Builds Shipwreck (7 Viewers)

[SuperBuickGuy]

and about the trailer....
Today I went to look at some shelving for my shop - and it's a going-out-of-business sale at a fab shop (sad, but good for me). I just bought all the steel I need plus some (140'+) of 4" channel for $100... which is just enough to build a brand-new trailer.

 

[pb4ugo]

When we narrowed the hp44 we narrowed to waggy width, so if there was a broken axle we didn't have to have 1 custom cut. waggy's came driver & pass side drop and 60" wms to wms. Are you familiar w/ the "Mr N" website? I also found good info on the Dana Corp site.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

I didn't know, but now I do... http://77cj.littlekeylime.com/web_rs44.html

it had me worried about which axle I got - but as I cut the brackets off my 44, it's all good. I didn't realize 1/2" thick tubes... very cool stuff.

 

[watrob]

So where are you at with the axles? post some pics?

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

oh boy, Mace is going to have a field day.... I picked up the channel today, and I was wrong. boy... I really hate to admit this, but, as I need to be utterly honest in everything on MUD - I'll admit to what happened. The channel is 6" channel, I know, I know, I should have thrown a tape measure on it, but the guy, feeling the wrath of mace (obviously) made up for it by giving me 8, 20' sticks of 6" channel for $100.

whew, I feel better now that I got that sarcasm out.

 

[Wilson]

When we narrowed the hp44 we narrowed to waggy width, so if there was a broken axle we didn't have to have 1 custom cut. waggy's came driver & pass side drop and 60" wms to wms. Are you familiar w/ the "Mr N" website? I also found good info on the Dana Corp site.

Here's the site that I used when building custom D44's. There were a few different waggy axle widths based on year, two door vs 4 door, then add in the ford, jeep, Chevy and dodge trucks....there are a lot of variations and possible combinations.

http://home.4x4wire.com/erik/4runner/sas/#width

 

[Wilson]

...the rumor is 14 bolt axles can be made to work (35 spline).

This bit of misinformation that you posted is where you and Mace crossed paths. To expound on what he has already corrected (that 14b axles are a larger, stronger 30 spline axle than the 30 spline found in Dana 44 front and 60 rear axles) the reason that people weld the 14 bolt SPINDLES AND WHEEL HUBS onto other axles is because the 14 bolt spindles will clear a 35 spline shaft, most Dana 60 spindles will not. Some can be bored, others can not. The axle flange bolt pattern is different on the 14b vs Dana axles, but that is a simple re-drill job. Since you are cutting the ends off to have the axle narrowed anyways, it may be worth considering. You could still run the Dana 30 spline axles for now, but have room for an upgrade in the future, or do it now since you also have to buy a locker and the 30 and 35 spl models cost the same.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

(Note I said "the rumor is..." that isn't me giving misinformation, it saying - I've heard... also, he "corrected" me about the toyota axle saying it didn't come with 2.23 gears... which, I never said... but whatever, argue more here - see how many more times I'll let it go)

the dana 60 is such overkill for this build... 30 spline will never, ever break - I'm going 30 spline so I can run a lock-rite (and it's cheaper to buy new axles than shorten the ones I've got)... the fuse in this drivetrain is the AR6 transmission...


in other interesting news... Hot Rod magazine this month had a fix-it article about cracking disk brake pads. The quoted Wilwood as saying that flat plate, disk brake adapters, for unknown reasons, seem to have a lot of cracked pads as well. I attributed the cracked pads on my 14 bolt (chevy truck) to poor quality pads or that the pads drag a bit and overheated. They last about 5000-7000 miles before I get squealing... Pads, however, are so cheap (I bought a bunch at close out from Rock Auto for 5.34 a set) that I hadn't thought much about it. As I'm going disk brake on the back, I think I'm going to see what I can do to adapt dana 44 disk brake caliper brackets to the 60 rear...

 

[chappohj47]

Hey mate keep up the good work dont worry about those other posts there are always people like that on forums

 

[White Stripe]

today I called a shop about cutting the axles down - I figure if I get them to do the realignment I'll be money ahead since I won't have to buy or build bearing spacers to make sure it's straight... but to save money, I've been stripping the axles apart... the rear went easy, the front... 3 hours



this thing doesn't look like it was ever used... 45 11 (4.09) gears, so they're coming out for the 4:56s







now I simply need to decide how wide.. the rear axle is 62" wms to wms, the front is 67"... I'm thinking 58/59ish, but maybe I'll go as wide as 60" - stock is 56" the only reason to make it wider is a better turning circle

Im at about 60" and I really like it. Soooo stable. Im only running 35"s. With 40s I would probably do 62". Since you have one axle at that width.

 

[mr jits]

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=331102410693&alt=web

They're $, but I think would work for your application. At that price I think your custom header idea is probably money well spent.

 

[pb4ugo]

I'm sure you know, AA makes headers that go to the outside of the frame.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

I'm sure you know, AA makes headers that go to the outside of the frame.

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=331102410693&alt=web

They're $, but I think would work for your application. At that price I think your custom header idea is probably money well spent.

I'm sick in that I enjoy building headers, so this isn't a chore, it's dessert. Those headers are the same as what I've got, there is no room to run the headers or the exhaust pipe inside the rails. On the driver's side, the upper link occupies the space under the filter - so no center dump there, on the passenger side, the transfer case and (to some extent) the driveshaft take away any room - I've done the run-it-close-to-the-floor and that requires a huge amount of insulation, and the insulation (at least in that case) was marginally effective at keeping my shoes from melting...

I'm sure you know, AA makes headers that go to the outside of the frame.

actually, I didn't know - I do think the Nova/Chevy II fender headers would be close to working - but I've yet to find reasonably priced ones that are made of stainless... stainless kits start at $400.00, finished headers, for coated steel are in the $900 range

but as I said above, I enjoy building headers - so this isn't a chore. Also, by the time this is all said and done, I will have about $140 in the headers - I already have stainless tube from my building of headers and turbo headers for 455s (and the Spider).... that was where the comment about "do I make it pretty or not" comes from...

good comments, thanks, sometimes it's hard to detail the important thought processes that lead to (what to some) is a difficult decision to do it themselves. If you're one of those type of people that can envision building something in 3d, you'll find headers to be a fun challenge... if you're not, there are lots of folks out there would work for peanuts and will build you headers (they will take me 40 hours to complete - and, with the unscientific poll of several other friends who build it themselves, is about average for something not complex.... the Fiat, on the other hand, took several months).

 

[pb4ugo]

AA headers # 717006-hdr

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

AA headers # 717006-hdr

wow, that is a good deal (290ish).

I'm not sure those would work with my Scout box.

 

[pb4ugo]

IDK, They are designed to go over the stk steering box. Most folks are getting away from these style headers, but you might search for some old pics of these installed.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

reference... if you blow a seal

http://www.timken.com/en-us/products/Documents/Seal-Specification-Guide.pdf

I bought 2 seals today, both didn't work... however, this site got me the part number so, hopefully, my seals will stay unblown

 

[Wilson]

IDK, They are designed to go over the stk steering box. Most folks are getting away from these style headers, but you might search for some old pics of these installed.

I've used the AA headers on two builds. Here's some pics from my last cruiser build. Plenty of room for the steering shaft. They only come in bare or painted though iirc. I chose to ceramic coat.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

good picture, thanks. cylinders 5 and 3 would be right in the way of the steering column.

 

[Wilson]

good picture, thanks. cylinders 5 and 3 would be right in the way of the steering column.

Well crap, looks as if I deleted my pictures with the column in there. I didn't see them in photobucket this morning and just checked my build thread.... Gone I had an aftermarket billet specialties stainless column and mocked up with both an fj80 and jk steering boxes, both of which are similar to the scout box.