The clunk indeed seem to get less present when they warm up. It's also totally gone in high speed.
Noisy Front Suspension -- BP51 --thinking about selling
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Only a couple hundred miles, but no clunks whatsoever even with compression at 1. Then again, it's been 90 degrees this past week in LA.
Has anyone had clunking in weather over 60 degrees?
Has anyone had clunking in weather over 60 degrees?
With the uplifted hand 'I."
Nope usually it clunks when it's about 50 degree or lower, 90 degrees you are in the sweet spots.
Why are you afraid to use the truck? Unless the components are installed incorrectly, or stuff is loose there should be no effect on the vehicle. How would you damage the KDSS? That has nothing to do with what brand of shocks you have on the vehicle.
Also 5 pages does not necessarily indicate how many people are having these issues. I am not saying there are not issues one should probably compile a list of people with issues. Then there is also the part about ensuring that all noises are isolated to the shocks and not maybe another installation issue.
We believe that most people need to be educated about the shocks. They are bypass shocks. Most if not all bypass shocks make noise. Now if the bypass technology is applied to a shock that is intended for street trucks then one would hope that it does not make noise. Using this technology on street trucks is a fairly new thing, and yes, ARB might not have been ready to cover all climate conditions around the world. It is a shock filled with oil. Expecting the oil and the whole cycling of the shock / oil travel through passages etc to have the same characteristics from -20C to 200C is not reasonable. I am sure there are some fancy oils that can do it, but probably nothing at a price point that would allow for these shocks to be sold to the general public.
We sell these, also our own shocks, Icon and some other brands as well. I can assure you, that all shocks have compromises and they are not all perfect. We have seen issues with all shocks, and normally the issue is not so much about the hardware as how the supplier / manufacturer deals with this. At this point I believe ARB is doing their best to deal with this within the resources available to them. As of today I am not aware of any of these shocks failing, other than a small quantity of shocks that have developed leaks. Even then, leaks are not uncommon with these kinds of shocks.
When choosing these shocks for the performance they provide as well as the customization options, people should be aware of what they are buying.
I know it is frustrating when the modified vehicle starts making noise, but the choice to modify is always with the customer. Understanding pro's and cons is important for the customer, as it is for the vendor to educate the customer.
For reference, refer to this from the Icon documentation. So just suggesting to jump ship and go to a different brand might not be as rosy as it seems. I am not posting the below info to bash ICON, just to indicate that people should check the details when they purchase aftermarket parts.
------------------From ICON ----------------
2.0 ALUMINUM SERIES TECHNICAL INFORMATION
MAINTENANCE
ICON shock absorbers are a high quality rebuildable race style shock absorber designed for optimal performance. With a unit of this caliber on your vehicle, routine maintenance is required to keep them looking and operating in like new condition. Residual oil and assembly lube may be present at all seal paths from the factory out of the box and is considered normal. Pooling of oil however is not acceptable at any time and one should contact the iCON dealer where purchased.
BELOW ARE GUIDELINES BASED ON HOW YOU USE YOUR VEHICLE BUT YOUR MILEAGE MAY VARY:
STREET USE:
• Send in for factory servicing every 40,000 miles or if a leak develops, ride quality decreases, or they begin to make excessive noise.
• Remove any buildup of road salt, mud, or debris from shocks anytime accrued
• Clean with mild soap and water with each oil change or anytime you notice build up.
• Wax the cylinders yearly with automotive wax to prevent corrosion.
• Check nitrogen pressure yearly. (252004 charge needle assembly available at any ICON distributor)
STREET/DIRT:
• Send in for factory servicing every 15,000 miles or if a leak develops, ride quality decreases, or they begin to make excessive noise.
• Clean with mild soap and water with each oil change, offroad trip, or anytime you notice build up.
• Wax the cylinders yearly with automotive wax to prevent corrosion.
• Check nitrogen pressure each dirt outing. (252004 charge needle assembly available at any ICON distributor)
DIRT USE:
• Send in for factory servicing every 1,000 miles.
• Check nitrogen pressure each outing. (252004 charge needle assembly available at any ICON distributor)
• Remove any buildup of mud or debris from shocks after every outing.
I suppose. But if I spent $3400+ on a suspension setup that isn't performing as anticipated/expected (within reason) and with no resolution in sight, I wouldn't be pleased. Especially from a reputable company and/or distributor. Also, I don't know of any similar issues with Icon, King, Radflo ect..
Environmental Climate plays its part. I ran my icon for 50,000 before rebuilding them. Mixed usage at that, snow, rain, hot, cold, mud and sand. Icon shared with me that some guys out in Cali have done 80,000 miles before a rebuild due to the dry arid climates cali has to offer. That alone is a statement. I agree above Is a great rebuild suggestion usage table for Icon shocks, its what I referenced frequently while watching my miles stack up. But really its a disclaimer if anything. If my icons had issuse within the first year of ownership and usage I would have been beside myself for the money I spent.
Respectfully i fail to see why a premium set up should have a dedicated page of gripes by unsatisfied customers, even those that are uneducated. This is a quality control issue.
With that said i wonder if ARB will release a suggested shock rebuild table and what that will look like seeing how they are now in the non-disposable shock biz.
Respectfully i fail to see why a premium set up should have a dedicated page of gripes by unsatisfied customers, even those that are uneducated. This is a quality control issue.
With that said i wonder if ARB will release a suggested shock rebuild table and what that will look like seeing how they are now in the non-disposable shock biz.
A legit reminder not to assume new issues will be better than old issues...
I do have to give ARB some credit for acknowledging the issues and trying to deal with them ASAP.
While all 3 of the issues I've seen in my BP-51s are real enough that ARB is directly addressing them with new design elements
(rock guards; excessive oil),
I'm glad they aren't just waving us by.
They have addressed two of the three issues, and are working on the 3rd. That does tell me they are standing behind their product and that perhaps more patience is needed even though its frustrating. And ya...I've seriously considered switching to another setup. But hoping there's no need.
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And I think as Slee suggested, someone with vested interest should start a clean, global thread for all BP-51 owners and let them "poll" whether they've had any issues. There's a few threads going on, and it makes it seems like the problem is only in these 5-pages. Where really... I'd be curious if anyone HASN'T had the clunk and the true volume of owners and the the percent of those who have had issues.
None of those companies have a bypass shock for the 200, so it is not apples to apples.
Not true, Icon has a range of bypass shocks, just not any for the 200. I bet if you searched Icon Bypass Noises you would get some results as well.
I do not see it as a quality control issue, purely an issue of a smaller company doing something new and they thought they had all the bases covered but are being thrown a curve ball on this. It happens all the time in the aftermarket world. Obviously none of the smaller companies have large auto manufacturers budgets to do the scope of testing that might have shown this.
ARB is considered a smaller company? Compared to Microsoft, I suppose so.
Is releasing a product that has (alleged) issues by definition not a quality control problem?
But you're right, it isn't apples to apples. Those companies don't defects in their 200 suspension products and ARB does.
Either way, I don't have a dog in the fight so it's all gravy to me. It's just unusual.
Is releasing a product that has (alleged) issues by definition not a quality control problem?
But you're right, it isn't apples to apples. Those companies don't defects in their 200 suspension products and ARB does.
Either way, I don't have a dog in the fight so it's all gravy to me. It's just unusual.
Compared to other shock absorber companies like Fox, Bilstein, etc, Old Man Emu is small. That they are now part of ARB doesn't make them a big suspension company...
Right, but ARB itself, is a world renowned brand and their name is on the product.
Who knows, maybe owners just weren't aware of the "bypass click" which seems to be par for the course when using these types of tubes. Or maybe it just slipped past the engineers.
Who knows, maybe owners just weren't aware of the "bypass click" which seems to be par for the course when using these types of tubes. Or maybe it just slipped past the engineers.
You are completely right , on multiple points, but let me tell you my story.
I spent $65 k on the truck then another $10 k on
shocks, tires, gears, lockers. Out of that, at list $7000 went to Australia.
I try to be reasonable with ARB .
Within one week one shock start leaking, then a second was found by the dealer that it was leaking
Now , when i went back to replace the shocks , this is additional money out of my pocket plus another day lost from work.
On top of that the guy from ARB is telling me that is normal for 1 out of 100 shocks to leak.
You see, ,, is one after the other and they keep piling.
I would be ok with any of these if You, ARB or any distributor can show me where, in fine printing is specified that this is completely normal and I should expect the leaks, the noise in cold weather and multiple trips back to the dealer within few months with a truck that spend most of the time on the highway.
Yes, when installing aftermarket shocks , nothing is guarantee and i agree to take on some issue (maintenance,noise). But not on something that i can't drive after 4 months.
The worst this truck see is 10 miles of gravel few days a week. I am not running BAJA.
They are saying that is not going to damage anything else. Based on what ?? will they pay for the repair if in two months the A arm bushings needs to be replaced ?? There is no way in the world that I will not end up with something else that I have to replace latter but this is for another day and I very aware that I will be on my own.
I installed a set of Icons , few years back on my Tacoma and I developed a leak after one winter. In two days Donahue sent me another shock and I never had a problem after.
I spent hours on multiple forums, reading about different manufacturer with theirs different problems. Some related to noise from the springs, some related to a leak , etc. The difference is that it been addressed. Either at vendor level or manufacturer level.
Here , ARB is playing the Jimmy with the head in the sand and it takes for ever.
I understand you and i appreciate you trying to educate us on the risks we take when we decide to modify our trucks. But now, that you are aware of the issue <<<< i would love to see if you, as a distributor, will tell people that are going to inquire about these shocks ,about the potential problems in cold weather. In fact it should be marked in red, bold letters under when you inquire on line.
That would make ARB move their behind and you would build a great customer trust.
About ARB
Today, ARB is Australia’s largest manufacturer and distributor of 4x4 accessories. We also have an international presence, with an office in the US and an export network that extends through more than 80 countries around the globe. Our philosophy, however, has never wavered from its original course – quality, reliability and practicality above all else.
BP-51 (Bypass 51mm Diameter Bore) Shock Absorbers
The new BP-51 range of high performance, bypass shock absorbers is the result of an exhaustive development process aimed at delivering the ultimate in both comfort and control.
Designed, developed and tested entirely in-house by ARB’s team of Old Man Emu ride engineers, BP-51 shock absorbers are vehicle specific and utilise existing mounting locations to provide easy installation without the need for additional vehicle modification.
Unlike most other adjustable shock absorbers, which provide adjustment for compression only, the BP-51 range allows on vehicle, independent adjustability of both rebound and compression to offer class leading ride customisation that can be tailored to individual vehicle or trip requirements.
Development and Manufacturing
All BP-51 shock absorbers are manufactured in-house by ARB. In order to achieve this, significant investment has been made in state of the art machining and hard anodising equipment, allowing ARB total control of the process to ensure the highest possible quality.
BP-51 shock absorber bodies are manufactured using aircraft grade (6061) anodised aluminium to dissipate heat more efficiently than steel or alloy steel and provide superior corrosion resistance.
Extensive lab, real world and destructive testing has been undertaken during the development process to ensure that reliability, longevity and performance all meet ARB’s impeccable standards.
I am not so sure that properly conveys the experience some BP-51 owners are having (same issues can be found on Tacoma and 4Runner forums). Some chalk it up to being "normal", But then to Virgilus' point... if it's just about an "uneducated buyer", a disclaimer not a marketing pitch would be nice.