I'm just going to say it

SNLC

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Thats my old 4runner in the back of the 3rd pic :p


1st gen Mini truck you mean? ;)


I am building an 80 for pretty good sized rocks. I will drive it to the trail though. 37's or 40's. I will stick with Toyota axles although making some upgrades here and there. It has lost a lot of body though since it is being cut into a pickup.

Cheers
 
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1st gen Mini truck you mean? ;)


I am building an 80 for pretty good sized rocks. I will drive it to the trail though. 37's or 40's. I will stick with Toyota axles although making some upgrades here and there. It has lost a lot of body though since it is being cut into a pickup.

Cheers

That one was a 4runner, just no top, doors, glass, tailgate, fenders, straight body panels etc... You know, a crawler :rofl:

The biggest beef I have with toy axles is the 8" 3rd. I have blown up more zuk built cryoed high pinion gear sets than I can remember. And those were all in rigs that weigh a ton or more less than an 80. The pickup conversion will get rid of a good chunk of weight, just be carful in reverse - thats where they go.

I'm going to do 37's on my 80 next time around, but 37's only measure out to 35" so it will be fine... haha
 

Ozark Bushwalker

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Random Jeep bashing:

A friend has a JK. I tried to help him recently with a breakdown where the vehicle went into limp mode.

At first, it appeared (from OBD2) that it was the crank position sensor. We verified 5V to the sensor and replaced it. No change. Another OBD2 error was the EGR valve, but no biggie so we didn't worry about it. It gets towed to the Jeep dealership where it sits for over a week because they don't have enough techs.

After a thousand dollars to replace some harness running to the transmission, he gets it back. A week later he's stranded again. It gets towed back to the dealership, where it sits for over two weeks before anyone can even look at it.

This time they replaced the EGR sensor. Turns out that was the problem all along. With CANBUS, all the sensors we were dealing with are on one 5V loop. One piece goes bad and you lose everything. In this case, the EGR sensor had an intermittent fault that was randomly disabling the entire vehicle.

So, this is really more of a rant about modern vehicles. I'll happily take my '94 Land Cruiser to remote places. It's mechanically sound (unlike Jeep transmissions and transfer cases) and if something electronic goes bad it won't take the entire rest of the system with it.

Incidentally, while trying to research the problems he was having, I discovered that the later (3.6?) engines have problems with their cam position sensors. Why? Because a couple of bolts often back out over time, causing oil to leak past them, interfering with the function of the sensors. A dumb design that would have been fixed with some loc-tite at the factory.


I'll never understand why Toyota didn't release an up-sized, modern 40 series in the last decade. It would have sold like mad in the US market.

Anyway, if I wanted a disposable, reasonably capable all-purpose vehicle with a ton of bolt-on aftermarket support, a Wrangler would be it. But I'd sell it by 70k miles.
As I understand it the older TJs and XJs with the 4.0 are really solid. The Dana 30s aren’t amazing but the XJs have AISIN transmissions which are fairly stout. It seems like the JKs took a big step down in quality.
 
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This is one of the dumbest arguments I have heard in 10 years of being on mud....

Rubicons are not rock crawlers, neither are 80's.. or 40's, 55's, 60', cj3's, cj5's, wagoneer's etc. If you want to build one or the other into an actual crawler, you will end up with the same axles, suspension and transfer case under either (if you are smart about it).

You can put a ton of money into toyota or rubicon axles and make them decent, but they still aren't 1 tons. I know, I have a diamond front with a 9.5 center, hellfire knuckles, rcv's, 32 spline shafts and arp hardware. Its the best you can do staying all toyota, but its no dana 60. Neither is a dana 44.
You have 32 spline axles going to your birfields?
 
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You have 32 spline axles going to your birfields?
Yep, 200 series 3rds with ARB RD152's front and rear. The ring gear is about 2x thicker and the pinion is 32 spline vs the earlier 27 spline. Much stronger than the 80 series and older 9.5's.

The shafts neck down to 30 spline at the birf, but being 32 spline at the diff and a 34.8mm (vs 33mm for 30 spline) shaft they wont twist splines at the diff as easy. Done that before too...
 
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Yep, 200 series 3rds with ARB RD152's front and rear. The ring gear is about 2x thicker and the pinion is 32 spline vs the earlier 27 spline. Much stronger than the 80 series and older 9.5's.

The shafts neck down to 30 spline at the birf, but being 32 spline at the diff and a 34.8mm (vs 33mm for 30 spline) shaft they wont twist splines at the diff as easy. Done that before too...
Who made the axlehafts?
 
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The 80 in stock form is a very robust platform. I wish Toyota would build a new FJ with solid front/rear, lockers and sway bar disconnects. However, a stock rubicon is about as off-road worthy as it gets. Toyota seems intent to dummy down new versions of their 4wd vehicles and it's a shame. The new Tundra doesn't even have recovery hooks on the front. Not sure who the genius was who decided that. They save all the good stuff for Australia and the middle east.
 

LandLocked93

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So 4 pages in, is it too late to posit - that strictly speaking - every vehicle which can achieve 'full spool' is equal in capability.
It's versatility after that. And this dictates a persons choice over anything else imo.
 
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As I understand it the older TJs and XJs with the 4.0 are really solid. The Dana 30s aren’t amazing but the XJs have AISIN transmissions which are fairly stout. It seems like the JKs took a big step down in quality.
In one of Matt’s Off-Road recovery vids I watched recently he said to the viewers all you need is an XJ on 31s and you can do 90% of the trails there. Also been binge watching 4WD/24/7 and am very impressed. Doubt very much any type of Jeep (stk or modded) would survive any of their trips in one piece.
 

Ozark Bushwalker

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In one of Matt’s Off-Road recovery vids I watched recently he said to the viewers all you need is an XJ on 31s and you can do 90% of the trails there. Also been binge watching 4WD/24/7 and am very impressed. Doubt very much any type of Jeep (stk or modded) would survive any of their trips in one piece.
Well I don’t know how a Jeep would do. But people love to talk about how crappy early Land Rover Discoveries are, when they seemed to do pretty well in the Camel Trophy.

And as great as they are, it’s not like Toyotas don’t break either. The guys on 4wd-247 have a lot of sponsors so they be an afford costly sets of spare parts and expensive recoveries, so they always end up making it through sone situations which would leave others stranded, no matter what brand their rig is. In fact I remember one episode where the hub completely comes apart on Shauno's 80 series. It'd be very easy to be caught unprepared for something like that out in the bush.
 
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My Jeep group just finished Barrett Lake, Rubicon and Sierra Trek this year, 9 jeeps with only 1 minor trail repair, while my other Yota group with 7 80 series doing just the Rubicon this past weekend and had 12 breakdowns total. Broken track bar, smashed gas tank/fuel delivery issues, punctured brakelines, broken front axles, ball joints, snapped rear axle flange bolts, and bent rear drive shaft.....and i guaranteed you the Jeeps guy are taking way harder lines granted most of them on 40s and 37s w/ V8 swaps
I tend to doubt an 80 series broke a ball joint
 
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all you need is an XJ on 31s and you can do 90% of the trails there

XJ's have the advantage of being really light compared to 80s and virtually everything modern.

1997 XJ 3,183 Lbs
1997 TJ 3,229 Lbs
Jeep JK 3,879 - 4,132 Lbs
1997 Land Cruiser 4,751 Lbs
2014 4Runner 4,400 - 4,805 Lbs

Those numbers were all pulled from Google by searching for curb weights. I don't even know how the TJ is heavier than the XJ. Both were pulled from Edmunds.

My parents had a later model XJ. I hated driving the thing. The short wheelbase made it bouncy and darty on the highway, and the part-time drivetrain felt awful in lousy weather compared to my full-time ZJ. But that thing was surprisingly quick.
 
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I’ve had two XJs, and personally, loved them. The 80 is a totally different machine, and I don’t know if I could go back (or away from Toyota period), and don’t want to anyway. One was a stock 88, the other was an 01 & I just did a mild lift with 31s - it drove great. TJ might be heavier because it’s body on frame? Not sure

I would never own a Jeep without a straight 6. I admit I also have nostalgia from my dad’s CJ that he rebuilt from the ground up. But, we’s a Toyota family now. I have more nostalgia from his 22re pickup.

Oops...

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As for the 80, I joke that I have no business owning one. There’s no offroading here - not even trails for camping. Terrain is too gnarly & covered in the thick tongass forest, steep mountains coming directly out of the ocean no matter where you are. You can hop on the ferry to Haines where there are a few fun options, but that gets expensive real quick. That said, at the end of the day it’s a great Toyota truck. I look forward to every drive, I love tinkering & being its caretaker, it’s continued to teach me, and it just feels damn good to be in it. Absolutely chomps all the snow & nasty weather we get.

I also got it for a good price, not rusty & was cared for, half the baselining done, so it hasn’t been hard nor overly expensive considering how it can be. That said, there’s always something.
 
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TheRealDeal124

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I owned an 06 LJ Rubicon with 315s and quick disconnects and it was point and shoot. Never gave me any problems as far as trail use was concerned. Only bad thing about that sweet 103.4" wheelbase is the rear liked to drag, so I installed a 32 gallon Genright Safari fuel tank with the skid plate along with an ARB tire carrier. I built that Jeep from stock with 21,000 miles. Stock gears are 4.11, I put 5.13s in but never got to wheel with them. Transmission sucked, and I hoped that the Oil Pump Drive Assembly wouldn't start laughing at me, or the PCM wouldn't take a dump and leave me with a paperweight 4x4.

I can't comment on wheeling an 80 series but I could imagine it being a very similar experience except maybe the 80 being a bit wider than the Jeep. To me the biggest difference in vehicle capability is the driver.

The 80 is a world class vehicle, and the LJ is a third or fourth vehicle much like a boat, that should be used just for fun. The plastic AT shifter bushing went out on me in the McDonald's drive thru the morning before a wheeling trip, the throttle cable was stuck open (that was a fun one), I could never get the CEL to go away despite hundreds in repairs, hell it chimed on me before I brought it home for the first time. I'd have to tighten the tilt lever every other day as it'd loosen just driving down the road. I do miss it, but not enough to buy another. I had a lot of fun building and wheeling it though. She was a head turner.

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I don't care what anybody says or thinks. Samurais are the real trail heroes!
1986_Suzuki_Samurai_Cat.jpg
I do like those little guys. Local friend has two he built. The white one was a recent pickup that had been used at an off-grid island cabin. Toyota axles!

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And they’re good for pulling out stuck jeeps

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Re: my last post - should have said there’s no *legal* offroading other than a couple areas for quads. We have a select few micro-spots that are accessible, but don’t think I’d take a larger rig.
 
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Dave 2000

Not all Land Rovers are useless!
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I too have owned a range of vehicles and my 80 is the longest owned of any of them now approaching 12 years, all stock suspension/tyres and so forth apart from obvious mods i.e. electric engine cooling fan so dumping the viscous unit, larger alternator and conversion from 24v start to 12v, it just goes wherever I point it.

80 With views..jpg


Regards

Dave
 
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I would be lying if I said I never considered buying a Samurai tin top.
 

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