22R and 33s... Regear? Marlin Crawler?

Manhattan

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Just ordered the Toyota 15" steel wheels and hubcaps. These will be painted or powder coated Antique White (it's a Toyota color) and then the BFG KO2s - 33/10.50/15 will be mounted.

Then, I'll bolt'em on and unleash that 22R's 97 horsepower.

I realize this truck will not be fast... ever. And, I'm not building a purpose-built trail rig. It will see occasional, light to mild 'wheeling. But, I'm wondering if the 33s will really just kill the truck - like, make it tough to drive... mountain roads, merging onto Atlanta's 14-lane 80mph highways (actually, those highways are usually crawling at 20 mph, so I should be fine there)

The options are:
1. Marlin Crawler - another T-case. This will solve the issues on the trail, but not help on street. I mean, theoretically, that 2nd T-case could just stay in the lower range... but that'd be too much for the street.
2. Regear the difs

Regearing seems like the obvious first choice... I think. The difs are open. Regearing and locking would be a HUGE plus and make sense to do at the same time.

Is my thinking right here... start with the difs and come back to the T-case if and when I need even more gear for the trail?
 

Meatdawg

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I was basically in the same boat as you, but mine has the 20R. I put a small lift on it and 33x10.5x15 tires. My 1980 came with a 4.37 ratio from the factory, but after driving it around town and on the freeway I knew I had to re-gear. I went to 4.88's and a locker. That made a huge difference. As you said, it is not a race car, but it will now get out of it's own way.
 

G-Cat

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4.88 is the standard for re-gearing these Toyota's to run 33s. It is needed if you want to be a happy driver as opposed to a frustrated driver. Adding locker F/R is a no-brainer if the funds support.
 

BlueCruiser84

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To answer your question directly - 33s and 4.88s are the winning combo. No need for dual cases unless you want to wheel and are ok with still having sub-par onroad performance.

I have 33s and 4.88s on a 22re 4Runner and it is a pleasure to drive.

If you don’t intend to offroad I would definitely not spend money on lockers - unless you “just want them”. Same with the 33s. 31x10.50s look great on these truck in stock trim and will perform very well up through mild-medium trails.

On the other hand I completely understand the urge to over-equip a vehicle just because buying s*** is fun. And driving “off-road” rigs is fun. Heck, with two kids, a new house, and work travel I use a locked 80 on 37s for my DD/kid hauler. I haven’t been wheeling in months....
 

Manhattan

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As with previous builds - Jeeps, 100 Series, the goal is build it for difficult trails and only 'wheel mild trails. Lockers and a winch are sooooo nice to have - especially right out of the body shop ;)

Sounds like the I'll gear up for (see what I did there) spending the money on regearing to 4.88s and figure out which lockers to stuff in there.

I'll be the first to admit - I don't "need" 33s. But man... 33s on 15" wheels just look killer on these old trucks.
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We have 33’s on my wife’s 1989 truck with a 22R. Drives just fine does slow down on steep inclines. Still can get it up to 84 mph, the max the Speedo goes up to. Not sure if it has been regeared , but the speedometer is more accurate with the 33’s than it ever was before.
 

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Sounds like the I'll gear up for (see what I did there) spending the money on regearing to 4.88s and figure out which lockers to stuff in there. I'll be the first to admit - I don't "need" 33s. But man... 33s on 15" wheels just look killer on these old trucks....
What locker options are there? I'd suggest either ARB or electric, if available.

Actually if it were me, I'd go with 31's and not do the gears or locker. Refreshed interior, good brakes, good steering components, maybe a 5 speed would all be good ways to spend some cash, make it a nice ride and also a more valuable rig IMO.
 

Manhattan

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Actually if it were me, I'd go with 31's and not do the gears or locker. Refreshed interior, good brakes, good steering components, maybe a 5 speed would all be good ways to spend some cash, make it a nice ride and also a more valuable rig IMO.
I totally get that 33s will have some adverse effects. I'll come back to this post if, in a few months/years, if I'm dropping from 33s to 31s and get roasted ;)

I did just have the entire brake system replaced with new Toyota parts - MC, booster, etc. The interior is getting fresh carpet (and added sound-deadening material) and the seats are being rebuilt/covered. The steering checked out fine (the truck only has 58,000 miles). The suspension is new - OME 2". And, it's got a 5-speed.

After going bigger (35s+) on other trucks, 33s have always seemed like the "standard" "lift and tires" to me. And again, a lot of this is driven by aesthetics. The truck will spend most of its time local - not a DD. The 'wheeling trips will be under 2 hours away. All should make putting along in the right lane a bit more tolerable... for a while anyway.
 

pappy

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I'm going to offer a counter view.

I had a 1982 Hilux. 33" tires and 4.10 gears. IT SUCKED! I should have regeared, but sold the truck. Ya, 4.88 is the standard, and it will work. Just keep in mind that your highway rpm will be crazy high, especially if you don't have a "5" on your shift knob. I ran that gearing on my '85 xcab, and while it worked great around town, the highway rpm was just too much. Plus, all that rpm sucked gas.

I run 4.56 on my 22RE 4Runner. I love the combo. If I need more umph I can row from 5th to 4th. But, I'm not turning 3200rpm+ on the freeway.

Dual cases? Are you really asking this? Do it, don't look back. I just spent another week in Utah. I could not imagine doing those trails with factory gearing. Why beat yourself up? We are supposed to be having fun off-road, not trashing ourselves and our trucks.
 

yotadude520

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I too second (or 5th?) 4.88 gears on 33's. My pickup has them and it's got enough power to get out of it's own way.
 
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Like everybody has said, 4.88s & 33s is a huge upgrade from stock gearing and well worth it.

I found a diff with stock 4.88s so that could be a cheaper option for you than doing a full regear. I’m sure somebody on here could tell you which model years have this. I stuck an arb in my stock 4.88 diff and popped it in. So good so far.
 

G-Cat

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Stock 4.88s were found in certain 4x4 SR5 second gen 4Runners with tow packages. The code on the door tag for 4.88s is G144.

While less expensive and OEM Toyota, they are extremely hard to find due to their relative rarity and the (also) relative large number of Toyota guys looking for them.

There are many threads in other forums that catalogue the info: one of the take-aways is that the carriers for Toyota 4.88s will Only accept Toyota 4.88s...so if you get a 4.88 loaded pumpkin, and the gears ever need replaced, you are back on the hunt for OEM Toyota.

I searched for months and finally gave up. I’d only demand Toyota 4.88s if I couldn’t afford aftermarket.
 

ntsqd

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I ran Patch all over the West with 33-10.50's and 4.88's for over 120k miles. Exactly that, a 22R with no 'E'. I didn't think the revs were too high and the uncorrected speedo was within a mph or two at every speed that I checked it against a GPS. It routinely got 17-19 mpg on the highway at those rpms. If I was heavily loaded that would drop into the 15-16 range as long as I didn't lean on it hard. Spent a LOT of time in third gear going over the Sierra's, Cascades, Inyo's, White's, Coastal Range, Great Basin ranges, etc.
 

Manhattan

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Well, I think I have a plan: 33s, 4.56 gears, a Harrop eLocker in the rear and an Aussie up front.

That should give me close to the best of all worlds - open diffs on the street (with hubs unlocked) and fully locked off-road. I realize an auto-locker up front isn't as good as another e-locker... I think I can live with it.
 
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ntsqd

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I suspect that 4.56's aren't going to be deep enough, though w/o the steepness & altitude of the Rockies or the Sierra's in the mix it may be enough.
 

pappy

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Well, I think I have a plan: 33s, 4.56 gears, a Harrop eLocker in the rear and an Aussie up front.

That should give me close to the best of all worlds - open diffs on the street (with hubs unlocked) and fully locked off-road. I realize an auto-locker up front isn't as good as another e-locker... I think I can live with it.
I like this plan.

I suspect that 4.56's aren't going to be deep enough, though w/o the steepness & altitude of the Rockies or the Sierra's in the mix it may be enough.
I'm weird. I like the 4.56 with the 33's.
 

ntsqd

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I went 4.56 with the 3.0/Auto in the 4rnnr and at times, rare but occasionally, I wish that I'd gone 4.88's with it too. As the tire size grows from the present 31's to metric 32's (235/75R17's is the plan) I'll be curious to see if that impression changes.

With the 22R in Patch it worked out almost exactly like stock with the 33's & 4.88's. Speedo was uncorrected and less than 2 mph off @ 65 mph.
 

Manhattan

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With a base '84 4x4 Xtra Cab, is there a way to verify the stock ratios - 1st gear, 5th gear and current axle? Or, do I need to crawl under and get the codes off the trans and dif? This is what my research (Google) determined:
1st 3.928
2nd 2.333
3rd 1.451
4th 1.000
5th 0.851

If that's accurate:
- 4.56s and 33s, would be at 2,775 RPM at 70 mph
- 4.88s and 33s, would be at 2,975 RPM at 70 mph

That seems about right... right?

I may be strange (and wrong)... but I've always felt the older trucks - CJs and now Toyotas - just scream on the highway. I know, I know... don't argue with the engineers. But just rolling along for hours (even an hour) at 3,000+ rpm just feels wrong. I mean, I could always drop to 4th when I finally hit GA's massive mountain ranges (cresting those 2,500' peaks can be tough).
 

ntsqd

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These aren't V8's, they can spin that high all day long and I've done so for well over 100k miles. Initially I was concerned about the seemingly high revs, but I came to realize that these engines were made to do that.
 
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