thinking about producing hj45/47 power steering kits

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orangefj45

orangefj45

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hey guys.
i have talked to a few people including a couple of other shop owners about this and there seems to be a need for a kit like this. since we never got the 2H in the USA, nevermind any of them with ps in the 40/45 series rigs, i thought maybe i ought to make a few. right now i have 2 troopies of my own along with a customers that are waiting for ps conversions. i have one of them half way done and at this point i'm trying to figure out how many people out there would be interested in a "kit' or at least the brackettry to do a ps conversion on their troopie or late pickups.


the plan right now is to go with sag style components for several reasons:
1) great performance
2) reliability
3) availability ( this one is the most important )

i am aware that i could use a mix of components from an hj60, hj45 and bj70/75 and use all oem components, but finding them here in the USA is a major pita. they can be found in australia but even then, the parts are not cheap. from what i've found out, it's about $700-800 plus shipping. this makes the sag stuff even more appealing.

making the prototypes won't be an easy task because of space limitations around the 2h engine in the 40 series frame/front sheet metal but it's far from impossible. there's not nearly the room you'd have with the 2f or a small block. the pump would have to be hung in the stock 2h location; down low on the "passenger" side. the other option would be to mount it up high on the 'driver" side but that's where the Ac pump "should" reside. since i plan on installing AC in my hj47 i need to mount my ps pump in the original location.

so please post up if you're semi-serious and interested in doing a ps swap on your rig. it'll help me get an idea of how many we'd need to make. if the # is very low, then i can just make some with the plasma cutter. but if we get quite a few people, then i can have the parts cut at the local laser cutters which would keep my time and cost down a lot.

any input/ideas/suggestions would be greatly appreciated. :beer:


georg @ valley hybrids
 
Georg:

I've thought of one as well.

I'd snap up a bracket to mount a Toyota PS Pump/reservoir to the engine up in a heartbeat. I will probably stick with Toyota parts, just because I'm a snob, but the tricky part is the pump. I've got a mini PS box, but haven't decided if I'll use it or go with the 60 series setup for mine, but the pump is (again) the part I haven't figured out yet.

I guess a saginaw pump that could be plumbed to the Toyota PS system would work as well too.

Dan
 
hey dan.
thanks for the reply. i have gone over a lot of the possible combinations in my head and the sag seems to make the most sense. i realize that some guys might not want to put domestic components on their rare rigs but they do make the most sense.

my current hj47 has 31" skinny mud terrains on it on stock cruiser disc brake wheels. right now, the tire hits the relay rod at full turn. and it's only a 31". so for me, the minitruck box is definetly out of the question.
and the tire interferrance issue is not the only reason why i don't like running the minitruck stuff. the other major concern and common issue is the fact that the TRE at the steering box (end of the relay rod) always ends up taking the most abuse and given time, will bend and fail. there's really no way to avoid this and i'm not looking to replace the relay rod end every year or even more often.
on top of that, you'd still be running the stock bell-crank which will wear out prematurely as well. it's just one more link in the chain that adds slop and possible failure.
that's why i'd rather run a scout or gm style sag box. of course, you could run an IFS or 60/62/80series ps box also. but they just don't have the power of the sag boxes..............
 
known pump "limitations" to do this conversion are mostly the physical size and location of the pump. as mentioned above, putting the pump in the oem 2H location makes the most sense in case you'd ever want to run Ac or already have it on your existing engine. i plan to run AC and PS so i pretty much have to run the PS pump in the oem location.

so that determines where the pump goes. not we have to figure out how to mount it, how to tighten the belt and what style pump can be used.

to mount the pump would take some custom brackets. that's really no big deal given that i have enough time to mock up a prototype.

tightening the belt would mostlikely be best achieved by running an adjustable tensioner pulley due to the physical space limitations. running an adjustable pump mounting bracket would be simpler but there's just not enough room between the block, the injector pump, the frame and the inner fender to allow pump movement. so the pump will have to go in a fixed bracket with a tensioner pulley on the bottom side of the belt for easiest access.

last but not least; what style pump to run. i'm bot talking about brand neame here. i'll need to figure out if we can run a single component pump or a pump with a remote reservoir. i'd rather run a pump with the can built in for simplicity's sake. also, once more, less parts and less connections means less chance for failure. but the remote reservoir pump would be a nice option to fall back upon if it get's too tight in there........
 
the troopie i'm working on right now has a 2H with a safari guard turbo. we already installed a scout sag box and steering linkage with the engine in place to make sure we had enough clearance for everything. now the engine and geartrain are out ( getting the rig ready for the bodyshop ) and i have the engine sitting out i nthe open so it'll be a lot easier to get the pump mount mocked up. of course that won't help with figuring out the frame/inner fender limitations but i do drive my Hj47 daily so it's at the shop whenever i am there. easy enough to take some measurements that way.

i think i should have a day or so during the middle of next week to do some early experimental pump mounting and will post up pics then.

if anybody else has any input, questions or concerns, please post up. i hardly have enough time to spend on this project as it is so the last thing i want to do is to have to come up with a kit only to end up making a "revised" or 2nd edition.
 
Well, i can offer my $0.02, based on my experience installing power steering into my 47.

HJ60's were imported to Canada from 1986~87, so there is a small trickle of parts available that way. My engine came out of a Canadian spec. HJ60, and came stock with the vane pump.

If you have an HJ47, you can use the early 60 series RH engine mount bracket specific to power steering installs (the same engine mounts were used between the two models for the first couple of years, though the 47 never had a p/s option). The factory bracket comes with the mounting tab for the vane pump - I wonder if it could be copied by casting?

With an HJ47, the radiator is a little wider than other 40 models, and the lower inlet neck on the radiator ends up in a position where it points directly at the vane pump pulley - that is, there is no room to fit the hose. The rad inlet neck needs to be modified; after a couple of go-rounds with a local radiator shop, I ended up with an inlet neck cranked 45˚ to the side, and rotated to the 1:00~2:00 o'clock position. That works fine.

I don't think you can get around that mod, unless you go with a different radiator set up altogether, and I'm not sure what that would be.

I think the vane pump and rad neck are the critical issues. The steering gearbox is open to many possibilities. One could put in an oem box if you can locate one (for RHD trucks, the factory did make an oem power steering gearbox that was put into FJ45's - these can be sourced occasionally from Australia), or a 60 series box (I nearly went this route myself, and by all accounts it is an excellent conversion), or a Saginaw (though that rules out the use of the pto driven winch), along with all the chassis and steering linkage modifications required for that.

In my case, I got a hold of a lightly used 2000 Bandierante power steering gearbox from TLC, complete with mounting pedestal. It bolts right in to the stock pedestal location. The head on the Bandeirante pump is pretty big, so there is not a heck of a lot of clearance around the area where the exhaust pipe connects to the manifold. I made a shield out of a spare exhaust manifold heat shield, and when a new 2.5" exhaust was installed recently, the shield got removed by the garage and the pipe wrapped for the first couple of feet in exhaust pipe heat shielding tape. That seems to be working fine so far. I run 32" tires, and no problems with power or clearance.

The other three issues for this conversion are:

-the location of the p/s reservoir (I fabricated a bracket and mounted it on the LH inner fender). There are not a lot of options for position in an HJ47 set up, given the location of the battery and air cleaner.
-the steering column needs modification, regardless of which conversion you do.
-the hi pressure line needs to be made up or sourced. I have a left hand drive 47, and by luck I found that an HJ60 high pressure line could be re-bent so as to fit quite well, and has the correct fittings at each end, so that's what i went with.
 
thanks for all the info henry!!! i really appreciate it.

i know that the hj60s were brought into canada for a couple of years. after talking to a few of buddies up there it became very evident that finding the parts in canada would not be simple, so australia was the next best place to look. seems the parts are a lot more common down there but the cost of the parts, the weak dollar and shipping make them almost prohibitively expensive. that was another reason for me wanting to use domestic components.

i was aware of the radiator mod but did'nt mention it. i guess i should have.

most of the hj45s and hj47s down here in the states are imported from australia and new zealand so they're all RHD. there are a few LHD units in the country as well.

running the sag box on a RHD model will not cause any clearance issues with the factory pto. i have a pto take-off for my split case and want to run the factory pto on my troopie. so i guess i should start installing it to avoid any possible clearance issues with future projects.........

i had planned on having to have to high pressure line made by a local shop. should'nt be a big deal as long as i can source the fittings. using the domestic pump and box should make this very simple.

would you mind posting some pics of your ps pump mount, the pump and the resercoir?

thanks also for the heads-up on the engine mounting bracket.
 
TJDivs troopy has AC. The pump was mounted on the exhaust side up high. I will have him take some pics of the mounting bracket used. Not sure if it helps, but might give you an idea of how to mount a pump.

edit: Found a crappy pic


PICT0005~0.JPG
 
thanks for the pic rod. that AC mounting bracket does not look oem judging by the flat plate used along with the welded on spacers.

iron giant has a high-roof hj61 with a 12ht in it. he's gonna take some pics of his setup and will be here with them tomorrow. it'll be good to have them for referrence.
 
Hey Georg

Great idea. That's the route (Sag) I was going to go after pricing the stock stuff from Oz. I'd be interested in one for the H in my 45. Let me know.

Thanks for doing This.
 
ok, so here's the plan. i need to finish one of the ps conversions so i will go ahead and re-install the turbo'd 2H into the hj47 at the shop. there's no front sheet metal on the rig right now which should make mock-up a lot easier.

i will post pics and info when i have some......;)
 
I'd be interested in a saginaw setup. After putting the toyota minitruck power steering on my 55 and taking it off because it didn't have any balls, I am much happier with the saginaw pump and scout box now. I would like to do it once this time on my hj47 :grinpimp: - put me down for a kit ponytail boy....


bk
 
I have a 47 coming in and would possibly be interested in a set. i was planning a 60 series box conversion. I'll be watching this thread.
 
bull said:
Georg

I sent TJDIV a mail to post up pics of the aftermarket ac bracket and belt tensioner. Hopefully he will get off his lazy ass and take some pics.
Click to expand...

my ears were ringing, then I found this thread.

camera, check; troopy, check; ambition........
 
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