually going to pull while you drive.

3000W RMS is pretty ambitious for a non-show vehicle, IMO. I'm intrigued to see what speakers you're pairing with those amps.

 

[Pucker5]

Getting ready to do a system that has 3 amps. 600w, 1000w, and 1400w.

The amps are MMATS 6150 x2 and a MMATS 1400.2

I have a 31m Diehard battery and stock alternator.

I plan to upgrade the battery to fender, head to firewall, and alternator to battery wires.

Run a 2/0 wire to the amps

Do I need an alternator upgrade as well? I was thinking I did.

So jealous, those 6150’s are doooooope! However The 6150’s are 900 rms a piece at 4 ohms Each and 1650 each at 2 ohms, all at nearly 83% efficiency and probably underrated. Two ohm drivers are a pain to find so assuming you’ll be using them at four ohm and the sub amp at two ohms your actually at 3600 watts. Curious what
On your soundstage plan is...catching a whiff of overkill. Curiosity and mild envy aside, I would for sure thrown in an aftermarket alt.

 

[gungriffin]

Getting ready to do a system that has 3 amps. 600w, 1000w, and 1400w.

The amps are MMATS 6150 x2 and a MMATS 1400.2

I have a 31m Diehard battery and stock alternator.

I plan to upgrade the battery to fender, head to firewall, and alternator to battery wires.

Run a 2/0 wire to the amps

Do I need an alternator upgrade as well? I was thinking I did.

Wouldn't the more important thing be to have a deep cycle battery? In group 31 since that is the biggest that the 100 can fit?

 

[lesgarten]

Are you actually running those amps at those levels, though? I think those ratings are valid for 1 ohm on the subs. If you're really running those amps at min resistance (max power), and near max volume then yeah, you're probably going to need an upgraded alt. At min resistance, that's a combined 3000W RMS (215 amps), but with 4 ohm components and 4 ohm sub, and that's more like 1850W RMS (130 amps) and the factory alt might be fine. Just depends what that system is actually going to pull while you drive.

3000W RMS is pretty ambitious for a non-show vehicle, IMO. I'm intrigued to see what speakers you're pairing with those amps.

Hi, no where near max. I want to Dynamat Xtreme everything to lessen volume even more. I also don't listen to super Bass Heavy "Noise".

Head Unit Pioneer DMH-WT7600NEX
Helix Ultra DSP
JL Audio 12W7 Prowedge CLS112RG-W7AE
Focal Utopia M TBM, 3.5WM, and 6WM front Stage
Focal Utopia M 165W-XP Rear Seat area

 

[suprarx7nut]

Hi, no where near max. I want to Dynamat Xtreme everything to lessen volume even more. I also don't listen to super Bass Heavy "Noise".

Head Unit Pioneer DMH-WT7600NEX
Helix Ultra DSP
JL Audio 12W7 Prowedge CLS112RG-W7AE
Focal Utopia M TBM, 3.5WM, and 6WM front Stage
Focal Utopia M 165W-XP Rear Seat area

Wowsa. At that investment level, yes, I think you should upgrade the alternator. No reason to skimp on those details if everything else is going to be top notch. I'd love to hear that when it's all set up, that's got to be quite the setup when it's done!

 

[OwnerCS]

I just received the BIG THREE kit. Beautiful workmanship!

 

[lesgarten]

Wowsa. At that investment level, yes, I think you should upgrade the alternator. No reason to skimp on those details if everything else is going to be top notch. I'd love to hear that when it's all set up, that's got to be quite the setup when it's done!

Crazy I know, but when I decided to keep the car forever, I decided to upgrade the Audio... and then it kinda snowballed on me.

 

[SmoothLC]

Hi, no where near max. I want to Dynamat Xtreme everything to lessen volume even more. I also don't listen to super Bass Heavy "Noise".

Head Unit Pioneer DMH-WT7600NEX
Helix Ultra DSP
JL Audio 12W7 Prowedge CLS112RG-W7AE
Focal Utopia M TBM, 3.5WM, and 6WM front Stage
Focal Utopia M 165W-XP Rear Seat area

Nice setup. Even someone like me can appreciate that.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Crazy I know, but when I decided to keep the car forever, I decided to upgrade the Audio... and then it kinda snowballed on me.

I'm all about owning older cars, keeping them longer and spending some of that saved depreciation money on upgrades. If that's crazy I'm right there with ya!

 

[lesgarten]

I'm all about owning older cars, keeping them longer and spending some of that saved depreciation money on upgrades. If that's crazy I'm right there with ya!

I looked at the quality of the car and how much it would cost me to get that kinda quality today. I also looked at the fact that I haven't had a car note since 2006. I have a no rust LC, needs some maintenance though, decided to do the seats, convert to non nav, do the suspension over, and probably paint. Ohhh and the audio upgrade would be the icing on that cake. When i bought it, because of the cost, my wife said, I hope that's what you want because you're going to be stuck with it... funny how things work out

Had it 18 years and still enjoy it everytime I drive it. Having a Forum to support it like this is freaking awesome!

 

[lesgarten]

Nice setup. Even someone like me can appreciate that.

The nav conversion thread really opened things up for us.

 

[SmoothLC]

Still lovin my Focals.

 

[lesgarten]

Still lovin my Focals.

They sound good even in youtube videos.

 

[jerryb]

@AimCOtaco how was that hot wire install? pain in the ass or just a pain and a few hours?

 

[AimCOtaco]

@AimCOtaco how was that hot wire install? pain in the ass or just a pain and a few hours?

Not to bad, just took some time as I'd decided to try and rebuild it to use all the stock clips and routing. 4 ga. welding cable is larger that what was in the harness but will just fit (I used a bit more tape than the factory to keep the loom close to closed) though the factory harness. A lot of the time was spent was messing with clips and doo-dahs along the path, Toyota did a nice job securing this cable from damage but uses lots of different parts to do so. Just a few hours of platic clip joy.

 

[Big Blue 99]

Having competed in the car stereo competitions in the "olden days" (mid eighties to early nineties). I ran a number of the old "cheater amps" and don't remember a single one that ran nearly 5 times the rated output (into the rated 4ohm per channel load) with simply a 2.4v increase. Yes, they were under rated, and of course we ran the huge power cables, but I remember the huge gains in the power output (4 to 5 times the rated output) being from running them into a much lower impedance than the traditional 4ohm per channel load.

Late 90's stereo tuner here too... We dropped the ohm load to get 4 to 5x out of a "50 Watt" amp. Definitely had to make sure there was enough gauge to keep voltage up after that. This thread is enlightening. I started noticing some ghosts when I replaced my head unit i.e. transmission flutter and the give away was the AC voltage getting wonky. Amp bypass improved the Overdrive in/out and the A/C but now I am looking to improve grounds for better idle and one lingering blinker to engine ghost... LED blinker relay on the way and powered 4 pin for trailer (Running LED boat trailer lights killed the blinker/flasher relay).

 

[SlowBuild]

Has anyone done the block to firewall ground in an 06LX? Mine looks different from all the photos in the thread so far. Instead of diving down between the T’s to the block it goes into the big loo right there and I can’t see where it comes out. Also, there’s a bracket that’s like a steel tube on the back of the engine that I don’t see in the other photos. That big loom goes through this bracket and it completely blocks my view to anything below.

Joins loom underneath inside bend:

Looking down past T’s:

Big loom enters bracket just under all that glare: