Mine was MIG welded with my Miller 211. Not sure of the settings. We turned it up until it sounded like bacon frying...and it doesn't look as purdy as @lelandEOD but it won't fall apart.
PSA: Check your frames, gents
- Thread starter lelandEOD
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Or anyone who mods their 80 and actually takes it off road into rough terrain regularly should just reinforce the area as part of their build process because we know that cracks will develop in the area around the steering box and track bar bracket.
Looks good to me. I don’t think mine looks that good under the paint. It’s just a scab anyway.
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We do two to three of these a month at the shop and anytime we have the steering box off we do it because it’s just a matter of time. Definitely a weak point…
- Thread starter
- #25
Agreed. I'm gonna have my friend CAD up a quarter inch reinforcement bracket for the right hand side of the pan hard frame mount as well. Can't hurt I figure. Every time you reinforce one area you shift a weak point somewhere else.
I think adding some weld material to the existing bracket on the passenger side and also gussets bracing the cross tube to the inside of both frame rails should do because that bracket doesn’t hang down from the frame.
Wondering how others have approached welding reinforcement plates onto the 80 Series frame, any tips or tricks?
This is what an AI robot said (I picked 1/4" plate for the example), anyone want to comment?
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Vehicle frame rails are often HSLA steel (40,000–80,000 PSI yield strength), so use matching or compatible filler materials (e.g., ER70S-6 wire for MIG). Preheat may be needed for heat-treated (HT) frames (100,000+ PSI) to avoid cracking—typically 200–300°F. Best practices emphasize clean surfaces (remove paint/rust with grinding or solvent), proper fit-up (no gaps >1/16"), and stress relief (taper ends of plates, stagger seams). Use fillet welds: intermittent "skip" welds (2" weld, 2" gap) to control heat/distortion, or continuous for high-stress areas. Avoid welding across flanges or within 0.75" of edges to prevent cracks; grind welds flush and apply corrosion protection afterward.
Below are general recommended starting settings for common processes on 1/4" mild/HSLA steel (fillet joint in flat/horizontal position unless noted). These are aggregates from manufacturer guidelines and automotive upfitter standards—adjust ±10–20% based on your setup and test.
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Use short-circuit or spray transfer mode on most machines. Shielding gas: 75/25 Ar/CO2 (C25) at 20–30 CFH. Polarity: DCEP. For vertical positions, reduce speed/amps slightly.
Use low-hydrogen electrodes (e.g., E7018) for frames to minimize cracking. Polarity: DCEP. Drag technique for fillets; multiple passes if needed. For 1/4" steel, 1/8" electrode diameter is standard.
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Less common for structural frames due to slower speed, but useful for precision. Use 2% lanthanated tungsten (3/32–1/8" diameter, sharpened). Gas: pure argon at 15–20 CFH. AC not needed for steel—use DCEN. Filler: ER70S-2 rod (1/16–3/32").
This is what an AI robot said (I picked 1/4" plate for the example), anyone want to comment?
=====================================================================================================
Vehicle frame rails are often HSLA steel (40,000–80,000 PSI yield strength), so use matching or compatible filler materials (e.g., ER70S-6 wire for MIG). Preheat may be needed for heat-treated (HT) frames (100,000+ PSI) to avoid cracking—typically 200–300°F. Best practices emphasize clean surfaces (remove paint/rust with grinding or solvent), proper fit-up (no gaps >1/16"), and stress relief (taper ends of plates, stagger seams). Use fillet welds: intermittent "skip" welds (2" weld, 2" gap) to control heat/distortion, or continuous for high-stress areas. Avoid welding across flanges or within 0.75" of edges to prevent cracks; grind welds flush and apply corrosion protection afterward.
Below are general recommended starting settings for common processes on 1/4" mild/HSLA steel (fillet joint in flat/horizontal position unless noted). These are aggregates from manufacturer guidelines and automotive upfitter standards—adjust ±10–20% based on your setup and test.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MIG (GMAW) Settings
Use short-circuit or spray transfer mode on most machines. Shielding gas: 75/25 Ar/CO2 (C25) at 20–30 CFH. Polarity: DCEP. For vertical positions, reduce speed/amps slightly.
| Wire Diameter | Voltage (V) | Wire Feed Speed (IPM) | Amperage (A) | Travel Speed (IPM) | Notes |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0.030" (solid, ER70S-6) | 17–20 | 250–350 | 140–200 | 15–25 | Good for thinner frames; focus arc on base plate for penetration. |
| 0.035" (solid or flux-cored, E71T-1) | 18–23 | 300–450 | 190–250 | 20–30 | Preferred for vehicle frames; use flux-cored for no-gas outdoor work. Higher end for single-pass fillets. |
| 0.045" (flux-cored) | 22–26 | 200–300 | 220–300 | 18–28 | For thicker joints or windy conditions; Lincoln/Miller charts recommend for 1/4"+. |
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Stick (SMAW) Settings
Use low-hydrogen electrodes (e.g., E7018) for frames to minimize cracking. Polarity: DCEP. Drag technique for fillets; multiple passes if needed. For 1/4" steel, 1/8" electrode diameter is standard.
| Electrode Type/Diameter | Amperage (A) | Voltage (V) | Travel Speed (IPM) | Notes |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| E6011 / 1/8" | 90–140 | 20–25 | 4–8 | Fast-freeze for poor fit-up; good penetration on rusty frames. |
| E7018 / 1/8" | 110–160 | 22–26 | 5–10 | Low-hydrogen for HSLA/HT frames; flat position preferred. Preheat for HT steel. Vertical: drop to 90–130A. |
| E7018 / 5/32" | 130–200 | 24–28 | 6–12 | For deeper penetration in single pass; use on clean metal. |
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TIG (GTAW) Settings
Less common for structural frames due to slower speed, but useful for precision. Use 2% lanthanated tungsten (3/32–1/8" diameter, sharpened). Gas: pure argon at 15–20 CFH. AC not needed for steel—use DCEN. Filler: ER70S-2 rod (1/16–3/32").
| Thickness | Amperage (A) | Gas Cup Size | Filler Rod Diameter | Notes |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1/4" (single pass) | 140–200 | #6–#8 | 3/32" | Start at lower end; add 50/50 Ar/helium mix for hotter arc if needed. Multiple passes for full strength. Vertical: pulse mode if available. |
Almost wishing I had the foresight to tackle this job when I had no engine the 80 just a few weeks ago. This thread makes me want to learn to TIG, though I'm not going to have the 80 be my place for learning.
How was access for welding the inside of the frame with the steering gear removed, assuming your engine was there to need to work around?
How was access for welding the inside of the frame with the steering gear removed, assuming your engine was there to need to work around?
On a different 80 a few years ago I found rather advanced cracking of the bracket and inboard side of the frame so I decided to cut the factory bracket off and start over from scratch building my own track bar bracket. This meant sanding the frame clean of all paint, welding the frame cracks which were all on the inboard side of the frame, and then making and welding plates to both sides of the frame and of course fabricating the bracket which welded on the inside just like the factory bracket.
It was tight working between the engine and frame but very doable with some patience.
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- Thread starter
- #30
Access wasn't bad but I imagine it could be awkward depending on gear. The TIG torch we used a short stubby length of tungesten to better get into tight spaces.
What has to be removed to weld these plates in?
I I've no foreseeable plans to have my truck torn apart but welding these plates in is on my list.
Is it something that can be done without removing a bunch of stuff?
I I've no foreseeable plans to have my truck torn apart but welding these plates in is on my list.
Is it something that can be done without removing a bunch of stuff?
It depends on what you consider a bunch of stuff. The steering gear box and the inner fender rubber apron need to be removed. What's in your way on the inside of the frame depends on what you and your 80 have going on. I made my own plates and other bits my 1993 a few years ago. The Delta kit is a good value when I consider how much time I spent making my own kit. Doing this before cracks start cuts down on the amount of work.
See, from my point of view (I've been around a weld or two
), NDE to check for cracks is part of the job. You check for cracks before doing anything else, grind them out and weld them up so you are back to original strength, then add reinforcement plates.
Amazon prime has eddy current machines ready to ship….See, from my point of view (I've been around a weld or two
What, not everyone has access to one already?
Jokes aside though, dye penetrant is so easy once you get the hang of it, I just don't know why more gearheads don't use it. You hear about guys paying to have motor parts "magnafluxed" and I always think, "you could have done an equivalent test at home on the cheap, before sending unknown parts to the expensive machinist."
- Thread starter
- #36
I can confirm, it still makes those epic VNT decompression wharbles every time I come off throttle and it's basically the best thing ever.
late to the party replySee, from my point of view (I've been around a weld or two
strong 25+ lb pull force horseshoe magnet and some steel grinding dust off your floor dusted over the area between the poles will be a more than resonable Mag particle test (magnaflux) to find any fine hair line cracks in the toe of the welds around parhard mount. Most cracks that form there get pretty obvious pretty fast. Dye Pen is a meh test, unless you have a really nice smooth surface and pretty good openings/flaws that have to be open to the surface, (yes the capilary action is pretty strong) you will get lots of false indication with most of the welding you find on an 80 series.
No need for X-ray, UT or Eddy current .
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Ah yes, that 25lb horseshoe magnet everyone has floating around their shop?
I'd have to disagree with you on dye-pen. There is a knack to getting good results on dirty material and poor welds, but I can tell you from experience that it will work in worse circumstances than one would find in a Toyota frame. Meanwhile, I doubt most folks have access to a big, beefy permanent magnet. I advocate for dye pen in these situations because it's (relatively) cheap and it's what I use myself... and I DO have access to professional mag yokes, which are much easier to use than a permanent magnet because they STOP being magnets when you stop hitting the button.
As for the possibility of finding sub-surface flaws with mag, this stuff is thin: if it's cracked, it's cracked.
Exemplary commentary on nondestructive inspection indeed. Need it become a point of contention?
Ah yes, that 25lb horseshoe magnet everyone has floating around their shop?
I'd have to disagree with you on dye-pen. There is a knack to getting good results on dirty material and poor welds, but I can tell you from experience that it will work in worse circumstances than one would find in a Toyota frame. Meanwhile, I doubt most folks have access to a big, beefy permanent magnet. I advocate for dye pen in these situations because it's (relatively) cheap and it's what I use myself... and I DO have access to professional mag yokes, which are much easier to use than a permanent magnet because they STOP being magnets when you stop hitting the button.
As for the possibility of finding sub-surface flaws with mag, this stuff is thin: if it's cracked, it's cracked.
Ok no old horseshoe laying around, got a couple a magnetic welding alingment tools? All you need is 2 fairly strong magnets (hobo freight sells plenty) and something ferrous to link them. Some cabeling or small chain from your engine hoist, dog house, your wifes hand cuffs, ect... and the afore mentioned grinding/fileing dust.
Dye has a hard time getting into to tight surfaces impefections that are loaded full of other stuff like oil and grease from your steering box and road grime or other toyota antirust oil distrbution system further back on the rig. No capilary action, no reservior of dye after cleaing off the excess after dwell time, = little to nothing for the for developer to pull back out. Hence why I dont like dye pen for anything thats been greasey or has very rough weld surfces. Unless you spend a ton of time and cleaning solvents preping the area to get the oily contamination out of the indications your results are going to be iffy at best, and with very rough surfaces will hold excess dye in the ripples and under cut even after you clean it before you hit it with the developer to leave a lot of false indications or masking true indications. A decent wipe down with degreaser or dawn dish soap to get the heavy off, and making sure its dry will be clean enough for Mag particle to work for this appliaction.
I do agree with you though 80 serise frames are pretty thin and cracking become apparent with out any special detection methods to the eye very quickly and its cracked. I know what your saying that Dye pen, is a fairly easy and afordable thing to come up with for the home gamer and I am glad you have had some good luck with good results with it for those purposes. That said for automotive applications its got some pretty big caveat's. As far as the "pro yokes" go if I can use them I will take permanent magnets (most specs say you cant use them anymore) , they stick to the work and I dont have to hold that heavy ass yoke up the whole time.
I are LvL II NDT tech across the board in all methods other than eddy current.