Any idea what this noise is? 2013 Land Cruiser (1 Viewer)

[doctacarta]

2013 Land Cruiser

Any idea where this noise is coming from? It generally makes this noise from a cold start but is intermittent. My local shop thought it might be the chain tensioner, but they have been unable to recreate the noise, unfortunately.

My warranty expires in about a month and does cover the tensioner unit. My local shop said It could easily be $5k if they have to replace the whole "unit".

I just uploaded my video to YouTube, so I'll post it here.



Any thoughts or advice would be appreciated.

 

[mcgaskins]

Check this post out for a video of the same noise and all the parts that were replaced to fix it:

Builds - mcgaskins' 2013 build thread - Palladium

Thank you! Wow that's funny, and yes that's us. It's a small world! I'll have to come checkout your setup someday! My truck has very little done to it, but hoping to start getting some more stuff done this year.

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[ElJayBird]

Driver side timing chain tensioner

You might get Toyota to repair under warranty. Maybe. You can also try some Seafoam oil treatment - some people have had luck with it. I tried running it through mine for several hundred miles but didn’t have any luck. Finally broke down and had Toyota tear it apart and replace the tensioner - had them do a new timing chain and a ton of other stuff while they were in there. The service manager thought I was nuts.

 

[doctacarta]

Thanks for the input. My local shop suggested a hail mary and take it into Toyota to see if they could definitively point to the chain tensioner, then hope my warranty covers it.

 

[doctacarta]

 

[gasman4u]

View attachment 3507485

Looks less like a hail mary and more like the end of a Perry Mason/Matlock episode. Open and shut! Good luck!

 

[Fisher23]

It does say timing tensioners, if that is the problem.

 

[04UZJ100]

Only happens at idle under certain operating conditions. Not fully cold and not once warmed up. All my research has indicated it’s a non-issue to leave it.

Happens on my 14LX too.

I suspect it happens on a TON of trucks and goes unnoticed. You can’t hear it inside the cab and doesn’t start until like 90s of runtime.

 

[Heritage 2020]

My guess is VVT cam phaser rattle.

Not an apples-to-apples comparison, but it is seen also in F-150 3.5L TT HO where a pin shears from the phaser and causes a rattle upon cold startup until the oil pressure gets up. It would come and go periodically, rarely from a warm/hot start.

I only know this because I once had a 2018 Raptor which had the issue under warranty.

It took 2 months before they were able to repair it, but the rattle caused no harm to the engine per Ford (just the annoying sound at cold startup).

Again, just a guess as most VVT vehicles have cam phasers which operate under similar principles.

 

[stonepa]

2013 Land Cruiser

Any idea where this noise is coming from? It generally makes this noise from a cold start but is intermittent. My local shop thought it might be the chain tensioner, but they have been unable to recreate the noise, unfortunately.

My warranty expires in about a month and does cover the tensioner unit. My local shop said It could easily be $5k if they have to replace the whole "unit".

I just uploaded my video to YouTube, so I'll post it here.



Any thoughts or advice would be appreciated.

My 2015 has done this since new. Cycles on and off until the engine warms up. No idea what it is.

 

[04UZJ100]

My 2015 has done this since new. Cycles on and off until the engine warms up. No idea what it is.

That strong/distinct of a metallic clank/rattle?

 

[CreeperSleeper]

Mine started doing it as well with the colder weather... Super annoying. LOL

 

[stonepa]

That strong/distinct of a metallic clank/rattle?

No - the sound like some sort of solenoid click then a pump turning on, then off 10 seconds later. That’s all I hear.

 

[04UZJ100]

No - the sound like some sort of solenoid click then a pump turning on, then off 10 seconds later. That’s all I hear.

Well that’s not what’s in the video.

 

[TeCKis300]

Not an uncommon issue to the 5.7L and commonly attributed to the driver side time chain tensioner as per @ElJayBird .

A workaround is to step up to 0W-30 or 5W-30.

This is not the same cam phaser issue that afflicts Fords that can result in more serious implications.

 

[04UZJ100]

Not an uncommon issue to the 5.7L and commonly attributed to the driver side time chain tensioner as per @ElJayBird .

A workaround is to step up to 0W-30 or 5W-30.

This is not the same cam phaser issue that afflicts Fords that can result in more serious implications.

Still happens to me on 5W30

 

[bloc]

The 3UR does have some cam phaser issues on occasion but it’s a different failure mode than the ford setup and far less common. What’s not uncommon, is the drivers side chain tensioner take-up ratchet failing.

Depending on the position of the cam lobes when the engine comes to a stop it is possible to have the cam gear pull backwards on the chain, which can compress the tensioner spring since there won’t be any oil pressure. There is a small ratcheting stop built into the tensioner that is intended to hold back against this tendency, but it needs to be a ratchet to take up for slack in the chains as they wear. The ratchet fails and allows the chain to compress the tensioner when the cam lobes are in the correct position, then when you start the engine the same cam lobes plus the loose chain allows the cams and chain to bounce around everywhere, until sufficient oil pressure causes the tensioner to take up the slack and get quiet.

This is likely all made worse by deposits building up within the tensioner since it doesn’t really see any oil “flow”, it’s more of a dead-end circuit.

For sure, the chains, cams, cam lobes, lifters, and possibly valves slapping around like that are beating the s*** out of all of those parts.. but not to the extent they seem to fail prematurely.. other than the occasional anecdotal report of guides failing and the timing chain jumping a tooth. But in those cases who knows how other maintenance was handled?

Mine has done this randomly in the past and switching to 5w-30 seems to have mostly eliminated it, plus quieted down the valve train in general. I suspect the ratchet does fail, but can also limp along if other factors reduce the stress it sees. A thicker oil should do that.. or seems to have in my case.

I suspect the cyclical more mild rattle that is an occasional feature of these engines is related to the phasers, though not an actual failure. Just some quirk about how they operate. Mine definitely does that in the mountains sometimes.

 

[04UZJ100]

The 3UR does have some cam phaser issues on occasion but it’s a different failure mode than the ford setup and far less common. What’s not uncommon, is the drivers side chain tensioner take-up ratchet failing.

Depending on the position of the cam lobes when the engine comes to a stop it is possible to have the cam gear pull backwards on the chain, which can compress the tensioner spring since there won’t be any oil pressure. There is a small ratcheting stop built into the tensioner that is intended to hold back against this tendency, but it needs to be a ratchet to take up for slack in the chains as they wear. The ratchet fails and allows the chain to compress the tensioner when the cam lobes are in the correct position, then when you start the engine the same cam lobes plus the loose chain allows the cams and chain to bounce around everywhere, until sufficient oil pressure causes the tensioner to take up the slack and get quiet.

This is likely all made worse by deposits building up within the tensioner since it doesn’t really see any oil “flow”, it’s more of a dead-end circuit.

For sure, the chains, cams, cam lobes, lifters, and possibly valves slapping around like that are beating the s*** out of all of those parts.. but not to the extent they seem to fail prematurely.. other than the occasional anecdotal report of guides failing and the timing chain jumping a tooth. But in those cases who knows how other maintenance was handled?

Mine has done this randomly in the past and switching to 5w-30 seems to have mostly eliminated it, plus quieted down the valve train in general. I suspect the ratchet does fail, but can also limp along if other factors reduce the stress it sees. A thicker oil should do that.. or seems to have in my case.

I suspect the cyclical more mild rattle that is an occasional feature of these engines is related to the phasers, though not an actual failure. Just some quirk about how they operate. Mine definitely does that in the mountains sometimes.

FWIW, I’ve found that it only happens in Park or Neutral. Dropping the truck into drive and the noise goes away….

 

[bloc]

FWIW, I’ve found that it only happens in Park or Neutral. Dropping the truck into drive and the noise goes away….

Meaning the loud clatter or the more quiet tapping?

 

[04UZJ100]

Meaning the loud clatter or the more quiet tapping?

The loud clatter that sounds like a wrench left in a clothes dryer.

I still believe that the 2UZ is a better engine than the 3UR. The only issue it really has is cracked exhaust manifolds.