Stock Land Cruiser PTO shaft information needed.

[love2fly]

Would it be possible to get the flange yoke approximate size (see picture).
I believe it is a 1000 or 1100 series flange yoke being used but it is limited to selections of end yokes in that series. IF it falls into a 1300 series there maybe better chance of options. Also the gap between the u joint ears (inside gap).
Thanks

 

[Living in the Past]

A = 2.830"
B = 2.915"
C = 1.650" These is a raised ring not indented like the picture.
D = .888"
G = 1.168"

The inside gap between ears on the spline side is 1.850"
The inside gap between ears on the flange side is 1.680"

These are as close as I could be measure with it together and dirty/greasy. Should get you in the ball park.

 

[love2fly]

LITP, yes this is another big help. The raised ring it referred to as the center pilot ring and can be female or male ring. The last three items you sent are the most important in the search in comparing yokes.
I did have a chance today to test out the used transmission input shaft as a possible spine drive for the winch end slip yoke that I have, with a bit of work poor man milling it went very well. So DO NOT TOSS THE OLD TRANS SHAFTS, they can be used for making PTO shafts ends.

I call the gentleman that said he could cut some spine shafts for me in a few months, and asked him if I had the trans input shafts can he mill them down and he said that not only can he do that, but very quickly. It would cut the cost down to 1/4 of the original coast to do it from scratch . Nice!
The main thing that needed to be done on the shaft was to angle the spline sides inward just a mill or so and take off the high center of the spline to more of a level look, a few more little things on the way of milling but done on a machine would be just as few minutes, this took an hour with a grinder and a dremel tool, works nice, its a keeper. Hardened steel so it will take a few good welds to put it in place on the round PTO shaft.
The slip shaft seen in the picture has the inside splines the same leanth as the shown spline on the trans shaft, so they match fine with 1/8" sticking out on the inside end. (Can't see that).
can get about 1/4" slip play.

Thanks

 

[love2fly]

The gods are watching this post - our good friends over at CruiserParts LLC sent me an email letting me know that they have an odd part sitting in the parts bin, yes it is a flange yoke assembly. How cool is that.
I just have to say if I had not hear from them when I did I was about to order the aftermarket parts to start the build of the yoke assembly, how lucky was that.
I will still post all part numbers of what I was going to order later when complete so anyone who wishes to attempt the impossible will have a slight chance.

Going to buy a lotto ticket now.

Thanks

 

[shelfboy1]

glad you changed it i would not mount the pto shifter cable or not to the frame .when the truck flexes it will still pull one way or the other and could engage the winch

 

[Living in the Past]

I did have a chance today to test out the used transmission input shaft as a possible spine drive for the winch end slip yoke that I have, with a bit of work poor man milling it went very well.

Your pictures showed how the input shaft is tapered and the PTO shaft straight cut. Guessing the tapered gives it more surface area and strength. Needed more then the rarely used PTO winch. The single direction PTO only has bushing and not a bearing since it only rotates when the PTO is engaged. On the two direction the reverse idler gear is only a bushing again for the same reason.

glad you changed it i would not mount the pto shifter cable or not to the frame .when the truck flexes it will still pull one way or the other and could engage the winch

I don't even think a cable would even work on a PTO with the shift lever on the front. When the cable was used the housing was secured at both ends. The back securing point being to the PTO itself which wouldn't be very easy to do with the shift lever on the front. Not sure why Toyota chose to change the design with the 81 model, if the split T case made that much difference I don't know. But with the 83 model they change not only the location of the lever back to the transmission but switched back to linkage from cable.

For the shift lever a I would have located the pivot point of the lever going thru the floor at the same height as it would have been used originally. Not sure how far it will stick thru the floor where it is. Originally they weren't that high. As for front to back would locate to match the intended place on the floor mat which appears to further. Looks like that's where it was cut. I would just raise the pivot point which is easy to do with adjustments on the rod. I measured the 83+ PTO shifter and the pre 80and older shifter. I measured with a knob on the early shifter and 83+ to the top of the handle and not including the button on top. The later is 1 1/4" taller which appears to be the about the difference in the hole locations between the two. Don't have a top cover easily available to check.

 

[love2fly]

Getting the shaft - built.
Picked up a 2' section of 1' round steel for the start of the making of the shaft that comes off the PTO end (short). Then bought a 1' section of thick wall 1" I.D. copper tube. Total for both parts a whopping $7.00. I am leaving the 2' section at that leanth and will cut it to size as soon as I
receive the flange yoke for proper sizing.
I use the copper tubing as a way of keeping the shaft supper straight and keeping the heat down while tack welding it on the end of the 2' shaft.
Cheap and works.
I like to put a "V" notch on both ends of the shafts that are being but welded, this gives a bit more of a bit and fill.
First step is to take that 1" x1' section of copper and cut a section off around 5-6". Take that section and place it in your bench vice or some way to hold it from moving. I cut the all the way down the center of the copper tube on both side to make a clamp shell using a Dermal tool with a cut off wheel. Olan on using a few wheels as the copper eats them up fast. Once you have both half's cut a square section out on both side as seen in the picture, then take the two half to the buffing wheel or use a file to remove the burrs on the edges.
When that is take the two parts that have 1" O.D in the case the soon to be PTO shaft and place them in the shell half's were the center can be viewed in the two cut outs that were made. Place the other shell half on and butt up the two shaft ends keeping the center on the cut out. This is were you want to do your two spot welds on both side of the shall sides. Take two small clamps or what ever you have and clamp the half's together. Now you can spot weld the shaft tip in place and it will be pretty darn close to being dead on when done, no end wobble.
I tack weld to good size beads on both sides, then I remove the shell and then I use a straight edge to check all around the shaft for any signs of high or low spots. If I find any spots that need a bit of a tweaking I use a small ball ping hammer very lightly to set the area. When I had my setting set I went to the welding station and while my wonderful assistant (my wife) turned the shaft slowly around I put a weld bead in the "V" notch of the shaft to start the welding procedure off. I plan on putting a little more weld on but for now just going to let it cool down.
That's it, the start of the shaft, and it is very straight at the spline end when rolled, no wobble.
Any type o's, forgive me I m in a hurry to head out to work.
Thanks

 

[love2fly]

A few more pictures of the shaft.

 

[love2fly]

More questions if I may:

I am now doing researching on the pillow blocks that are available in the 1" shaft size. I have seen a few that look very promising.
I also read an article on the use of pillow blocks. One part of the article touched on the RPM speed to used with shaft load for pillow blocks.
I am considering the medium duty types used in farming industry, well sealed and ball type bearings. I think the heavy duty's types are a bit of an over kill for this application. The question, what is the max continuous RPM speed/range when using the PTO winch at its max load, 1,550 rpm or is there any? May not be a concern but checking all possibilities
I saw a post on Mud on the stock pillow block bearing and seal replacement. in reference to that, is the bearing housing removable from the stock shaft as a complete assembly?
Also are the yokes ends welded or pinned to the shaft on the stock line.
I have my the first set of end yokes to start from the PTO end but for future repair or replacement of the pillow blocks I am looking at someway were I can remove the pillow block from the shaft if needed. As of now welding the yokes on the shaft is pretty much the way to go.
Thanks

 

[scrapdaddy]

Yes, the pillow blocks can be removed as a unit. The bearings are no longer available, but you can still get a sealed bearing to replace the non sealed bearings. If that makes any sense.

 

[scrapdaddy]

If you look in the middle of the last picture, you'll see the pillow blocks.

 

[Living in the Past]

Doing a little searching it appears the bearing size is the same over the years whether the housing was aluminum or steel. One site list these as replacement bearings if you have the stock housing.

NACHI 62052NSE
NSK 6205DDUCM
Koyo 62052RSCM
Koyo 6205NR
FEBEST AS62052RS

For the RPM since the PTO gear in the transmission is on the tail shaft of the transmission it shouldn't be to hard to figure RPM by counting teeth on the three gears and doing a little math. Then just figure final RPM on PTO driveline depending which gear the transmission is in.

 

[love2fly]

So they are just a housing for the bearings, very nice. Would be nice to find two of them. I did find some similar types of hangar bearings that king of imitate the stock Toyota ones. There are thousands of types this is just a couple. So the end yokes are welded to the shaft or pinned ?
I am playing with the idea to drill a hole in the yoke body were the set screw goes then drill into the shaft to install a HD bolt. This way I can remove the yoke and then the pillow block bearing from the shaft if needed.
Yes that one picture of the winch parts looks familiar.

 

[love2fly]

I have decided to replace all the u-joints with new as they are rusty on the bearing shafts and corroded, and the O-ring seals are history.
I understand that at sometime Toyota changed the u-joints or did they just go to a self sealed type in the same size. I have found a number of 395 for a Moog type u-joint but want to make sure that I order the correct ones for my type.
The ones I removed are brass caps, no needle bearings, and were able to be greased.
Cap is 19.85mm wide, and max diameter across is 66.4mm.

 

[Living in the Past]

I did find some similar types of hangar bearings that kind of imitate the stock Toyota ones.

Personally I like the Style with two ears and bolt holes opening. The one you pictured puts the torque 90 degrees off the stock housing and single point instead of two. I'd Make a heavy bracket that attaches to the frame with a horizontal flat to attach the pillow block bearing to the bottom of.

So the end yokes are welded to the shaft or pinned ?

Early U joint yokes were welded to the shaft. Later used bolt by the pillow block bearings and welded on the shaft. Only flange with the four bolt pattern is at the PTO. Splined collar/U joint at that flange and splined collar/U joint at the winch end. Those are the only two points with any adjustment the rest while it has U joints is fixed. The splined collar is short at the winch end, the PTO end is still long. But this is the fine spline shaft/collar which while looks original can't prove either way. Finding another 83+ PTO setup on a 4X series seems to vary hard to have someone post up with. I'm really realizing how lucky I was to find the one I have.

 

[love2fly]

Yes I saw the type shown in the picture mainly to show that there are many types out in this big world and can find just about anything but a Toyota Shaft assembly, ha!
I have already started on the first mount and it is very soil.
I am still debating whether or not to shoot the shaft straight to the front from the PTO flange as the early FJ did with their winch shafts and just make a mount at the front area with pillow block support and cut the rear of the entry hole larger to also elevate the angled entry of the front short shaft. I have no engine items in the path of the shaft so it is a consideration.
Would be much cleaner and direct. This would elevate what would be the first pillow block and end yokes. The PTO flange yoke would be significant enough to hold the rear of the shaft without much stress as the shaft is 3.5 to 4' long.
I not sure why Toyota had about three or so set ups for the PTO shaft system properly due to accessories and such.
Do you know if the U Joint number I gave is correct for both types of u joint.

Thanks

 

[Living in the Past]

Toyota calls it a spider and found this part # up until 6/81 04371-60020. Then 6/81 and later with this one 04371-10011. These both might be available. With the later one showing a cheap aftermarket replacement. When figuring what to use I would look at torque specs more then RPMs. You have to figure anytime you will have higher RPMs will be at little to no load. Plus the time it will be used will be very compared to the rest of the drive train.

If you would have been able to get the driveline out of the 77 I might have considered adding a bracket to the front frame member and try to make the 7/80 and earlier style work. The early style has the flanges parallel to each other. But with little use I'm not worried about using the later one that just requires me to drill and thread few holes in the frame.

 

[love2fly]

I did find the PN but cant find a cross reference to the aftermarket types. The only info I found was that the u joints from Moog 359 were for a Toyota Celica of around 1977-79 or so and are the same as the PTO shaft u joints. I guess I will go with those.
The person I was dealing with came on with "sure I can have the shaft off and to you tomorrow" attitude but a few days latter it was all just slipping away, no calls, no emails. Then found the whole rig being parted out or sold complete on CL so maybe he changed his mind but I never saw any pictures of the shaft assembly so who knows.

 

[love2fly]

I am not feeling good about the Moog 395 U - joint replacement as the lengths are not the same, any other PN to check?
Thanks

The moog u joint has a bearing diameter of .788 in. or 20mm and my old u joint has a diameter of .788 in, the length of the 395 u-joint is 2.244 in. or 57mm, my old u-joint is 2.599 in. or 66mm. Differences in leanth.

Checked:
Universal Joints




Cross Interchange Parts
Factory Number
PRECISION 395
SKF 1-0011
CARQUEST 10011
Neapco 1-0011
ACDelco 45U0015
GMB GUT11

 

[Living in the Past]

For the late U joints I found a GMB GUT11 as a aftermarket replacement which wouldn't work for you unless yours is off a post 6/81 which I doubt. All my U joints are together making it hard to measure. Did measure the yokes and the earlier ones are wider then the later ones. You could solve the length issue with a couple of slugs that are 20MM by half the thickness difference. Just put one on each side between the end cap and C clip. Could use one slug but the would offset the U joint.