HVAC Blower Motor Rebuild slow?

[dbbowen]

That wear on the commutator is normal after many years of use. While the carbon brushes are softer than the copper, the copper will still wear over time. Your old brushes were basically "mated" to the profile of your commutator since they wore together, which is why many people report their fans running slower/weaker after replacing the brushes. If the commutator isn't excessively worn, it's just a matter of time to bed the brushes in to match the commutator's profile. To be honest I've never chucked one up in a lathe to turn the commutator all the way down to the phenolic and see just how thick that copper is. Looking at yours again though, it MAY be worth giving a chance to see if you can get the brushes to wear in. It's definitely very worn, but comparing to the couple scrap motors I have that I've gutted, it's not as extreme of a case as they are.

man. I actually chucked the whole commutator up in my "Lathe" and shaped the new brushes to it and still no dice :/ I caved and ordered a four seasons unit from Napa. Going to see how that works out tomorrow... kind of bummed on it. The four seasons unit i put in my firstgen 4 runner was noticably s***tier.



The lathe in question:

 

[toy_tek]

Dang, that’s too worn? It was JUST blowing normally. It would cut out and I had to smack it sometimes to work. All I did was clean it. I thought that groove was supposed to be there haha

I was looking for some denso units as Matt’s site is down and idk if anyone’s heard from him in a while. I couldn’t find any online anywhere

I know you already ordered a 4S but is your connector in good shape? Mine actually melted one day while I was driving - I just smelled burnt plastic for awhile (coincidently I was only a mile or two from a huge landfill which is what I thought I was smelling) then realized my blower wasn't working. Like you I couldn't find a Denso, so I trimmed the plastic connector guides away from the contacts on the motor and crimped new spade terminals to the wires, as well as cleaned up the commutator and made new brushes. But wondering if you might have a wiring issue.... maybe check the wire resistance to ground?

 

[dbbowen]

I know you already ordered a 4S but is your connector in good shape? Mine actually melted one day while I was driving - I just smelled burnt plastic for awhile (coincidently I was only a mile or two from a huge landfill which is what I thought I was smelling) then realized my blower wasn't working. Like you I couldn't find a Denso, so I trimmed the plastic connector guides away from the contacts on the motor and crimped new spade terminals to the wires, as well as cleaned up the commutator and made new brushes. But wondering if you might have a wiring issue.... maybe check the wire resistance to ground?

Man it’s funny you say that because my connector is definitely discolored due to heat. I ended up getting a VDO replacement from Napa and it works just as well as the original did.

 

[Spook50]

Man it’s funny you say that because my connector is definitely discolored due to heat. I ended up getting a VDO replacement from Napa and it works just as well as the original did.

Were you able to see if there were any markings on it referencing Siemens? I'm curious to see if the 4S/VDO blowers (yeah the two are actually the same) are now overseen by Siemens, because if they are, that would make for a big increase in quality if you ended up with a Siemens unit.

My experience with all the 4S/VDO motors I've used has been working decently for a while (on par with a worn OE/Denso unit), then more often than not the bearings (bushings technically, in this application) would begin to fail, making for the motor struggling to turn, moving less and less air, and shortly in, loud screeching noise when the motor is running. So needless to say I was grateful to see that there's now a Denso option available again.

I still have to find those pictures I took of the two rotor assemblies side by side and post them, because the difference in design and build quality is easily discernable.

 

[dbbowen]

Were you able to see if there were any markings on it referencing Siemens? I'm curious to see if the 4S/VDO blowers (yeah the two are actually the same) are now overseen by Siemens, because if they are, that would make for a big increase in quality if you ended up with a Siemens unit.

My experience with all the 4S/VDO motors I've used has been working decently for a while (on par with a worn OE/Denso unit), then more often than not the bearings (bushings technically, in this application) would begin to fail, making for the motor struggling to turn, moving less and less air, and shortly in, loud screeching noise when the motor is running. So needless to say I was grateful to see that there's now a Denso option available again.

I still have to find those pictures I took of the two rotor assemblies side by side and post them, because the difference in design and build quality is easily discernable.

I couldnt see anything saying Siemens, but it looks like there are bearings in this unit coming out of the shaft. or at least that might be the bushing?

The bushings on my toyota unit i think were what was hanging it up, they were literally spinning inside of the felts.

I keep seeing talk of a new denso option but havent found any denso units online anywhere?

 

[Dan_J-spec_fj62]

Perhaps reviving a dead horse here, where did you find new brushes? Mine were completely gone and the springs melted... so I don't have good example to build from...
1984 HJ60 12HT H55.

thanks

Daniel

 

[toy_tek]

For brushes I just took an old one and went to the local hardware store (Ace) and matched up 2 that were as close as I could find to the same size. Used a little emory cloth to size them correctly to fit, and soldered the leads in. I think they were about $1-2 each. In your case I'd measure the guide channels for the rough dimensions. Can always trim them smaller.

 

[Dan_J-spec_fj62]

For brushes I just took an old one and went to the local hardware store (Ace) and matched up 2 that were as close as I could find to the same size. Used a little emory cloth to size them correctly to fit, and soldered the leads in. I think they were about $1-2 each. In your case I'd measure the guide channels for the rough dimensions. Can always trim them smaller.

Thank you!

I lucked out as I tore my motor apart further and found a little piece of the brush left.

Found some hikoki replacement brush brushes at the local hardware store that were kind of close did my own soldering. Cleaned the motor up a bit and use some high temperature brake pin grease on the motor bearing surfaces.

My soldering is pretty ugly… And I had to splice mid wire from the Old connections, but once I got it installed in the truck. Spins up real nice and blows hard. A little bit noisy, I assume that’s the brushes wearing in. I do have one of the replacement motors on order from rock auto.


Daniel once yesterday it hasn’t done it today

 

[MWM1]

Great job!
Do you have a part number for the hikoki replacement brush?
Ty!

 

[bhsdriller]

These are the ones I used. Says unavailable but could use the size to find another. Had to trim them shorter is the only thing but it's easy

TOPPROS Carbon Brushes, 10 Pcs, 19mm x 7mm x 6mm | Wire Leads Attached, Brush Springs Attached, For Generic Electric Motor - Amazon.com

TOPPROS Carbon Brushes, 10 Pcs, 19mm x 7mm x 6mm | Wire Leads Attached, Brush Springs Attached, For Generic Electric Motor - Amazon.com

www.amazon.com

 

[Dan_J-spec_fj62]

Great job!
Do you have a part number for the hikoki replacement brush?
Ty!

Well, kind of… So here’s the thing I bought two sets of brushes that were very similar in size as far as width and height. The length were very different between the two boxes.

And it’s the shorter brushes that worked better

But I threw away one of the boxes, and I don’t remember which set of brushes came out of which box. So if you go to the store and find the box marked 999-041. You’re gonna be really close. But if the brushes inside seem to be pretty long, open up a few more boxes and look for a shorter set something right around. 6 or 8 mm long. The longer set is. About 12 mm long and would be a really uncomfortable fit and probably cutting the pigtail coming off the end.

If you look in the photo below, you can see where the pigtail just clears the slot in the housing. The longer ones the pigtail would be smashed in there.

I hope that helps.

Daniel

 

[Spike Strip]

Do these look like the ones you used ?

 

[Dan_J-spec_fj62]

Do these look like the ones you used ?


View attachment 4201223

well i see something on those i missed on mine. the 41 is white on yours... i looked a the pack i have left and the 41 is very faintly etched on the carbon... and they are the long brushes... so sadly I don't have the actual part number of the brushes I used (threw the box away on trash day) if you have these id cut them down to the 6~8 mm size or measure the slot available on your motor brush housing and trim to fit.

Daniel