Look what I found.... 1961 FJ40 FST
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- #102
would be a good look thats for sure! my understanding is that many old 20s tourers got cut down into utes in these parts because a 'commercial' vehicle received a greater petrol ration during the war. thanks for that.
anyways been away most of a week but got back today and had a play. in the fading light put shorty on the 'hoist'!
grainy old pic. got the rear drum locating screws out without trouble. gotta love heat. rear drums are very stuck so they got another lube and flog with copper hammer. i know without even trying the wheel cylinder adjusters are just going to laugh at me. if these drums give much trouble thinking to pull axles and drums as one piece and seperate them on the bench; gonna look in this diff anyways. perhaps undo the hard lines, cylinder mounting bolts and let the brakes sorta fall apart. pondering. so to this end threw some heat at the front brakes. i have worked on many old cars but this is the rustiest most seized up thing i have ever tackled. im looking at it in a 'challenge accepted' frame of mind.
also took wire wheel to the rusty loose second gear i found then called it a night. numbers match with your post mr hdjating so think i on track here. probably going to source a less pitted example but that should not be too much trouble; bound to have one here in a junker box just gotta dismantle.
anyways been away most of a week but got back today and had a play. in the fading light put shorty on the 'hoist'!
grainy old pic. got the rear drum locating screws out without trouble. gotta love heat. rear drums are very stuck so they got another lube and flog with copper hammer. i know without even trying the wheel cylinder adjusters are just going to laugh at me. if these drums give much trouble thinking to pull axles and drums as one piece and seperate them on the bench; gonna look in this diff anyways. perhaps undo the hard lines, cylinder mounting bolts and let the brakes sorta fall apart. pondering. so to this end threw some heat at the front brakes. i have worked on many old cars but this is the rustiest most seized up thing i have ever tackled. im looking at it in a 'challenge accepted' frame of mind.
also took wire wheel to the rusty loose second gear i found then called it a night. numbers match with your post mr hdjating so think i on track here. probably going to source a less pitted example but that should not be too much trouble; bound to have one here in a junker box just gotta dismantle.
- Thread starter
- #103
had a little play. got stuck into the chassis and body with the water spit and got all as clean as i can; probably as good as its ever going to get anyways! now it can all bake dry in the sun for a few weeks. with more heat and patience managed to get one rear brake apart. undid the hard lines in middle of diff housing, undid union bolts and wheel cylinder bolts and let wheel cylinders shoes etc all come as one piece. the drums have teq stamping on them. and plenty of meat on this drum; its good to go with or without a light skim. thinking it is all the same as my 64 but havent compared much yet. years since i played with that; seem to remember a different left and right wheel cylinders and a whole lot of boredom finding 8 serviceable cyls that would take a hone. anyways sure i make it work; if this stuff is pretty generic there prob no need to throw money at it like a did my 25. even these old shoes may do another turn for the experiment at hand; thats all an easy fix in the future once everything is unsiezed. certainly looking forward to some assembly! these drums may well go back on empty backing plates and run front brakes only for what it is.
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- #104
found a few bits of green paint on the chassis which really intrigued me but also some telltale paint on steering rubbers so reckon this has been resprayed at some point. was prob black rims; as mentioned a loose 5th rim i found on the same farm dump was black.
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- #105
another play; got most the brakes apart. all original drums; they have a date code cast into them. a mixed bag 17nov60, 19nov60 and 2x 7dec60. sorta noticed this on stablemate 25 though they were matching numbers front and matching rear. different drums front to back on 25 so didnt think enough about it to make the date code assumption. fronts were 17feb60 forget the rear.
pulled wheel cylinders to get the front drums off. pretty messy in there; old riveted pads.
all hardlines at every wheel dont want to give but undid the front lines where flexible meets hardline in the engine bay. i gonna pull brake backing plates to get the wheel cyls out and hardlines as one piece. dont want to break anything till i sure i got replacements. then will slap backing plates and wheel bearings back together to keep it a roller and delve deeper into front axle down the track. gave up in the fading light; had a beer and pondered, then decided to throw some gentle heat at the bolts that hold the wiring terminal blocks to the inner guard. was pleasantly surprised to find they are bolts and nuts (like my 25) not blind bolts. the geek in me had to go check my 62 bones; that is blind bolts. interesting hey
pulled wheel cylinders to get the front drums off. pretty messy in there; old riveted pads.
all hardlines at every wheel dont want to give but undid the front lines where flexible meets hardline in the engine bay. i gonna pull brake backing plates to get the wheel cyls out and hardlines as one piece. dont want to break anything till i sure i got replacements. then will slap backing plates and wheel bearings back together to keep it a roller and delve deeper into front axle down the track. gave up in the fading light; had a beer and pondered, then decided to throw some gentle heat at the bolts that hold the wiring terminal blocks to the inner guard. was pleasantly surprised to find they are bolts and nuts (like my 25) not blind bolts. the geek in me had to go check my 62 bones; that is blind bolts. interesting hey
Loving it Henry!!!
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- #107
got last of the brakes apart. still need to ply the hardlines with some heat in the vice and see what i can salvage. the tins you see with the foil tops are all the wheel cyls soaking in some old diesel. anyways plenty i can go on with now in the shed under lights of an evening. next out is master cyls but already cracked all these some time ago so should be no problem.
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- #108
another tinker. master cyls out. bib bolts heated and cracked and bezel bolts heated again. i already broke one bezel screw (and there is i po broken one). bezel and bonnet hinge; thats 2 ive broken so far! got the oxy 'torch' out and heated plenty; all spring hangers, u bolts and much steering stuff. how excited i am going to get with any of this is somewhat debatable but be nice to at least undo each nut individually, clean threads and reinstall with anti sieze. hardest part will be getting the castle nut split pins out; also being careful not to melt splitpins while heating. tackled wheel cyls. got end piece, circlip etc apart but didnt force pistons yet; left soaking in diesel. one tin reservoir salvagable but other solderable. (nothing but nothing cruiser gets discarded under my watch!) also gave a donor mc i had (with nice tin reservoir) the same treatment. heat and diesel. steady progress.
- Thread starter
- #109
meant tackled master cyls in above thread. anyways played with a few wheel clys tonight; tackled the front as they seemed most lubricated (with gear oil). these things are SOLID. got most of one wheel apart but cannot get the pistons to budge yet. my main method has been a short piece of broomstick using the vice as a press. pretty heavy on the vice handle but no result; in the end threw all back in diesel and had another beer.
anyways a question. these 61 wheel clys are 1". fj25 are 1' also but different (from memory they have 2 not 4 bolts locating the cly to the back plate). this morning i dug through the tub of leftover oddments from doing brakes on my 64. these 64 era wheel cyls are 1 1/8". i gather some later cyls are 1 1/4". anyone know when these changes occurred? ie. 1 to 1 1/8 to 1 1/4" ?? i quickly offered a 1 1/8 cly up to the 61 and sure it will take it no worries; but the geek in me would be very pleased with 1"! thats why i am being so precious with the pistons.
anyways a question. these 61 wheel clys are 1". fj25 are 1' also but different (from memory they have 2 not 4 bolts locating the cly to the back plate). this morning i dug through the tub of leftover oddments from doing brakes on my 64. these 64 era wheel cyls are 1 1/8". i gather some later cyls are 1 1/4". anyone know when these changes occurred? ie. 1 to 1 1/8 to 1 1/4" ?? i quickly offered a 1 1/8 cly up to the 61 and sure it will take it no worries; but the geek in me would be very pleased with 1"! thats why i am being so precious with the pistons.
- Thread starter
- #110
tinkering away. slowly getting the wheel cyls apart; got most of them now. lots of patience mixed with heat, diesel and copper hammer. and time. still interested to know when they changed from 1" to 1 1/8". mostly i have managed to get one end out, soak and pry out the internals and use serious heat on the remaining end. being careful not to heat too much with the hard plastic piece that locates the bucket onto the spring inside. getting there slowly. once all apart then will do a big clean up/hone and see what i have left.
- Thread starter
- #111
has taken time and patience but all 8 wheel cyls fully apart; got all the bleed screws cracked tonight was the last bit. still need to see what i can salvage from the hard lines.
anyways what i found was thus; fronts (with the single bucket) are 1 1'8". rears (with the 2 buckets) are 1". the 'adjuster' pistons are 1" on all 4 wheels. believe my 64 era stuff was 1 1/8" all round; buckets and adjusters, so this makes this 61 era stuff a bit of a short lived oddity and this interests me. thoughts anyone? living in the past, mr hdjtachtig, nuclearlemon, old red, and etc?
havent cleaned these cyls up fully yet but they look promising enough with a little love. if they are unique enough?? might even consider some stainless sleeving if need be. would give me the thrill of financial commitment; have avoided it thus far. reckon the later 1 1/8 cyls will bolt right up though. but all that might have to wait a little because in a few days punters i am off to ireland for a couple weeks to drink pints of the black stuff at my mates wedding. 13 years (doesnt feel like it) since i've been in that part of the world; guess time flies when you're having fun! (and i am)
anyways what i found was thus; fronts (with the single bucket) are 1 1'8". rears (with the 2 buckets) are 1". the 'adjuster' pistons are 1" on all 4 wheels. believe my 64 era stuff was 1 1/8" all round; buckets and adjusters, so this makes this 61 era stuff a bit of a short lived oddity and this interests me. thoughts anyone? living in the past, mr hdjtachtig, nuclearlemon, old red, and etc?
havent cleaned these cyls up fully yet but they look promising enough with a little love. if they are unique enough?? might even consider some stainless sleeving if need be. would give me the thrill of financial commitment; have avoided it thus far. reckon the later 1 1/8 cyls will bolt right up though. but all that might have to wait a little because in a few days punters i am off to ireland for a couple weeks to drink pints of the black stuff at my mates wedding. 13 years (doesnt feel like it) since i've been in that part of the world; guess time flies when you're having fun! (and i am)
I am curious myself and have been following along with your 1-1/8" vs. 1" bore discovery. But unfortunately I can't take any actual measurements right now, west aussie. I am currently 4000 miles away from my '61.
I do have with me the same Feb. 1961 parts book that a few others here have as well, though. So if you can find numbers on any of your cylinders and want me to compare those to the original numbers listed in the book I am happy to do that if you would like.
Just a quick look at the book indicates that the "cup kit" for the front and rear had different prefixes: RK95 476-11 for the front and RK45 476-11 for the rear---if that means anything to you.
Enjoy your pints.
I do have with me the same Feb. 1961 parts book that a few others here have as well, though. So if you can find numbers on any of your cylinders and want me to compare those to the original numbers listed in the book I am happy to do that if you would like.
Just a quick look at the book indicates that the "cup kit" for the front and rear had different prefixes: RK95 476-11 for the front and RK45 476-11 for the rear---if that means anything to you.
Enjoy your pints.
I had to dig in my memory and in the box with old parts. Back then I was helped with partnumbers by LITP:
These rear numbers for the '62 are different then yours old red
The dealer wasn't able to help me with these numbers. I found a note of the partnumbers I have used: For the rear I bought 4x 04473-60010 on ebay. Not OEM but aftermarket. Tokico IIRC. I also found some of the old cups in the old parts box. Those are definetely 1". These sets seems still available at that e-bayshop GWS rareparts: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Toyota-04473-60010-60-70-LandCruiser-FJ40-Rr-W-Cyl-Kits-/380332676044.
For the front I contacted L&L landcruisers, a landcruiser specialist in Holland. They sent me a kit 04905-35042 and that one kit was complete for the front axle, for all four cylinders. I couldn't find old parts of the front cylinders. On Internet I found this partnr. refers to 1 1/8" kits. On toyodiy I find this kit refers to late 40's. Anyway we used it and it fitted.
When I look on toyodiy for a '69 and I google the partnr. of a rear cylinder it pops up as a 1" also. So I think you might be wrong in your rear cylinders for the '64, or the the '64 is the odd one, or they may use different rear cylinders for UTE's and "shorties"...
hmmm. Now that I am writing this I'm thinking that makes sense. The UTE's regularly have more load on the rear and you might want more brake force there. Which can be achieved with larger cylinders. Toyodiy tells different partnrs. for FJ40's and FJ43-45-55 (in '69) but can't tell the size from the numbers. (I don't have the 65 partsbook here now).
Anyway, I found these old pics of our brake assemblies:
These rear numbers for the '62 are different then yours old red
The dealer wasn't able to help me with these numbers. I found a note of the partnumbers I have used: For the rear I bought 4x 04473-60010 on ebay. Not OEM but aftermarket. Tokico IIRC. I also found some of the old cups in the old parts box. Those are definetely 1". These sets seems still available at that e-bayshop GWS rareparts: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Toyota-04473-60010-60-70-LandCruiser-FJ40-Rr-W-Cyl-Kits-/380332676044.
For the front I contacted L&L landcruisers, a landcruiser specialist in Holland. They sent me a kit 04905-35042 and that one kit was complete for the front axle, for all four cylinders. I couldn't find old parts of the front cylinders. On Internet I found this partnr. refers to 1 1/8" kits. On toyodiy I find this kit refers to late 40's. Anyway we used it and it fitted.
When I look on toyodiy for a '69 and I google the partnr. of a rear cylinder it pops up as a 1" also. So I think you might be wrong in your rear cylinders for the '64, or the the '64 is the odd one, or they may use different rear cylinders for UTE's and "shorties"...
hmmm. Now that I am writing this I'm thinking that makes sense. The UTE's regularly have more load on the rear and you might want more brake force there. Which can be achieved with larger cylinders. Toyodiy tells different partnrs. for FJ40's and FJ43-45-55 (in '69) but can't tell the size from the numbers. (I don't have the 65 partsbook here now).
Anyway, I found these old pics of our brake assemblies:
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- #114
thanks for your thoughts. i had never considered 40 and 45 to be different; is very plausible. i am waiting to see what andy budge finds when he tears his apart. havent honed my cys out yet but they are all apart. will prob just improvise with some loose buckets and boots from my local brake shop; i have always found perth brake parts good to deal with. they remanufactered the original shoes, skimmed drums, supplied kits and did a mc stainless sleeve on my 25 project stablemate at very fair pricing. have had one quote for new shoes at $90 an axle but havent shopped around much further yet. had a play with the wheel end hardlines with heat and vice but will be unable to salvage much of this. presuming i will have something 45 in my parts stash that will do the job and meet budget. cant wait for some sort of reassembly!
in the meantime project shorty is waiting patiently on the 'hoist' while im off to drink some pints of black stuff for a couple weeks.
in the meantime project shorty is waiting patiently on the 'hoist' while im off to drink some pints of black stuff for a couple weeks.
Good to see you are still pluging on with it. Sorry I didn't get time to get those kits away before I went to the NT.
JohnnyC
Long ago TLCA# 2231
Love the truck up on drums !!!
That is now one of my favorite pics
That is now one of my favorite pics
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Jesus west how the hell did I miss this thread? Just read it all in one sitting. Well done and the hen's teeth sure went to the right man. I love it, the patina, the story, the price and the help from 'Mud. I really dig your plans to save it as stock as possible on a zero dollar budget. My plans are the same with my '69. I see you've got a grader in the background there? Is she an open cab model? Also, I bought a dash cut from a '64 40 that I was always going to donate to you and now your new toy has given me the hurry up. I'll get your address and send it all over. As for the brake bore differences well my '69 has 1 1/8" bores on all four corners, TEQ stamped. Not much but it's all I've got. Love the property too by the way! And the humpy and the early 45 [FJ28??]!!
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- #118
g'day punters. back home and in the final stages of sobering up. had a ball of course. thanks for the comments.
aussie 25 - no stress on the parts; might get away with what i got but still happy to buy those parts from you. think you mentioned once you may have an early horn relay available also. need one of some sort for my 25. the early ones seem to vary a bit. dont think the coverless one on my 25 is original; think its about 65 era.
johnnyc - had a few passersby comment on my 'hoist' haha. myself i think it will look better with swivel bearings and brakes finished and back on the ground as a roller!
cult45 - more rust than patina! grader is cab model. cat 12g not sure what year. that probably my 25 project stablemate in the background. the 'humpy' is an english ford pilot from about 48-50. made in england using pre war american tooling and the earlier variant of the ford sidevalve v8 with 21 head bolts and the crab dizzy. its a real backburner project but i slowly finding much of the missing componants. a battered example but absolutely rust free; would make a nice rat i reckon.
anyways had to blast through perth without catching the shops; need to buy swivel kit and brake parts and start assembling a few things. a couple questions:
without having done research; is the swivel kit pretty generic with early 40 series kits? or is there some 25 uniqueness?
also, this solid column shift assembly is going to be a complete pita. and cant find another one anywhere yet. if i really cant get it apart i am wondering on the possibilities of using a lhd one. wonder if it possible to dismantle and reassemble inverted. still trying to figure a plan. but my question is; anydody had one of these apart? or can direct me to a thread where someone has? this is the last major sticking point i think. reckon ive got a plan for most other things.
aussie 25 - no stress on the parts; might get away with what i got but still happy to buy those parts from you. think you mentioned once you may have an early horn relay available also. need one of some sort for my 25. the early ones seem to vary a bit. dont think the coverless one on my 25 is original; think its about 65 era.
johnnyc - had a few passersby comment on my 'hoist' haha. myself i think it will look better with swivel bearings and brakes finished and back on the ground as a roller!
cult45 - more rust than patina! grader is cab model. cat 12g not sure what year. that probably my 25 project stablemate in the background. the 'humpy' is an english ford pilot from about 48-50. made in england using pre war american tooling and the earlier variant of the ford sidevalve v8 with 21 head bolts and the crab dizzy. its a real backburner project but i slowly finding much of the missing componants. a battered example but absolutely rust free; would make a nice rat i reckon.
anyways had to blast through perth without catching the shops; need to buy swivel kit and brake parts and start assembling a few things. a couple questions:
without having done research; is the swivel kit pretty generic with early 40 series kits? or is there some 25 uniqueness?
also, this solid column shift assembly is going to be a complete pita. and cant find another one anywhere yet. if i really cant get it apart i am wondering on the possibilities of using a lhd one. wonder if it possible to dismantle and reassemble inverted. still trying to figure a plan. but my question is; anydody had one of these apart? or can direct me to a thread where someone has? this is the last major sticking point i think. reckon ive got a plan for most other things.
Good to hear you had a good time. On the swivel kit get the earlest onr you can find. There is a bit of a wrecking yard up here in the compound, 3 Hzj 75 utes, 2 Hj75 utes, 3 Hzj 78 troopies and 3 mid 70s fj40s converted to bull chasers and 1 hj 45 ute and 1 hj 47 . But not a rear hub or rear dill in any.
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Check out coolerman's website re: early brakes. Very detailed.
http://www.globalsoftware-inc.com/coolerman/fj40/15B.htm
http://www.globalsoftware-inc.com/coolerman/fj40/15B.htm
