Recent long crank starts (2 Viewers)

[highonpottery]

Looking for wisdom on possible culprits of a few recent long crank starts. It's a 2002 Cruiser, stock with just shy of 200k, due for regular service very soon. It's my wife's DD that our inlaws drive during weekdays since they watch our kids, I drive it most weekends. My wife hasn't noticed the problem before either.

First encounter: Last week I was parked in the truck with the AC on for maybe 20 min waiting for someone and for whatever reason I decided to turn it off for a little while before starting back up to move again. When I went to start it didn't fire with my normal crank duration. I tried again and it took maybe an extra 1-2 seconds to kick over and then acted fine. Thought it was weird so noted in my brain.

Second: Yesterday my wife took truck in for new tires (285 Falken AT3W) and I get a call saying they couldn't start it up to drive it out of the dock, they tried 4x and gave up, then rolled it out to the parking lot. I then spoke with my wife a few minutes later when I had time to discuss the problem and asked if SHE tried to start it up? She said no then went out and it fired up with an extra second of crank time like it did before. Everything fine since then, maybe 6 startups and acting like nothing wrong.

So just wondering what can be since this has happened twice in the last 2 weeks. No codes on my scangauge. Only other recent abnormal thing is 3 weekends ago I accidentally ran the battery down at the drive in movies because I forgot to start up the truck between features like I normally do (fell asleep -- new 5week old baby does that to you). It was enough to kick off the stereo about 3/4 the way through the 2nd movie and that's never happened before, I thought maybe the amplifier died since I still had enough juice for all my interior lights (LED though!). Neighboring vehicles were loud enough to endure the rest of the movie. Noted that I did have the stereo cranked up slightly more than usual. Didn't notice the butt warmers on or fan on or anything like that, was in ACC mode like normally do so we can adjust rear windows while laying in the back, I dunno what else. I guess I should go test the battery - it's a few years old Duralast Gold.

Any advice on what to investigate?

Edit: maybe I should swap my regular key? Read about possible immobiliser issue if key is damaged and not picking up signal. One of our keys went through laundry months ago but after battery replacement on both they've both been fine.

 

[Ninja Cruiser100]

My guess is the battery needs to be replaced. I would start there.

 

[ponytl]

i would guess you are seeing the first signs of immobilizer issues you are getting fire but no fuel you can tell if the security light on the dash is staying lit during cranking.... other option could be the prime squirt for lack of a better term when you turn the key but before the starter engages with fuel injection you get a squirt of raw fuel... ie no choke or accelerator pump you can try turning your key off and on but not engage the starter a couple times and see if that helps.... or you could just have gotten some really crappy fuel

 

[abuck99]

Battery test/electircal system test
Fuel system pressure test

 

[marshotel]

get a new battery

mine used to do what you describe, in the winter it cranked for several seconds before starting even though the battery tested fine.

I tried a new battery and it fixed the problem completely, even though the old battery tested fine.

 

[ToHiHy]

Uhm, I'd venture to say fuel pressure. Might be first signs of a weak pump.

 

[aljollano]

I would drive it to an auto parts store where they can test battery, alternator and starter with one computer just to start there and check that out of the list.
Also, the immobilizer point made above makes sense to me, make sure that the red car indicator by the stereo does not blink while you are trying to start the truck.
Keep us posted, we all like the learn around here!!

A.J

 

[2001LC]

1st: Owners manual states; Don't allow your series 100 to idle for prolonged periods, over 3 minutes is prolonged.
2nd: Weak battery will cause issues. Replace with bigger & better if you'd like to run your radio while parked.

Most importantly; congratulations on the baby!

 

[thegreatgazoo]

1st: Owners manual states; Don't allow your series 100 to idle for prolonged periods, over 3 minutes is prolonged.

Where is that in the manual? Thanks~

 

[2001LC]

Where is that in the manual? Thanks~

Page 200 of the 2001 OM. "How to save fuel and make your vehicle last longer, too."

My take from several passages: Our engine run optimally ~1,800 to 2,600 rpm. Prolonged idle tends to foul plugs & cats along with buildup carbon. Additionally forward motion helps cool the engine. Sometimes I need too idle until warmed up while working on engine, I'm always surprises at how much gas it does use during these warm up idles. Idling also builds up moisture in exhaust system.

I like getting out on the highway every now and then and really floor it, to blow out the carbon. Occasionally I'll keep transmission geared down and run at 4,800 rpm for 5 minutes, then normal rpm, then 4,800 rpm for 10 minutes. I do this to burn off carbon from combustion camber and cook residue off/out of the cats. I do these things after a treatment like SeaFoam fogging, periods of heavy traffic, slow driving or prolonged idle.

I'm not saying this is OP's only issue, but's it's where I'd start.

 

[highonpottery]

Hmm well you guys have given me some things to check out. My immediate thought was fuel - but I don't recall hearing much about fuel pump failures on our 100 series (?)
I'm leaning toward battery. It's been like 4-5yrs on this battery and so it might be due soon since it's just a Duralast gold, but those are supposed to be decent.
I will try to pay attention to the light for the immobiliser as this one also makes a lot of sense.

I have read bits of the manual but don't recall seeing the idle time. Makes sense for most vehicles sitting there for extended periods of time especially since I was idling running AC on low - had a sleeping 3yr old in the back and no shade. Was watching scan gauge the whole time and water temp was 190-192 the whole time, same as when driving for the most part.

Been driving it fine since then, even took it to SF for the day and no problems. BTW the new Falkens are like stock Michelin AT quiet vs. old Duratracs sounding like and rattling your teeth like a set of super swampers, highly recommend for those shopping for new rubber.

 

[WiscoProud]

My truck was starting slow earlier last week. Normally it would just fire up, but this took a few seconds, and as the week progressed, I could hear the starter starting to lag. On Wednesday it was completely dead. Swapped the battery and everything's back to normal.

 

[highonpottery]

Problem showed its ugly face again today. It's not the battery, it tested fine.

While sitting in the car trying to wrap my head around a Land Cruiser being brought down by electrical gremlins, I started reading more on mud about possible problems. Found a few threads about immobiliser issues and people messing with the fuse box.

Read about people having issues with the fuse box when dealing with immobiliser issues. Pulled the 20A EFI fuse next to the EFI relay and noticed when I pulled it, one prong wasn't seated correctly in the plastic (it was uneven, maybe from pulling it out). Anyways, tried to squeeze it into place and seat it properly with my Leatherman, which slightly bent the prong and so I straightened it out. Of course it will never be factory straight, so thinking this will provide some extra "bite" as it wedges into the slot on the fuse box. So anyways, once I put the 20A fuse back in it fired right up. Problem definitely related to the fuse box like many here have seen problems with. I guess it's time to start reading up about the fix. I don't want to spend $1k replacing the whole fuse box of possible.
Anyone have links to more info on this fuse box issue?

 

[SoCal Dan]

HOP- Anything further to report?

 

[BnvS]

I notice this as well.. however I suspect its the battery... i think if the battery is replace with a good one it will start right up without a worry in the world.

 

[drjman]

Problem showed its ugly face again today. It's not the battery, it tested fine.

While sitting in the car trying to wrap my head around a Land Cruiser being brought down by electrical gremlins, I started reading more on mud about possible problems. Found a few threads about immobiliser issues and people messing with the fuse box.

Read about people having issues with the fuse box when dealing with immobiliser issues. Pulled the 20A EFI fuse next to the EFI relay and noticed when I pulled it, one prong wasn't seated correctly in the plastic (it was uneven, maybe from pulling it out). Anyways, tried to squeeze it into place and seat it properly with my Leatherman, which slightly bent the prong and so I straightened it out. Of course it will never be factory straight, so thinking this will provide some extra "bite" as it wedges into the slot on the fuse box. So anyways, once I put the 20A fuse back in it fired right up. Problem definitely related to the fuse box like many here have seen problems with. I guess it's time to start reading up about the fix. I don't want to spend $1k replacing the whole fuse box of possible.
Anyone have links to more info on this fuse box issue?

I had success with bypassing the bad link in the fusebox. check these out:
fix for immobilizer issue?
My immobilizer fix

You can create a jumper wire to test before making the full fix. Jump from the hot end of the 20A fuse to the top right (drives side, towards rear) of the relay block (EFI) and start up. If it fires right away, go ahead with the fix in the second link. Keep that wire for emergencies to get you started.

 

[SoCal Dan]

Excellent. I read those threads and wondered if it might relate to your issue.

 

[a31gun]

Would hooking up a large 10 amp battery charger and trying to start engine be the same as replacing the battery before I drop the cash on an optima?

 

[2001LC]

10 amp is not that large. You'll need to clean & grease battery post and let it charge on 10 amp over night.

 

[a31gun]

Well it is currently set at 10 amps it has a 40 amp setting and the start setting as well.