Affordable fuel injection for California (1 Viewer)

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Coastline

Coastline

Joined
Sep 25, 2009
Threads
28
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Location
Cucamonga but don't want to be.
I have a 77 with 2F. It has only about 15 K on the clock and I am really tired of giving up cash every two years (smog and carb work) for Mary Nichols approval to run on the street. I spoke to a gentleman at Affordable Fuel Injection last month about a fuel injection for California. He does have a CARB certified system for Jeeps but not for the Fj40 because of low demand at this point in time. In order to get the certification for California he would need 20 orders to afford the hassle and cost. Personally, I would be willing to pay a few dollars more for one if we could not come up with 20 40s.

Any takers?

Mitch
20181231_174750 Irene Landcruiser.jpg
 
Can you just buy the Jeep kit with a Toyota adapter?

Is it the kit that is certified or the application?
 
We (Downey Off Road Mfg.) spent 3 years during the 1990's trying to get our TBI conversion smog legal at the C.A.R.B.. We had the three Landcruisers running a lot cleaner after the engine warmed up and the TBI system went into closed loop, but we could'nt get past the "federal cold start" test. Soooooo, you don't get to let your engine run much cleaner with better milage during 99% of the driving you do due to the 1% that your engine is warming up- - -doesn't that make you want to scream???

Regarging using a Jeep E.O. smog decal on your Landcruiser, as soon as the smog inspector saw the Landcruiser grille emblem and Jeep decal, he would bring all of his buddies over to help him laugh you off the property.
 
Last edited:
Downey said:
We (Downey Off Road Mfg.) spent 3 years during the 1990's trying to get our TBI conversion smog legal at the C.A.R.B.. We had the three Landcruisers running a lot cleaner after the engine warmed up and the TBI system went into closed loop, but we could'nt get past the "federal cold start" test. Soooooo, you don't get to let your engine run much cleaner with better milage during 99% of the driving you do due to the 1% that your engine is warming up- - -doesn't that make you want to scream???

Regarging using a Jeep E.O. smog decal on your Landcruiser, as soon as the smog inspector saw the Landcruiser grille emblem and Jeep decal, he would bring all of his buddies over to help him laugh you off the property.
Click to expand...

Jim, didn’t you also tell me that the certification process also involved a five digit application fee for the time THEY were going to spend testing your stuff?
 
Yes, as I recall we were spending about $2500.00 per each 3 day test at a Federal testing facility, and we did several test. Plus at one point we had to spend $1500.00 for a special testing compartment to capture emissions after the engine was shut off.
 
Downey said:
We (Downey Off Road Mfg.) spent 3 years during the 1990's trying to get our TBI conversion smog legal at the C.A.R.B.. We had the three Landcruisers running a lot cleaner after the engine warmed up and the TBI system went into closed loop, but we could'nt get past the "federal cold start" test. Soooooo, you don't get to let your engine run much cleaner with better milage during 99% of the driving you do due to the 1% that your engine is warming up- - -doesn't that make you want to scream???

Regarging using a Jeep E.O. smog decal on your Landcruiser, as soon as the smog inspector saw the Landcruiser grille emblem and Jeep decal, he would bring all of his buddies over to help him laugh you off the property.
Click to expand...
If they couldn’t get it passed a cold start then I doubt affordable will. How did the do it with the Jeep I wonder?
 
The process, thus far, has been miserable. But mainly due to SEMA destroying the test vehicle.

SEMA has an arm of their services that is available to members. Membership is anywhere from $800-thousands depending on the size of your business. Btw it’s for businesses within the auto industry. It’s not a hobbiest endeavor because they have a mandate to increase businesses within the industry.

As a member I am given access to their services developed by an arm of SEMA called SEMA Garage. I get access to vehicles for scanning before mere mortals. I can get 3D printing for a reduced rate. I get access to their full service mechanics bays. But the only thing I care about, and utilize, if their emissions lab.

SEMA Garage has an agreement with CARB yo act as an intermediary as part of the CARB EO process. They do the paperwork and the testing and handle all the red tape processes. In return I get the honor of paying them a ton of money. This amount is in the 5 figures.

In order to identify what is a candidate for a CARB EO you begin with a meeting for the emissions lab team to discuss what you want to accomplish. Big picture. They research and see if it’s possible and what it would take to solve the objective. This is where most businesses decide it’s too much effort and just do 49-state.

Now keep in mind that CARB is now being utilized by 16 states and growing. That’s a huge portion on my market so it was a business decision to move forward.

For my particular situation I was developing a bolt on turbo kit for the OBD2 1FZ for the 80 series. The first step is testing the vehicle according to CARB emissions standards which is NOT like a regular smog test. It’s way more involved and there is zero wiggle room. I took a truck that just passed smog but failed the emissions lab. That’s when you just start throwing money at the problem.

Once you get passed that part, three weeks in my case, then you install your product and then retest. All while making sure no emissions device is moved, removed not tampered with. It’s significant effort to develop around these parameters. The final product can NOT be a prototype. It must be a production piece.

But once you are done the vehicle goes back to SEMA Garage and retested. This could take 3-10 days. So long as the sniff test is within 1% of pre-testing you are golden.

You must have a complete instruction manual and a sample of your product to consider, and all that is sent to CARB. That is a 1-6 month waiting game. But once approved they issue an EO and you start printing underhood stickers. If you don’t pass the process starts all over again.

Also of note: the same vehicle MUST be used during all the testing.
 
FWIW doing this process for say 20 kits that will sell for what, maybe a grand? It’s completely unreasonable and not a smart business move. This is a process for products that can amortize the testing fees/process over hundreds if not thousands of units.
 
Wits End post #13 above describes most of what Downey went through 13 times (13 different products that we did receive an E.O. number on) but the times were shorter back then. Our test were only 3 days long, then we received our E.O. Exemptions within about 2 weeks. We always used the AAA Federal Testing Laboratory in LA, which was eventually moved to darn near beside the SEMA office in Diamond bar- - -believe it's still operated by AAA, not SEMA.
 
Downey said:
Wits End post #13 above describes most of what Downey went through 13 times (13 different products that we did receive an E.O. number on) but the times were shorter back then. Our test were only 3 days long, then we received our E.O. Exemptions within about 2 weeks. We always used the AAA Federal Testing Laboratory in LA, which was eventually moved to darn near beside the SEMA office in Diamond bar- - -believe it's still operated by AAA, not SEMA.
Click to expand...

Do they even do CARB anymore? They seem to focus on electronics/semiconductor testing now.
 
BTW we used AAA lab for x-raying some parts developed for helicopter mounting in the film industry that needed FAA approval. Interesting process.
 
The regulation compliance industry is a hack.. wish I was in it... :)
 
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