Keep or remove California SMOG components? (1 Viewer)

[BIRDMAN84]

As mentioned in my first post, I am a log time viewer of this forum, but I am finally able to join the discussion not that I own a new-to-me 1977 FJ40. I'm beyond thrilled thrilled to join the club!

I've owned/restored a few classic Chevy K10's, and just recently let go of my 71 K10 to get the 77 FJ40. Aside from now owning the coolest 4x4 ever, I want to be able to work on it on my own, learn how to tune and maintain all systems, and simply enjoy the hell out of driving it. However, the emissions equipment will likely require that I take it to a mechanic if any issues arise, which is NOT what I planned.

I am looking for advice on whether I should keep the Cali SMOG equipment OR remove what I can (of course I would keep it all and set it aside) to eliminate much of the headache of dealing with vacuum leaks and the added complexity of how everything works. I'm a big fan of keeping things stock, but all the emissions equipment is NOT required to register the vehicle where I live, so I would be able to drive it without it.

Based on the paperwork and info I was give from the PO, here is the rundown of the rig:
- 3/77 FJ40 - California Emissions Equipped (passed SMOG last in 2016)
- it has 99K original miles, but the engine was completely rebuilt at 60K miles, in 2001 in Placerville, CA at Warden's 4x4 (I do have the paperwork)
- Original 4 speed trans/transfer case
- Asian carb (California specific?)
- Appears to have a California-specific header?
- A ton of emissions-related valves, vacuum lines, etc

Everything runs pretty decent, aside from a slightly rough idle. Also, Accelerating thru 1st and 2nd gear is great, but I sometimes notice a "stumble" or "miss" when accelerating thru 3rd and 4th to get to highway speeds, though once at a constant 55-60mph, it runs like a top. The sight window in the carb seems to remain at the same level at all times, but it is not half full, it only ever reads at 20% full or so. It's totally drivable, but I would like to track down the issue causing the stumble.

Here are a few pictures under the hood. Let me know what you think! Any and all feedback is greatly appreciated!

 

[bhsdriller]

remove it, just the cleanliness and room it clears up is an advantage in itself

 

[BIRDMAN84]

I feel like is it easier said than done... I have not found any posts outlining instructions on deleting the SMOG that I am aware of, and I am worried about disconnecting lines and getting myself in trouble and causing running issues...

 

[bhsdriller]

Search through google...."fj40 desmog" and similar lines it will pull up posts from this forum. Don't search directly on the forum it's harder.

There's tons of posts on it

 

[Dizzy]

Passing smog doesn't mean that any of that stuff is properly working. Either, fake it for appearance, or desmog with the eye of archaeologist to keep the collection of smog parts as a whole. It sounds like that carb and ignition work might be part of a valve clearance and vacuum check. I do like an originalish look particularly on the later 2Fs, but, the complexity of the system leaves you vulnerable, like internally rusting EGR valves, and a Hot Air Intake mechanism that is running overtime in the summer.

Desmog is easy, we can coach you on the process. Either one or two vac lines from the carb, a vented gas cap, or a charcoal canister to atmosphere or some means of getting to the intake manifold or air cleaner assembly, a cap on the EGR and float boal vent (usually made from fuel line, or PCV line with a short steel plug inside, disconnect and plug stuff like the smog pump and air rail, and a vac advance distributor.

 

[BIRDMAN84]

Passing smog doesn't mean that any of that stuff is properly working. Either, fake it for appearance, or desmog with the eye of archaeologist to keep the collection of smog parts as a whole. It sounds like that carb and ignition work might be part of a valve clearance and vacuum check. I do like an originalish look particularly on the later 2Fs, but, the complexity of the system leaves you vulnerable, like internally rusting EGR valves, and a Hot Air Intake mechanism that is running overtime in the summer.

Desmog is easy, we can coach you on the process. Either one or two vac lines from the carb, a vented gas cap, or a charcoal canister to atmosphere or some means of getting to the intake manifold or air cleaner assembly, a cap on the EGR and float boal vent (usually made from fuel line, or PCV line with a short steel plug inside, disconnect and plug stuff like the smog pump and air rail, and a vac advance distributor.

I really appreciate they help. Ive been reading up on some of the desmog threads and they do make it seem more manageable that it seemed at first.

I assumed (as you mentioned) there are really only 1/2 vacuum lines that will need to remain? I believe i need a line to my dizzy?

Would I be able to remove the "computer"? Can I remove the smog pump? (may require a shorter belt)

Also, the header looks to be quite complex... it has a "EGR" cooler and several other ports coming off of it. Would it be better to just buy an aftermarket header without all the goodies on it?

 

[bhsdriller]

Yes on the smog pump and computer, the link I posted in your other post has a pulley you can replace it with depending if that belt is driving anything else.

On mine the pump was mounted lower driver side with it's own belt so didn't require anything else.

 

[Dizzy]

You might need a line to the distributor. If the distributor has a vacuum advance mechanism, then the line goes to a 'ported' barb on the base of the carb.

The smog pump is an independent belt, on my two-pulley 2F. It doesn't need parts.

The modifications to the electrical isn't necessary, IIAC. It is all vacuum controls that need attention.

If the header works, and you can cap the EGR, use it. The header market is kinda weak for 2F, IMO. If your header doesn't leak, it is already ahead of the game.

There is a specific Toyota 3mm vac cap that is going to be needed somewhere. And, I forgot, the vac line right under the air cleaner on the carb is needed. It hooks up to the manifold at the 'gas filter,' also the choke breaker diaphragm on the carb will go to the 'gas filter.'

 

[snaggletto]

I would keep driving it for the short term and do all the basic mechanical drivability stuff, brakes, valve adjustment, spark plugs, spark plug wires, and check timing. My 2F likes a decent bump on timing ~10-12 degrees but mine is low on compression as well so don't get carried away. These are things you would have to do anyway. See if you can make it run better while you research smog removal. If you can make it run good with the smog stuff, then roll with it and enjoy it for now. Enjoy.

 

[airon23]

I would keep driving it for the short term and do all the basic mechanical drivability stuff, brakes, valve adjustment, spark plugs, spark plug wires, and check timing. My 2F likes a decent bump on timing ~10-12 degrees but mine is low on compression as well so don't get carried away. These are things you would have to do anyway. See if you can make it run better while you research smog removal. If you can make it run good with the smog stuff, then roll with it and enjoy it for now. Enjoy.

This is exactly my thoughts. Why would you want to mess with a 2F motor that is running well? I mean if there is some reason to do it then I'm all for it and what people are telling you and what you're reading all seems right, but from the sound of it, it doesn't sound like there is any reason to tear into a perfectly fine running FJ40 to maybe take out some hoses and smog stuff.

You just bought it... so just drive it.

Figure out what small things need fixing and what major fixes are in need. I know it sounds simple, but it's the truth, the vehicle will let you know where it needs the attention. I think along the way you may find you still want to desmog it, but in my opinion you should not just buy the thing and start removing stuff from an engine that by your words seems to be running well. The slipping thing on the transmission is likely just that a transmission issue, but even that sounds like it doesn't impede you from driving it, so keep on driving it.

Looks great btw. Looks just like my sky blue 76 with the California smog equipment and all.

 

[corcel]

I don't know exactly how effective it is, but you've also got the carb cooler fan there by the looks of it.

This thing is a beauty. Shame that all the work was put in for CA emissions and it might be torn out.

I am actively putting all these parts back into my CA 77, but I live in California. It's on our farm, so we typically don't have to worry about emissions, but I'm hoping to drive it back on the road again. Back in the '90s, we took the EGR pipe and snipped it closed so that it sealed the back port on the manifold (thermo reactor). We removed most of the vacuum tubing aside from charcoal canister and it has run like a top since then.

 

[Dizzy]

What is your mpg?

 

[BIRDMAN84]

What is your mpg?

Looks like about 9-10mpg at the moment, but I need to put more miles on it before I can be certain.

 

[BIRDMAN84]

This is exactly my thoughts. Why would you want to mess with a 2F motor that is running well? I mean if there is some reason to do it then I'm all for it and what people are telling you and what you're reading all seems right, but from the sound of it, it doesn't sound like there is any reason to tear into a perfectly fine running FJ40 to maybe take out some hoses and smog stuff.

You just bought it... so just drive it.

Figure out what small things need fixing and what major fixes are in need. I know it sounds simple, but it's the truth, the vehicle will let you know where it needs the attention. I think along the way you may find you still want to desmog it, but in my opinion you should not just buy the thing and start removing stuff from an engine that by your words seems to be running well. The slipping thing on the transmission is likely just that a transmission issue, but even that sounds like it doesn't impede you from driving it, so keep on driving it.

Looks great btw. Looks just like my sky blue 76 with the California smog equipment and all.

I agree. I really just need to learn what everything does so I can fix things as the come up.

 

[BIRDMAN84]

UPDATE: I drove it to work today, and to the DMV to get every titled in my name and swung by the local Toyota dealership to pick up a new fuel filter... After running three tanks of premium 92 octane thru the carb, the stutter has all but disappeared! The PO mentioned he just ran regular in it, but it really seemed to make a huge difference with the issue I was having getting thru 3/4 gear with good acceleration.

Do you guys run premium in your rigs?

 

[Dizzy]

88 Octane with Techron.

Usually, the distributor breaker plate needs its bearings greased - so, there is a bit to do for your distributor, aside from ensuring that your points gap/dwell on a non-electronic ignition.

Typically, the carbs get a bit of stuff built up in them. Either rebuild or new. My advice is go new with a non-USA OEM carb.

Spark and fuel will get quite a bit of performance out of these rigs. However, I had to adjust my valves so the motor could breathe, and replace the valve stem seals so the spark plugs can do their job without getting oil fouled. My 2F is below factory spec for vacuum, and it is almost below factory threshold for compression. I've got as much as 15mpg with a tank that is basically burnt in 3rd and 4th gear.

 

[fjc-man]

UPDATE: I drove it to work today, and to the DMV to get every titled in my name and swung by the local Toyota dealership to pick up a new fuel filter... After running three tanks of premium 92 octane thru the carb, the stutter has all but disappeared! The PO mentioned he just ran regular in it, but it really seemed to make a huge difference with the issue I was having getting thru 3/4 gear with good acceleration.

Do you guys run premium in your rigs?

Ethanol free if it’s available.

 

[mrboatman]

87 octane the cheapest stuff available in my area runs great

 

[4Cruisers]

You might need a line to the distributor. If the distributor has a vacuum advance mechanism, then the line goes to a 'ported' barb on the base of the carb.

There is a specific Toyota 3mm vac cap that is going to be needed somewhere.

Your distributor should be both vacuum advance and vacuum retard. The ported vacuum from the carburetor (just forward of the idle mixture screw) should go to the outer nipple on the distributor's advancer. The inner nipple can be capped with one of the below OEM caps. I'm not sure about the source of the retard vacuum, but a desmog guide should answer that. I don't know if there's a thread here on MUD specific to the '77 California spec emissions.

BTW, the vacuum advance curve for the Federal spec and California spec advancers is the same, even though the Federal spec advancer is advance only.

Vacuum cap Part Number 90339-03002.

 

[avicenna110]

Remove them and give us the parts I’m also actively looking for smog parts for my ‘77 cal spec…