High steer, slee vs hellfire, Hydro assist. (1 Viewer)

[Wermz]

This may be long winded but i have a hard time finding a great thread on all of this information. Id love for this to become the @GW Nugget shock/spring thread, but for all things high steering setups. Here we go.

Ok, i know theres a couple of you with slee high steer arms on your knuckles, and a few of you with hellfire knuckles. Obviously the hf are better, no question. Id hate to say price is no issue but it kinda always is, however i was on a list for $1100 hf knucks and when my allocation came up ready, i passed due to spending all my toy money elsewhere, budgeting is so bittersweet.

First we talk Slee high steer arms.

I deleted abs and already have a rhd lower are on my truck, no need to point those out. Who is running slee arms? Do they seem strong enough, do they line up properly, did you actually weld in the bung like youre supposed to or are you just running on the two upper studs? 3/4” or 7/8” bolts? What else are you running in your high steer setup? Please post good pictures with good information and opinions.

Hellfire knuckle discussion time.

I know theyre stout, like i said i almost bought them. Are there any unexpected down sides? I keep looking at @jcardona1 truck, but i know theres more of you out there, anything you can report good or bad, please post it, pictures included.

Now lets talk panhard relocation. Higher steer angle means moving the panhard bar angle to match or being happy with bump steer, which nobody will be. How are we doing this, lowering frame side, raising axle side(seems like a better move). Anybody make a emikeith or delta style mount for the front axle? im also not afraid of a custom build. Pictures and technical information please.

Thanks gentlemen!

 

[jcardona1]

There's also finally a new player in the high steer knuckle game: FJ80 High Steer Knuckle Kit - https://frontrangeoffroadfab.com/fj80-high-steer-knuckle-kit/

Hellfires are great. I have the originals made by Billy before he sold the brand to RuffStuff. Nothing bad to say about 'em. One nice benefit is that you may never have to worry about loose knuckle studs every again since you no longer have any leverage on the lower trunion. Mine have been installed since 2015 and have never loosened up after lots of hard wheeling.

I personally had 2 buddies with the Slee high steer, both have since sold their rigs though. One was 3 linked on coilovers, the other was all stock suspension.

One important thing to keep in mind - obviously you know you'll need to raise and relocate the panhard. But if you're keeping the coil springs and not running coilovers, there is basically no room to raise the panhard. You can't raise it in its original position because of the coil springs and interference with the tierod/draglink. The only option is to shorten it by quite a bit and relocate it in between the coil spring and diff housing. This is not really ideal because of how short the panhard becomes, you want this as long as possible, ideally going to the very end of the axle. Doing high steer with coil springs becomes very difficult because of the space constraints.

Here is the one with Slee high steer/3link/coilovers. Notice how easy it is to raise and relocate the pandhard because of the coilovers.

My other buddy did Slee high steer but with stock coil springs and radius arms. You can see how short the panhard is. Because of the space taken up by the coil springs, this is really the only place where you could put a raised panhard.

 

[Wermz]

I knew you were the right guy to tag in this thread, thank you. Im thinking about doing “front steer” temporarily, same setup as those two trucks without the slee arms, single sheer, like stock, but much stronger rods. Then i though i should put some slee arms on just in case. $600 for the slee or twice the price for better hf knucks, seems like itll put me right back on the wait list. I keep going in these circles. Im glad to see a new product, i like frontrange stuff, ive ordered a few things from them, good service too. I just stuck 40s on my truck and theyre way too big to wheel with right now, not to mention the steering will buckle, or bend the front axle housing. Im doing a 3 link at some point, but for now im sticking with trailing arms and the lift parts i just ordered. Ill probably weld on a truss on the truck, carefully. It looks like the second truck the panhard was moved a bit rearward, towards the center of the spring(not totally, but some) i wonder if it could move a bit forward to clear the spring, but then it might interfere with the steering… there are way fewer 3link/highsteer/coilover trucks than there are 3” lift on 35s. I felt we needed a thread about this.

 

[Wermz]

i just ordered a 7/8" heim steering kit from ruff stuff, we'll see how that goes single sheer on the front of the axle, then ill decide if its slee, hf, or front range.

im also going in do some "configuring" to see if i can raise that panhard and keep it full length.

 

[jcardona1]

i just ordered a 7/8" heim steering kit from ruff stuff, we'll see how that goes single sheer on the front of the axle, then ill decide if its slee, hf, or front range.

im also going in do some "configuring" to see if i can raise that panhard and keep it full length.

Looking forward to see what you come up with. Going with crossover steering or y-link? I have y-link on mine and been meaning to try and convert to crossover but it will require some extra fabwork. Stay away from y-link steering if you can avoid it.

 

[Wermz]

no y-link. imagine a 3/4" bolt going through 2 heims on top of the stock steering arm. its pretty clear as i type this that that will be so much torsional/twisting leverage on that stock arm, especially after drilling it out to a 3/4" hole.. s***...

either one of those trucks you posted have build thread here?

 

[ajax1]

I believe slee did all this on the blueberry, 80 front axle with high steer arms, used the coil springs and radius arms from an 80

 

[Delta VS]

There's also finally a new player in the high steer knuckle game: FJ80 High Steer Knuckle Kit - https://frontrangeoffroadfab.com/fj80-high-steer-knuckle-kit/

Hellfires are great. I have the originals made by Billy before he sold the brand to RuffStuff. Nothing bad to say about 'em. One nice benefit is that you may never have to worry about loose knuckle studs every again since you no longer have any leverage on the lower trunion. Mine have been installed since 2015 and have never loosened up after lots of hard wheeling.

I personally had 2 buddies with the Slee high steer, both have since sold their rigs though. One was 3 linked on coilovers, the other was all stock suspension.

One important thing to keep in mind - obviously you know you'll need to raise and relocate the panhard. But if you're keeping the coil springs and not running coilovers, there is basically no room to raise the panhard. You can't raise it in its original position because of the coil springs and interference with the tierod/draglink. The only option is to shorten it by quite a bit and relocate it in between the coil spring and diff housing. This is not really ideal because of how short the panhard becomes, you want this as long as possible, ideally going to the very end of the axle. Doing high steer with coil springs becomes very difficult because of the space constraints.

Here is the one with Slee high steer/3link/coilovers. Notice how easy it is to raise and relocate the pandhard because of the coilovers.

My other buddy did Slee high steer but with stock coil springs and radius arms. You can see how short the panhard is. Because of the space taken up by the coil springs, this is really the only place where you could put a raised panhard.

Seems like every time high steer gets talked about, somebody will chime in and say it's worthless due to ending up with reverse Ackerman. Any real world insight on that? Long term issues, etc?

 

[Wermz]

These aint drift cars. If it happens at all, i dont see how it could be a big issue for a truck on 40 inch tires.

 

[Delta VS]

These aint drift cars. If it happens at all, i dont see how it could be a big issue for a truck on 40 inch tires.

That is usually the general consensus, I'm just looking for feedback from someone who is actually running the setup (a one @jcardona1)

 

[scottryana]

Seems like every time high steer gets talked about, somebody will chime in and say it's worthless due to ending up with reverse Ackerman. Any real world insight on that? Long term issues, etc?

I don't see how with the Slee setup it would change the ackerman angles since it is the same bottom arm at the same angle and you are still connecting to the bottom arm? But with some of the custom top mounted machined arms it might be different?

 

[jcardona1]

That is usually the general consensus, I'm just looking for feedback from someone who is actually running the setup (a one @jcardona1)

I'm not sure to be honest. So much of the truck's suspension and steering changed overnight, it's difficult to pinpoint anything. My truck is not daily driven but I have no complaints with the steering except for the y-link setup.

 

[jcardona1]

I believe slee did all this on the blueberry, 80 front axle with high steer arms, used the coil springs and radius arms from an 80

They did yes. But they're also using a custom-width 9.5" front axle and still located the panhard before the coil spring

 

[cruisermatt]

no y-link. imagine a 3/4" bolt going through 2 heims on top of the stock steering arm. its pretty clear as i type this that that will be so much torsional/twisting leverage on that stock arm, especially after drilling it out to a 3/4" hole.. s***...

either one of those trucks you posted have build thread here?

you’re going to want to do 5/8” bolts. 3/4” will leave very little material left in the steering and pitman arms.
I would definitely double sheer that passenger side double stacked heim. Not for the 5/8 bolt’s lifespan but for your steering knuckle studs.

 

[Wermz]

Ill wait for the ruff stuff parts i ordered show up, im buying slee arms too as it turns out. Once all the parts are here in my hands ill decide size bolts to use. I set a caliper at 3/4” the other day and set it on the unused end of the rhd arm around the hole, seems like there should be enough to meat to work with if i go double sheer with the slee stuff. I hadnt thought about the pitman arm yet. Ill have the truck on the lift soon to take some measurements. Ill be sure to take pictures and post my finding.

I ordered 7/8” heims, which use a 3/4” bolt, theres probably a spacer/insert to reduce bolt diameter to 5/8”. The slee hs arms are drilled to 5/8” anyway. All this high steer will lead me to hydro assist by the end of the year, im trying to get my steering beefed up before the power of a ram gets involved.

 

[bwakeling]

Are the Front Range knuckles actually available now?

 

[SNLC]

Back in the day (about 2014) I converted my v8 80 to crossover steering.

I used the y-link, a RHD arm and the SLEE high steer arm. On the y-link I used the offset tres. I did nothing else besides a cut & turn to set caster where I wanted.

I drove it like this for awhile including a three week trip down to Baja. I found hard wheeling such as high speed in the sand dunes when it compressed super hard and to max on the RHS (panhard mount side) the panhard would come into contact with the tie rod. I felt this is dangerous so since this time I have told everyone you can not do a crossover steering conversion safely on an 80-series without relocating the panhard mount on the axle.

Everything Jose says is spot on and true as well.

An FYI, 70-series steering box sits forward of the front axle and swings back with the pitman arm. Opposite an 80-series. This will not just fix the issue but it may help.

Cheers

 

[Broski]

Are the Front Range knuckles actually available now?

Yep, was at my friends shop yesterday and he has a set for a 80 axle he is building for his Forrunner they look sweet!!

 

[azngarage]

Last year, i shear 2 of the lower bolt on the right knuckle for the 2nd time so i decide to change to crossover steering setup. My plan is to run the hydro assist for now and later change to 3 links/coilover when my boss permit the funding. Hell fire was no where to be found so i end up buying the Slee arms. Before Slee update their website, I thought i was paying 300 for the 2 arms. However when i received only 1 arms and that when i know i screwed up. End up paying almost 700 for the 2 arms, it was a bitter pill to swallow. Anyway i press on and try to make it work. But then i found out that it's not going to work without relocate both of the panhard bar bracket on the axle and on the frame side. The steering tierod come in contact with the panhard bar at full steering lock and the tierod contact the panhard bracket on the frame side at full compression. So now i decide to 3 link it since im gonna end up cutting everything anyway. The hard part now it to ask the big boss for funding without her bring up the D-paper.

 

[Broski]

Last year, i shear 2 of the lower bolt on the right knuckle for the 2nd time so i decide to change to crossover steering setup. My plan is to run the hydro assist for now and later change to 3 links/coilover when my boss permit the funding. Hell fire was no where to be found so i end up buying the Slee arms. Before Slee update their website, I thought i was paying 300 for the 2 arms. However when i received only 1 arms and that when i know i screwed up. End up paying almost 700 for the 2 arms, it was a bitter pill to swallow. Anyway i press on and try to make it work. But then i found out that it's not going to work without relocate both of the panhard bar bracket on the axle and on the frame side. The steering tierod come in contact with the panhard bar at full steering lock and the tierod contact the panhard bracket on the frame side at full compression. So now i decide to 3 link it since im gonna end up cutting everything anyway. The hard part now it to ask the big boss for funding without her bring up the D-paper.

Sounds like you headed down a deep hole. Don't ask for permission, Just order the parts and beg for forgiveness