Wheel Bearing; FSM Torque to Light or just Right.

[Ma son]

No typo.The IN.lbf is only a starting point. The goal is breakaway preload. When read "in that light", it becomes apparent, FSM means what it says!

A 50ft-lbf to achieve 12lb breakaway. Indicates new bearings, good grease, at ~68F.

It just seems crazy to me that as a starting point it is 40-50ftlbs from the final torque many of us, including yourself, are seeing to get the desired breakaway force on the adjustment nut. 38-57 ft•lbs seems to be a much more appropriate torque to achieve target breakaway force compared to those numbers in inch•lbs. Either way thanks for posting all your findings and numbers!

 

[2001LC]

It just seems crazy to me that as a starting point it is 40-50ftlbs from the final torque many of us, including yourself, are seeing to get the desired breakaway force on the adjustment nut. 38-57 ft•lbs seems to be a much more appropriate torque to achieve target breakaway force compared to those numbers in inch•lbs. Either way thanks for posting all your findings and numbers!

It is, a very light starting point. Which has resulted in many miss interpreting (using as goal).

I've found if torque comes in under 40ft-lbf with 12lb breakaway, indicates one of two things: Bad bearings or grease to cold.

 

[Pryorrides]

Just did Koyo bearings. 47ft lbs yielded about 12 pounds break free resistance on a luggage scale. Mobil 1 synthetic for the bearings. For the hub bushings I used Mobil Mobilith SHC 460 (nlgi 1.5). I managed to get the driveshaft snap rings to no measurable clearance on one side and .002 on the other. Used a flat nail puller to pull out the shafts, as seen in the picture.

This thread was a MASSIVE help, thank you everyone, especially @2001LC

This whole debacle has left me pondering if these vehicles tend to be wheel bearing eaters because of improper pre-load after replacement. Maybe with a mixture of lift kits and larger tires that they all seem to have now. The ones I removed had cut grooves into the thrust washers.

 

[awesomeissquid]

Middle of this job right now with new knuckles, hubs, bearings, & FDS and wanted to get some confirmation.

97F outside today so it’s a hot one.

Passenger side took 60 ft-lbs on the adjuster nut to get 13 lbf preload. This increased to 14 lbf with the locknut installed.

Driver side took 75 ft-lbs on the adjuster nut to hit 13 lbf preload. This increased to 13-1/2 lbf with the locknut torqued.

Are these torques too high for new bearings? Does this point to using too much grease within the hub? Want to avoid burning up the new components that were just installed.

Picture tax of new goodies.

 

[Ma son]

I’ve done 3 wheel bearing jobs in the last few years and all seem to fall between 45-60 ft•lbs on the adjuster nut to get a brand new set of Koyo bearings from Cruiser Outfitters to ~15 lbs breakaway. On last week’s install, I began at 5ft•lbs and increased in 5 ft•lb increments until 15lb breakaway was acheived- for science. It took 55 on the passenger side and 50 on the driver. There’s no freakin way that 15lb breakaway can be achieved using the in•lb spec in the FSM!!

 

[2001LC]

Middle of this job right now with new knuckles, hubs, bearings, & FDS and wanted to get some confirmation.

97F outside today so it’s a hot one.

Passenger side took 60 ft-lbs on the adjuster nut to get 13 lbf preload. This increased to 14 lbf with the locknut installed.

Driver side took 75 ft-lbs on the adjuster nut to hit 13 lbf preload. This increased to 13-1/2 lbf with the locknut torqued.

Are these torques too high for new bearings? Does this point to using too much grease within the hub? Want to avoid burning up the new components that were just installed.

Picture tax of new goodies.

View attachment 4180737


View attachment 4180738

I've gone as high as ~80ft-lbf.
Those wheel hubs are in great shap.

 

[awesomeissquid]

Awesome. Thanks for the confirmation Paul.

They better be for how much Toyota charges.

 

[awesomeissquid]

One other question on this. Since my torque was so high with new parts, doesn’t that mean higher torque will be required in the future once the bearings are worn in a bit?

Something just feels high about my values based on everything being new.

 

[abuck99]

I've found that starting around 25ftlbs and loosening and re-tightening the adjusting nut with each pull of the guage will get you to a lower overall torque value- like 40-45ftlbs to obtain 12-14lbf breakaway preload. Its time consuming but if youre concerned about too much torque- give that method a try.

While NGLI 2 wheel bearing grease is called for- some #2 greases impact breakaway preload better or worse during setting process.

 

[leveeguy]

Middle of this job right now with new knuckles, hubs, bearings, & FDS and wanted to get some confirmation.

97F outside today so it’s a hot one.

Passenger side took 60 ft-lbs on the adjuster nut to get 13 lbf preload. This increased to 14 lbf with the locknut installed.

Driver side took 75 ft-lbs on the adjuster nut to hit 13 lbf preload. This increased to 13-1/2 lbf with the locknut torqued.

Are these torques too high for new bearings? Does this point to using too much grease within the hub? Want to avoid burning up the new components that were just installed.

Picture tax of new goodies.

View attachment 4180737


View attachment 4180738

Just dont forget to bend the lock washer tabs over the adjuster nut AND the lock nut and your new hardware should be fine

 

[2001LC]

One other question on this. Since my torque was so high with new parts, doesn’t that mean higher torque will be required in the future once the bearings are worn in a bit?

Something just feels high about my values based on everything being new.

Yes, you will most likely see a high torque! If job was done right.

Good and well broken-in bearings. Will end up with higher torque on adjusting nut. To achieve same breakaway preload. With same grease at same temp, you saw doing outside in summer heat. Bearings in poor condition. We see a lower torque on adjusting nut. To achieve same breakaway preload.

If you check your breakaway preload, in say 2K miles. You'll find they're down, to around 8lb of pull.
Our wheel bearings like it tight. They'll always loosen. By 30K miles, they're down to about 1lb of pull on fish scale.

Had your grease and bearings, been cooler. Say with OAT of around 54F. You would have seen a lower torque, to achieve same indicated breakaway preload.

 

[OwnerCS]

I've found that starting around 25ftlbs and loosening and re-tightening the adjusting nut with each pull of the guage will get you to a lower overall torque value- like 40-45ftlbs to obtain 12-14lbf breakaway preload. Its time consuming but if youre concerned about too much torque- give that method a try.

While NGLI 2 wheel bearing grease is called for- some #2 greases impact breakaway preload better or worse during setting process.

+1 My routine exactly. My time spend cycling through the process to get a consistent reading well worth having to revisit torque later.

 

[awesomeissquid]

Yes, you will most likely see a high torque! If job was done right.

Good and well broken-in bearings. Will end up with higher torque on adjusting nut. To achieve same breakaway preload. With same grease at same temp, you saw doing outside in summer heat. Bearings in poor condition. We see a lower torque on adjusting nut. To achieve same breakaway preload.

If you check your breakaway preload, in say 2K miles. You'll find they're down, to around 8lb of pull.
Our wheel bearings like it tight. They'll always loosen. By 30K miles, they're down to about 1lb of pull on fish scale.

Had your grease and bearings, been cooler. Say with OAT of around 54F. You would have seen a lower torque, to achieve same indicated breakaway preload.

With the impacts of OAT considered, does this mean if I recheck the preload this morning when it is cooler (OAT around 60F) that my bearings will be over the FSM 9.5-15 lbf range?

If so, is that a concern?

I assume not since the FSM doesn’t specify needing to check the preload at a specific temperature. I also assume the operating temperature of the assembly is probably closer to the higher temp when I set everything up. Maybe it would mean some additional friction (wear) until they warm up but they will run tighter when warm? Maybe that is bad though.

 

[2001LC]

With the impacts of OAT considered, does this mean if I recheck the preload this morning when it is cooler (OAT around 60F) that my bearings will be over the FSM 9.5-15 lbf range?

If so, is that a concern?

I assume not since the FSM doesn’t specify needing to check the preload at a specific temperature. I also assume the operating temperature of the assembly is probably closer to the higher temp when I set everything up. Maybe it would mean some additional friction (wear) until they warm up but they will run tighter when warm? Maybe that is bad though.

Yes, it may depending on temp differanc. But don't worry about. Tighter is better.

If grease was cold. Say below 58F. Than you'd find BWPL lower as grease heats up to say 87f.