1984 Toyota Camry / Vista with 1.8l turbo diesel 1C

[Mike NXP]

Waiting on the new idler / tensioner assembly to show up. But in the meantime the service manual showed up.

If anyone out there needs information on the 1c feel free to ask.

427psi compression lol wow that's cool I had no idea diesel motors runs those types of numbers

 

[duncanrm]

Waiting on the new idler / tensioner assembly to show up. But in the meantime the service manual showed up.

Cool that you have the manual! I dont suppose you've managed to find a PDF of it have you?

 

[Mike NXP]

Negative, I think I got the owners manual on manualslib but can't find the service manual anywhere, so I was happy to find something with info on the 1C motor

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

Waiting on the new idler / tensioner assembly to show up. But in the meantime the service manual showed up.

If anyone out there needs information on the 1c feel free to ask.

427psi compression lol wow that's cool I had no idea diesel motors runs those types of numbers

View attachment 3751246

View attachment 3751247

Yep, the compression ratio is probably something like 22:1, so about 2.5 to 3 times that of contemporaneous petrol engines... hence the tractor noise

 

[Dougal]

Heres some diesel porn for all you sick bastards. Hows she sound ?

To me that sounds over-advanced. Advancing the injection timing gives you easier starting, better fuel economy and crisper response. It also greatly increases mechanical loads inside the engine, delays turbo spool and sounds noisier.
Risks are breaking cranks, pistons and head-gaskets.

I wonder if the previous owner tweaked it up a bit.

 

[Mike NXP]

To me that sounds over-advanced. Advancing the injection timing gives you easier starting, better fuel economy and crisper response. It also greatly increases mechanical loads inside the engine, delays turbo spool and sounds noisier.
Risks are breaking cranks, pistons and head-gaskets.

I wonder if the previous owner tweaked it up a bit.

Hmm interesting. Beats me, it's weird to have like nothing to compare this with so I'm not sure what's normal. I will say it seems to have plenty of power and I don't have any current doubts of performance issues.
>>I'll take another video with a better camera after warm up, and will increase the rpms a bit to see what you think.


I do feel like maybe I'm burning a bit too much fuel but haven't done enough drives to compare. I think running at 65-70 is a decent difference in fuel consumption compared to 55-60.

I don't suspect the person before me had any desire to advance the timing unless it was done accidently during alleged rebuild

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Shoot, I'm so close to the upper timing belt cover since I have my idler tensioner bracket removed.... I'm tempted to take it off and inspect the belt. Maybe I don't even need to worry as much about replacing it if I could get my eyes on it and see how it looks.

I wonder what else I need to do to allow the upper cover to come off. I see a few bolts and clips, that might be it.

Going to look closer at it later today. On the flipside, the other half of my brain is saying just button it up, drive it, and enjoy

 

[AirheadNut]

Usually upper timing belt covers come off pretty easily. On the 2L-TE and 1HD-T it is just a few little bolts or clips and it will pop right off. All the VW’s I’ve had just use a few clips to hold on the upper cover. Inspection can be done in a minute or less.

 

[Mike NXP]

Usually upper timing belt covers come off pretty easily. On the 2L-TE and 1HD-T it is just a few little bolts or clips and it will pop right off. All the VW’s I’ve had just use a few clips to hold on the upper cover. Inspection can be done in a minute or less.

OK cool.

The service manual described removing the PS pump, AC pulley and Alternator , then the timing cover .... BUT I'm in the timing belt replacement procedure section so maybe since that has to get done eventually, they list it first

I haven't had my eyes under the hood in a few days, I'll have to get back out there and take a closer look .. but you're right I think it's pretty easy to get at especially since I have belts and bracket removed. . It'd be nice to see a semi-fresh belt so I can divert maintenance time / money to other stuff like shocks / sloppy shifter

 

[Mike NXP]

This is as far in as in can comfortably go. Probably need to move wire harness or engine mount to get cover completely out. Sort of a waste of time since I can't see much ... I think I'll continue to keep timing belt swap on the to-do list for now then again I don't want to introduce other problems while diving in

 

[TheBussman]

Inspecting a belt will only tell if it its for sure bad. A number of the failed belts I've seen looked fine from the outside but all the teeth stripped off of the inside. not much cracking either.

 

[Mike NXP]

For sure, I learned pretty quickly there wasn't much to be seen unless I could fully remove the cover. I'm going to button it back up and ignore it all for a bit longer...

Now I'm starting to wonder what I may have screwed up when I cut that idler adjustment bolt out of the tensioner bracket a few days ago.....

*** Edit, after closer inspection I'm pretty sure I'm an idiot. Well I'm definitely sure of that but I think the bolt and welded washer thing I hacked up was OEM and it was just a matter of pivoting the bolt the right way to wiggle it out of the bracket. Instead the inner-ape in me just starting ripping and tearing at it when it didn't come out right away lol

Long story short, I could re-use it if I really had to but still curious to see what aftermarket part will show up.



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Part on order. Shows splined pulley + no stopper thing on the adjustment bolt so who knows.
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Something needs to hold the bolt in the bracket or else nothing would keep tension against the adjustment.
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I see other examples from different vehicles show like a jam nut on the backside, I suppose that will be a good solution if I don't end up re-using the original that I bashed on
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[Mike NXP]

Latest update from the world of old brown Camry

So the replacement idler tensioner assembly showed up, it was too small and the pulley was splined ( supposed to be smooth )

I reinstalled the original and reflected on the waste of two weeks I spent chasing a problem that didn't exist.


Anyway , to make matters worse the belt squeal is still there and it's really annoying. It's a new belt , but I might replace it again because I'm an idiot

*** Can someone confirm , if a belt is squealing and you spray water on the ripped side of the belt and the squeal goes away , doesn't that means the belt / tension / alignment is too blame?

Or another way to ask that , if spraying water makes the noise go away I can at least confirm the pulley / bearings aren't at fault , since water on belt wouldn't silence that noise ?

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

I mentioned in an earlier post that the wear marks on your timing belt case may suggest a damaged harmonic balancer (crank pulley). Have you ascertained that the pulley runs perfectly true (by eye or with a dial gauge if you can set it up in there)?

 

[Mike NXP]

I mentioned in an earlier post that the wear marks on your timing belt case may suggest a damaged harmonic balancer (crank pulley). Have you ascertained that the pulley runs perfectly true (by eye or with a dial gauge if you can set it up in there)?

Thanks for the input . I think I narrowed down the belt rubbing on the timing cover issue to be caused by the cover not being fully seated.

As of now, there is visible space between the belt and cover. I don't have any tools for checking belt alignment , but if going by eye, it looks to be running straight and not rubbing anymore

I did notice a small chip / crack on the outside edge of the crank pulley. It doesn't seem to be a concern at this point but I will try to photo


I was hoping that spraying water on the belt and silencing the squeal would help me narrow it down to a tension / belt issue . I thought ,maybe it got greasy or dirty when removing so I was sure to clean it all up

It's so weird that it was silent as night when I went for test drive and bought it , about an hour into my drive home it started crying out for help

I'm out of ideas so now I'll just throw some parts at it starting with another new belt

 

[Mike NXP]

I've noticed that the parts diagram also shows a ribbed pulley for the tensioner / idler... mine is definitely smooth and based on the belt diagram it seems like it has to be smooth

It's also weird that is shows a second pulley in this image. The tensioner bracket only has the one idler attached and it slides in that slot .

I've got to try and make sense of the proper OEM part number for the smooth pulley / tensioner setup that im working with

 

[Mike NXP]

I ended up putting a tape measure to the belt and was measuring about 1" of wiggle at the longest point. I snugged it up to about 1/2" and the squeal is gone for now but I need to drive a bit more to know if it'll come back or not. hopefully not



The mystery of what part actually belongs there is sort of confusing me.... Google found a picture of the OEM part and sure enough it shows a grooved pulley too, just like the replacement I received. This doesn't make sense, even if I didn't have AC the belt routing diagram still shows that it would be on the idler should ride along the flat side of the belt..... I think

 

[Mike NXP]

Ah s***, I knew it was to good to be true. The belt noise is back.. Best to describe this as a chirp, not a squeal.

If something was misaligned, wouldn't the chirp be consistent? The drive in the morning was silent, just fired it up for the drive home and she's chrip chirp chirping away.

I tried to tighten it a bit more. No difference and felt too tight. Backed off a bit more, no difference still chirping. Squirt some water on ribbed side of belt and it goes silent.

I will throw another belt at it and hope the belt is too blame and it's not a misalignment / pulley issue as mentioned earlier.

I also just noticed the belt is riding ever so slightly off the edge of the idler , something is funky with this tensioner setup. I got the belt to ride straight on the idler again but the chirp did not go away.


This s*** is so annoying

 

[TheBussman]

belts that have been run too loose for a time can sometimes always squeak once they've started they get glazed up and shiny. I'm going to guess that Toyota decided to use a ribbed pulley because they already had a part number for one and they didn't want to make a new part just for that when a ribbed one would also be fine the on the back of the belt. I've seen it done before as a bush fix for other engines and it worked fine, just put some little marks on the back of the belt but didn't hurt anything. I may have missed it but did you already replace the belts with good quality ones? Sometimes some brands of belts will always make noise on some motors even if everything is perfect. Toyota, Bando, Mitsuboshi would be good.

 

[Mike NXP]

belts that have been run too loose for a time can sometimes always squeak once they've started they get glazed up and shiny. I'm going to guess that Toyota decided to use a ribbed pulley because they already had a part number for one and they didn't want to make a new part just for that when a ribbed one would also be fine the on the back of the belt. I've seen it done before as a bush fix for other engines and it worked fine, just put some little marks on the back of the belt but didn't hurt anything. I may have missed it but did you already replace the belts with good quality ones? Sometimes some brands of belts will always make noise on some motors even if everything is perfect. Toyota, Bando, Mitsuboshi would be good.

Good info , thanks. For now I'm hoping to just make due with the current tensioner setup . I do believe the belt is too blame here .

Alternator belt was replaced with a Gates v belt . Tensioned up and has been good to go

Power steering and AC belt was replaced with a Continental belt.... It was intermittently chirping and would sometimes go silent... . I also just noticed today they sold me a belt that was 20mm shorter than OEM so maybe that's a factor but idk


Today I removed the Continental belt and put another Gates (Napa) belt and that seemingly solved the problem but I need more test runs.


I can't believe how hard is it to find some parts for this motor. I thought I'd be able to find a spare idler bracket , pulley , tensioner and other random bits but not much out there that I can find...there is definitely something suspicious about this tensioner assembly but for now life goes on.

 

[Eurasiaoverland]

Let's have a look through the EPC for your model.

If we look at the AC pump bracket and tensioner details, we see that the bracket, pulley and idler are all labelled with the conditional 'W/O POWER STEERING'. This can means that these parts are only found on vehicles without power steering. Your vehicle does have power steering from factory, which means that these three parts are not used on your vehicle. So that solves the issue with the two idlers.

If we look at the power steering parts diagram, we see a single tensioner with an adjuster. My guess is that the welded on nut was a repair due to someone breaking off the casting which holds the flanged tensioner bolt.

Finally, the V-belt diagram. Here I am not sure, but it suggests that your belt is 99365-51210 (Toyota refer to the PAS pump as a 'vane pump') as your vehicle has a cooler (AC). This is a 5-row belt. There is only a separate AC belt in the case that you do not have power steering - there should be a single belt driving both the PAS pump and AC compressor. I would ignore the double idler setup shown in the diagram. I am mystified by the N/A on the alternator belt, unless the diagram is totally wrong and you have a single drive belt for alternator, PAS pump and AC compressor (which I don't believe is the case, but please confirm).

Maybe not much help fixing your problem, but hopefully this makes it clear what you should expect to find on your engine.