New owner looking for help with steering problems.

[Welsh Jeepster]

Hi all,
I’ve just purchased an Asian spec, restored FJ40 and looking forward to learning how these things tick. I’m based in Wales in the UK, but as Land Cruisers were never imported into the UK, it’s going to be a challenge to obtain spares and get my head around any issues. We had plenty of land rovers, especially with farmers and there is a huge LR scene here, but a 40 is unknown.
I’ve a problem with the steering. It’s a real pig to control and all over the place on the road. Vehicle looks to be in reasonable condition as it’s been recently restored but I’m yet to understand how good a job they did. I’ve started checking off the usual possible causes - wheel bearings adjusted, any slack in the centre arm and drag link etc.
I had a wheel alignment at my local tyre garage yesterday which adjusted the tow to just over 3mm toe in ( sorry, you will need to do your own metric to imp conversion) but caster looks to be circa half a degree negative.
This week I will install caster shims to get positive caster which should improve things but I maybe also need a recon on the power steering box, which doesn’t look too bad but has some play. ( tried to attach a video to show the play but not sure if this forum will accept vids)
Any assistance gratefully accepted.

 

[Mark Jennings]

Looks like a nice rig. Can you post the year and if it’s had a lift kit installed? Can you post more pictures?
Your negative caster indicates maybe a 2” lift. Most US rigs that go 2”, with stock length shackles go for 2 degree shims. And since you’re at it, check the rear drive shaft angle. My rig has a 2” lift plus 1” longer rear shackles, I ended up with 4 degree shims in the rear to set the correct pinion angle.

 

[charliemeyer007]

Year(month)/model/market is important for parts.

How are the tires? Maybe it sat in one place for years while all the work was done.

Vids work here. Maybe you need to upload them to like youtube first and post the link.

Maybe some free download manuals

Land Cruiser Factory Service Manuals (FSMs)

Factory service manuals (FSMs) for your Toyota Land Cruiser ! From the 1950s to the present!

www.cruisercult.com

 

[Welsh Jeepster]

it’s a January 1980 build. FJ40 sold to Indonesia. I’ve attached a couple of additional pics that may assist. My background is in classic British sports cars and this is my first 4x4, so still getting used to lift kits etc. I’m not sure if this has a lift, looks like the shackles have been replaced but I don’t see any riser block on the axle.
Here is a link to show the play in steering -

 

[Mark Jennings]

The tire is a 235 85 16, almost 32” diameter. And looks like OME shocks. Based on the one picture of the front wheel and guessing the ride height, I bet it has a OME 2” lift with stock shackle length.
So between loose steering and negative caster, would make it a handful to drive……
Not sure what to do with you steering, other than adjust any play out of the linkages. Adding 2 degree shims to correct the caster will help substantially.

 

[pb4ugo]

A couple of degrees of positive caster can do wonders.

 

[cruisermatt]

That does not look lifted to me.
How old are the tires? Tire age can cause serious issues

 

[Welsh Jeepster]

That does not look lifted to me.
How old are the tires? Tire age can cause serious issues

Tyres are new

 

[Welsh Jeepster]

The tire is a 235 85 16, almost 32” diameter. And looks like OME shocks. Based on the one picture of the front wheel and guessing the ride height, I bet it has a OME 2” lift with stock shackle length.
So between loose steering and negative caster, would make it a handful to drive……
Not sure what to do with you steering, other than adjust any play out of the linkages. Adding 2 degree shims to correct the caster will help substantially.

Is there a measurement I can take to prove if it has a lift kit ? Or stock? I’ve adjusted any slack out of the linkages but still play in the steering box. The video I posted shows how much play I have at the wheel and at the top of the box. Does this look normal or should I get it refurbed?

 

[pb4ugo]

Wait until you install the caster shims b4 messing with the steering box. Negative caster gives a feeling of twitchiness, white knuckle driving. a small correction seems like an over correction. Poor handling. Install shims with the fat end towards the front.

 

[Mark Jennings]

Wait until you install the caster shims b4 messing with the steering box. Negative caster gives a feeling of twitchiness, white knuckle driving. a small correction seems like an over correction. Poor handling. Install shims with the fat end towards the front.

pb is correct, once shims installed then see how the steering feels. Picture of front shims under my rig. These are what 2 degree shims look like. And when you buy shims, may need new spring through bolt with a longer head to center the spring on the axle. If you’re buying shims locally (UK) then whoever you’re buying them from should have the longer head bolts.
If you’re doing mail order to the states, repost and we’ll get you a parts list and vendors.
And for gosh sake, use steel shims, aluminum shims break, wear and then you’re driving around with a loose axle.

 

[Mark Jennings]

Pretty sure you have a 2” to 2.5” lift, this was my alignment numbers prior to adding shims. The caster numbers are close to what you have. Adding 2 degrees will bring you back to stock numbers, 1 to 1.5 degrees positive. I run a Chevrolet (Saginaw) power steering box that is very light. The 2 degree shims made the rig track so much better….but still very light steering effort.

 

[Rocky_LC]

Also (and you will correct this when you get the shims installed) any looseness of the U-bolts connecting the axle to the springs will also contribute to wobbiliness…

No one in the UK likes the Wobblies.

Just another thing you can check.

Rocky

 

[fjwagon]

The factory steering setup has a lot of moving parts. Adding shims will help as mentioned above. Jack up the front end and check for slop. It is common to have some slack but most if it can be adjusted if have good working components. A lot folks prefer swapping in a Saginaw or fj60 type setup especially if they are running huge tires. At one point I purchased a fj60 power steering box to swap but could not convince myself to do it. I prefer the factory setup even with a little play. The steering geometry is set up so the steering wheel doesn't jerk you when hit a rock to the point in makes the steering wheel take off you. I say keep tweaking it.

 

[JohnnyC]

Your drag link at the pitman arm has the screw pretty far in … you may want to do a “two penny trick” ( @65swb45 ) while the USA Pennys are still available lol

 

[hj 60]

Mine passed road check for steering and has the same play (left to right) that is also stated in the manual as normal.

The spring directly connected at the steering arm might have damaged cups or wrong install (difference is some have spring between rod or after the arm) But everything on yours looks new.

They seem to have replaced all wear parts, suppose axle seal and bearings too, hope installed and scale (pulling test) checked with the right tightness, seems quality (old man emu, if it is not only a sticker, and greasable zerc like 555 had/has)
I miss a fat layer of grease on threads and bolts to prevent corrosion but it will attract sand anyway, but I use boat axle grease because it is water resistant.

Easy check if you know what to look for:
Should be greased and checked anyway so remove split, turn plug with very wide screwdriver and find the 2 cups (seat) and spring and see if it is correct:
The best invention of landcruiser steering but I think the play you are searching is not to be found by hand, it is all firm and tight, need a crowbar to find play (if it is there in the new parts)

You have the left (40 series)

But mine has about 2 mm play in the Central arm/link (conical thingy) thread at the bottom where the steering damper arm is, so will take it apart after other stuff is done to get a valid road check.

My 40 has about 3 mm of thread sticking out, (think still original) yours seems new but tighten it (top socket #22 #14 and bottom)

(passed with play in it, and it drives about 90 km/h without problems (steel Toyota rim 7.50R16) but this play is just what I was searching for (let someone turn the wheel) something was just a tiny bit to much loose or strange.

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I order parts here, sometimes one fix needs three companies, shipping from USA is still more than parts worth (checking for 13 years now, gave up)

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[RevISK]

4* caster correction shims seem to be the norm with a spring/tire lift. I’d start there personally.

 

[anothernz45]

I can't see any wheel weights in any of your photos, did you get them balanced? You're spinning a stiff light truck tyre now. Are the rims the original 5.5 wide or later 6 inch? Have had issues rims wider than these

 

[pb4ugo]

4* caster correction shims seem to be the norm with a spring/tire lift. I’d start there personally.

Personally I would want more caster than the stk 1* positive spec. I run scout power steering which is similar to fj60/80. I tried 4* shims with a 4" lift and i shortened the shackle a bit too. That resulted to 1* positive caster, it drove ok, but decided to try 6*, which netted me 3*, which i like a little better.

 

[RevISK]

Personally I would want more caster than the stk 1* positive spec. I run scout power steering which is similar to fj60/80. I tried 4* shims with a 4" lift and i shortened the shackle a bit too. That resulted to 1* positive caster, it drove ok, but decided to try 6*, which netted me 3*, which i like a little better.

Precisely where I ended up with 4* shims on a 1.5-2” spring lift with 33’s. Right around 3* positive caster.